I sometimes have a hard time letting things go. When I was in the Edmonton Roto League my obsession with pitching ruined many a picnic or sunny day. I'd be sitting there, watching my children play and the beautiful surroundings, thinking how great life has been for me.
And then Darren ("honey, he got lit up like a Christmas tree!") Holmes latest outing or Darren Driefort's latest injury or Chris Hammond in Denver would enter my mind and I'd be in a foul mood for hours. I left the ERL for that reason. Well, that and I don't play well with others (I apparently liked to change the rules).
--
Lately, I've been thinking too much about the Oilers blue. I can't make Barker, Sutton> Foster, Vandermerr, Strudwick--and that's saying something! I think the Oilers cashed three veteran underachievers for a question mark and a third pairing enforcer. Either they're banking on a healthy Whitney and big steps forward for Peckham, Smid and Petry, or there's another bullet in the chamber.
Via free agency, Scott Hannan is still available. He's a veteran, would probably require an overpay and perhaps a longer term. It doesn't make sense for the Oilers to tie up huge dollars on a stay-at-home type, certainly not long term.
However, is anyone else tempted? I mean, wouldn't it be nice to have one more defenseman?
There is a trade in the works - forwards for defense - at least that is Tambellini's goal. We will see if he can get it done.
ReplyDeleteLT: If your hangup is Scott Hannan, mine is Jason Arnott. We're likely both to be disappointed.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteFor sure somethings gonna happen LT, but I think as bookie says its gonna be trade. As much as I hate to see it happen*, one of Gagner and Cogliano is a goner and maybe a good prospect for a Top 3 D-man, imo. They have to get their contract numbers down, even if they do send RNH and Marincin back to junior.
ReplyDelete*I really don't want to get rid of Gagner or Cogliano as they are finally going to be surrounded by at least decent players (Gagner especially plays well with veterans). Plus Belanger should be able to drag their FO% up towards 50% (apparently he did wonders for Turris in Phoenix). Those two may not be the centre-pieces to the team we once though they would be (still time at least for Gagner though), but they'd be damn fine complimentary players on any team.
EasyOil
Hannan must be wanting large dollars to remain unsigned.Mike Commodore has been signed already by Detroit.
ReplyDeleteHannan is too good a player to be sitting here playing the waiting game
Hockeyguy: the other possibility is that he's looking to go to a contender, yet doesn't want to take too much of a discount. He may be waiting for the last couple good teams to get desperate.
ReplyDeleteWhy do I have a bad feeling that Komisarek is going to land in Edmonton?
ReplyDeleteSomeone suggested a trade in which the Oilers got Komisarek and the Leafs got Khabby.
My problem contract for yours.
Komisarek runs a $4.5MM cap for the next 3 years, Khabby $3.75MM for the next two.
In the last 2 years of his contract Komisarek actually makes $3.5MM, so may be trade-able to a floor team (big maybe).
Wouldn't really help the Oilers. He struggled playing 2nd and 3rd pairing last couple years and the Oilers already have 4 bottom pairing Dmen by my count, 5 if you include Chorney.
Sekera from BUF is a better bet if they can get him.
Woodguy: I've been thinking about Sekera since Zona identified him in a post. The question is, what package would be required to get him out of Buffalo?
ReplyDeleteAlternatively, if he's clearly a good option, maybe an offer sheet could be worthwhile. Buffalo cannot afford to match (it's really strange seeing them with the largest payroll).
I still believe Cogliano, Peckham and a pick could bring in a defenseman to play with Whitney or Gilbert.
ReplyDeleteHey LT,
ReplyDeleteI read your post on OilersNation yesterday and like you I have been spending way too much energy thinking about the Oiler's blue. I actually found myself falling asleep last night with various trade ideas bouncing around in my head!
I agree with you that Hannan could be a good fit.
Going back to Washington - it really looks like they could get rid of another defenseman, especially one with some salary. What do you think about Wideman? He's a pending UFA, so wouldn't cost too much. What do you expect it would cost? Cogliano + 2nd?
Thanks!
Cactus:Good point,never thought of that angle.
ReplyDeleteCan we assume he turned down whatever the Caps offered?They did go sign Hamrlik.
I don't like that Komisarek trade idea. To rid ourselves of Khabiboulin, we'd be better off buying him out at 2/3. Spend $2MM on a legit goaltender and your total outlay is about $4.5MM on goaltending. Same number as Komisarek's contract without having to take on Komisarek.
ReplyDeleteI like the math but doubt it would happen.
I still believe Cogliano, Peckham and a pick could bring in a defenseman to play with Whitney or Gilbert.
ReplyDeleteHow many years under contract would you require the Dman to be to pull the trigger?
I don't like that Komisarek trade idea. To rid ourselves of Khabiboulin, we'd be better off buying him out at 2/3.
ReplyDeleteIts a +35 contract. The cap hit is stuck to the Oilers for the next 2 years.
Forgot about that 35+ business. Damn.
ReplyDeleteCan't polish a turd. What a horrible signing that was. We're screwed.
To me, Hannan is worth a 2-year overpay or a 5 year reasonable-pay contract. I'm not sure that I feel as tempted as you LT for a long-term overpay... at least, not while we're still paying Souray's buyout.
ReplyDeleteKomisarek is an interesting guy. He was rock solid in Montreal and then goes to Toronto and falls off the map. Ron Wilson's been the coach for the Leafs since he's been there... I wonder if it isn't a coaching thing... maybe a different coach would let Komisarek regain his form.
Then again... we've already got Barker, do we really want to collect EVERY other team's question mark?
Barker, Peckham, Smid, Petry... 2 of those 4 need to step up and be solid top 4 defenders for this team to have a shot at non-lottery. If we add Komisarek, then it's 2 of those 5... it improves the odds, but no guarantees. Hannan would be the guarantee.
Would you guys go for this?
ReplyDeleteCogliano + Plante
for
Wideman
Washington is now the first team this offseason to officially place their heads in the cap noose:
ReplyDeleteAccording to Gord Miller, Brouwer just signed a 2 year deal with the Caps worth $2.35M per, which would place them about $1.6M over the cap with a full roster. Alzner's not signed either.
They've got too many defencemen and they must shed payroll. Might be worth making a pitch for Wideman using only draft picks. They don't have a 1st next year, so even a 2nd or 3rd should be valuable to them, perhaps with a middle-ranked prospect.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI'm with you LT. I keep fantasizing about scamming Alzner out of WAS. They have mad cap problems. I know Ovi is a top tier player but a $9.5M cap hit is insane.
ReplyDeleteThe reason I thought of Plante is because he was paired with Alzner in Calgary in the WHL. Also, I think it is a little early to call him a bust, as he is only 22.
ReplyDeleteFair points regarding Cogliano.
From the Oiler's point of view being near 50 contracts, they need to include some contracts in any deal for a defenseman.
With Washington in that kind of cap trouble it is time for someone to step up and offersheet Alzner.Even if it isn't the Oilers.Too much collusion right now.Stamkos and Doughty remain unsigned too.
ReplyDeleteI like Alzner too, but that won't solve Washington's cap issues. Plus, he would cost a lot more than Wideman and we need a right-handed defenseman badly.
ReplyDeleteShau_co: contracts can be dumped for draft picks if need be. It's far more important to secure a top 4 defenceman than it is to make someone take Cogliano.
ReplyDeleteShau: Offersheet would probably cost us next to nothing.
ReplyDeleteAs for Komisarek the reason he was good in MTL, was because he was Markov's pylon. When he got traumatised by Lucic he never again was useful.
Cactus:
ReplyDeleteGood point regarding contracts.
Don't get me wrong, I would still be very happy to see Wideman come over for pick(s)
LT, are your trade predictions actually predictions or are you just pleading to the aether in making them? I ask because the rate that they make sense is far higher than the rate that they come to fruition. And in this case, at least, probably not worth fretting over since its likely things are not over. It may help your agitated soul to contemplate that other teams don't appear to be finished: the music hasn't stopped yet.
ReplyDeletePlus, fretting over the holes in a team that is intent on getting a good draft pick again? Really? How do you reconcile the trades before the 06 run and the way they've constructed the D the last few years? Amnesia, purpose or incompetence?
If the Oilers are more about the latter, could they be comparing their defence against Sharks last year? Something like:
Boyle -> Whitney
Vlasic -> Gilbert
Demers -> Petry ES + Barker PP
Murray -> Smid
Wallin -> Peckham
Huskins -> Barker ES/PK
However, with the Belanger signing, turfing Jacques, and trying to trade Brule, I'm hopeful that they are starting to remember, changing purpose, and engaging incompetence. Just trying to ease your mind here.
The hope helps keep interest up. I pay for it later with disappointment and disillusionment. I still like that deal.
was probably looking to get rid of semin.
ReplyDeleteI agree that a trade (forward(s) for Dman)is in the works. And I do think that TML will be the trading partner. They have too many Dmen.I wonder if Gagner for Luke Schenn could happen.
ReplyDelete@cactus They don't have a 1st next year, so even a 2nd or 3rd should be valuable to them, perhaps with a middle-ranked prospect.
ReplyDeleteThey have Colorado's first, no?
oilswell, the welcome voice of reason. I'll tell my brain, but it rarely listens. :-)
ReplyDeleteEd:
ReplyDeleteI think Was is looking to move a defensman, as with the Hamrlik signing they have too many.
Green, Carlson, Alzner, Wideman, Hamrlik, Poti, Schultz, Erskine
That's 8 serviceable NHL defensmen
Agree, Washington will probably get out of trouble by dealing Semin for a smaller contract up front.
ReplyDeleteAlso, McPhee alluded to Poti having some injury troubles late last year which could be career threatening. Possible LTIR solution there as well.
I'm still hoping that there is some truth to the Mike Green rumor that someone put out there a while ago.
ReplyDeleteOilswell: it seems I forgot about that magnificent deal (for Washington). Probably hard to remember because it should never have happened. Thanks.
ReplyDeleteOf course, that doesn't change the fact that Washington is over the cap, has a full roster of players and will not be looking to get much salary back in any deal. They'll want at least a little flexibility at the trade deadline.
Ed: The Caps might move Semin, but the return would have to be significant. Not sure who would step up to make that deal.
Mike Green might actually make sense considering the tweet I just recieved. capgeek CapGeek
ReplyDelete#NHL #Capitals are about $3.33m away from the off-season cap of $70.73m, according to our estimates. Lots of time to sort things out.
1 minute ago
Hannan was near the top of my list of UFA targets going into the offseason, and nothing Tambellini has done so far has made me think we need him any less.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, everything Tambellini has done so far has me thinking Hannan isn't even on the radar. I remember wanting the Oil to sing him pretty badly the last time he was a free agent (and he took his sweet ass time makeing a decision that year too) only to be disapointed.
The best thing about Hannan is that not only can he fill a role that needs filling (vetran defensive to p4 defenseman who can kill penalties), but it seems that he really has had a lot of success playing with young defense partners who always seem to have career years when he's paired with them. Both in San Jose and Colorado.
Whitney-Wideman
ReplyDeleteGilbert-Smid
Peckham-Petry/Barker/Sutton/Chorney
I'd dearly love to see that for the starting lineup.
Wonder what package Washington would take for him. Still can't believe they got him from Florida for a 3rd round pick and an ECHLer. That screams tank as loudly as anything Tambellini has done or failed to do with the Oil; Tallon is completely off the wall.
Oh, and I also like that he can play both RD and LD, which is more rare than you'd think
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure Poti is severely injured; no? The Caps might be banking on his LTIR?
ReplyDeleteThat said, even if he can't play all year they would still be right at the cap with no Alzner.
One of Semin or Green looks like they're in play.
For what it's worth, I've seen a few twitter/blog references that Jeff Schultz is the one who might be available from Washington's blue.
ReplyDeleteHannan would really tighten this defense, but I've only seen him on the left side. Who of Smid, Whitney, Hannan and Barker moves to the right side?
ReplyDeleteAdding Hannan gives this team enough depth to handle some injuries and still be competitive. However, Tambi should find out now what Hemsky and Smyth are going to want to reup for their next contracts before moving on Hannan.
At Hannan's age front loading a four year contract might work so he is tradeable to a floor team in a couple years when the Oilers may need the cap space.
Would anybody give up 2012 1st round pick and Gagner for Mike Green? I would.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you uni, that D lineup looks a lot better than we have seen around here in a few years.
ReplyDeleteDan:
ReplyDeleteI would rather give up a lot less than that to land Wideman instead of Green...
I've heard the Poti LTIR rumour as well, apparently he has a shredded groin.
ReplyDeleteBut even if they "Sweet Lou" Poti and put him on LTIR for the year, they've only got 1.1M left to sign Alzner, which wont get it done.
OT - Eberle was on Calgary radio this morning as he is playing in the Mike Green charity golf tournament in town. He apparently spends his off seasons here working out with Green, one can only hope he's selling Green on the virtues of playing for Edmonton....
I think you could get a much healthier/complete defenseman than Mike Green for Gagner and the 2012 1st.
ReplyDeleteA big no to Hannan. Come on guys, we've all seen him play a bunch, we can do much better than that guy. He's one of these names that sticks around for whatever reason even though he's not very good. No excuse for such low numbers even when you're a "stay-at-home". Need to be able to move the puck.
ReplyDeletePDO - Which possible Norris trophy winner are you referring to? Green's one, so you must think we can grab another.
ReplyDeleteHow much trouble is Nashville having with Suter and Weber?
ReplyDeleteFlorida with Gudbrandson?
That 2012 1st is a huge chip. Green is one dimensional (albeit, a helluva dimension) and has legitimate injury concerns.
It's also completely possible that Yandle is still in play.
So.. there's 4.
If you think the Oilers' defence is keeping you awake now, just wait till you see them play.
ReplyDeletePDO:
ReplyDeleteI agree with Suter, but how much trouble can you really have in Weber. He's RFA. Should not be any real issue in extending him.
Dan, the same should be true with Doughty and Stamkos, yet they're not signed. That's what comes from RFAs seeking $6-7M per.
ReplyDeleteWould anybody give up 2012 1st round pick and Gagner for Mike Green? I would.
ReplyDeleteThe pretend Oilers team that you were hired to GM regrets to inform you that you have been fired.
The team has decided to do it now rather than have you suffer the embarassment and death threats that will arise from sitting through the first day of the draft without a pick and watching WSH use your first overall pick to pick a generational talent.
We came to this conclusion after watching the stupidity of the real GM of the Colorado Avalanche make that ridiculous Varlamov trade and recalling the Kessel fiasco.
I got your back coach-Cogliano and Peckham should get you something nice.
ReplyDelete@ PDO:
ReplyDeleteGood point about Nashville. They are not on the same page as Weber on a contract.
They want him on a long-term contract and according to a pretty reliable report, Weber wants a shorter term deal so he can test free-agency.
Given that, how much would you have to give up to get him - and is it worth it knowing he'd only play for 2 years before he tests the market?
Know that Nashville's issue are a legit scoring option (like we have a lot of those guys in the system or on the roster) and a young, hi quality defenseman to take his place (another area we have a lot of spare talent).
And value contracts are essential because of their cap situation (not able to spend to it).
My sense is Suter and Rinne are the most important pieces moving forward if Nashville has to choose.
Ducey:
ReplyDeleteI would rather have a young proven quality #1/2 NHL D-man than the potential to eventually end up with one three to four years down the road. Drafting D-men in lottery spots is no slam dunk ie: Johnson/Barker.
To answer LT's question, maybe let Souray play?
ReplyDeleteI think Souray intends to play for Dallas.
ReplyDeleteI'd trade Gagner, Petry and a 2nd in 2012 to get Green. If they have a contract that they just want to dump, I'd take that as well to make it work.
ReplyDeleteI would rather have a young proven quality #1/2 NHL D-man than the potential to eventually end up with one three to four years down the road. Drafting D-men in lottery spots is no slam dunk ie: Johnson/Barker.
ReplyDeleteWell, you get Green for two years during which time the rest of your team is still in diapers. In two years, guys like Hall are going to need new contracts and Green is going to go UFA.
Have you not had enough of the Erik Cole/ Joni Pitkanen/ Vishnovsky/ Sheldon Souray etc? Going after the big contract does not work in this market.
Plus, the timing just is not right. Green is going to walk/ become too expensive right when this team is on the upswing.
I'd much rather wait until the deadline and see if we can pry loose a young stud D man loose for one of our vets. At that time teams going for it are more likely to let a young player go.
Ducey:
ReplyDeleteGreen has one year left on his current contract, then becomes RFA. I think that is the perfect timing.
Nice comments from Smytty on TSN this morning.
ReplyDelete"Cut me open and I'd probably bleed Oiler blue."
It's always great when you hear guys like Mess, Lowe and Smyth talk about what the Oilers mean them personally.
On a separate note, it is a bit galling to hear him repeat that "he never wanted to leave in the first place." Both sides have to accept their part in not reaching an agreement. You didn't take their offer Ryan. That was your decision and no one else's. Deal with it.
Mike Green is a head case. He's definitely got 'buyer beware' potential.
ReplyDeleteDan, he has one year of RFA where you can control him and then he is gone. Thats 2 years.
ReplyDeleteI don't see anything perfect about that.
Too bad GMs in hockey are dumb as hell because I think there is a great opportunity for the Caps-Oil-Leafs to work out a three way trade that could make everyone happy.
ReplyDeleteThe skeleton of the deal would be something like.
Oilers get: Dmen
Caps Get: Cap Relief, picks, a lesser Semin replacement (Gagner)
Leafs get: Semin
As for Roto leagues. 95% of my teams become ravaged by injury or have career worst seasons. I actually thought it might be a good idea to write athletes telling them to send me money in exchange for not picking them.
My baseball team has like 7 guys on the DL.
Oiler current D situation is disconcerting for sure. Looks like ST took the shotgun approach vs using a scoped rifle.
ReplyDeleteBarker and Sutton as additions is putting a lot of faith/hope in Barker and subs pylon for pylon in Sutton's case. Doesn't look any better than last years fiasco and might be even worse. Maybe they're looking for a RH forward that can play the point on the PP while unloading a couple of contracts in the process?
The current contract numbers are whacked, Cogliano and Brule are square pegs, while Omark or Gagner are somewhat borderline but carry some cachet. Something has to give. Could ST be grinding it out on a multiplayer swap trying to unload two flotsam pieces, (Cogs and Creme de), knowing he probably has to sweeten the offer to include one of the other two?
Washington and Buffalo would seem like obvious trade partners. If Poti is hurting like some say that alleviates Wsh having to make a move on D and their $$ dump probably comes from up front. Buff has 8 D ready to go with Gragnani looking NHL ready in the playoffs.
I'd chuckle if the Oil gave Buff a little "sorry about 3 years ago" payback and took Kotalik's $3M one year contract off their hands along with Sekeras. Good hilarity but it would give them a RH shot they could use on the PP for a year and a beer buddy for Hemsky . Or maybe the fact i just threw up in my mouth a little means I shouldn't have taken the time to type this paragraph.
Would sure be nice to know what Hemsky's take on his future in Edm is. Any hesitation on his part gets this ball rolling quickly and the Q's at D answered.
I am not as big on Mike Green either. Don't get me wrong I like him a lot, but I wouldn't want to give up a lot for him.
ReplyDeleteI would ratehr grab a short term option now like Wideman and try to sign a top guy like Weber next year.
One has to think that Cogs/Gags/Hemsky/Khabby/Brule/Horcoff are all in play for 1) a starting netminder 2) a top 4 defenseman.
ReplyDeleteTo be fair, Khabby, Brule and Horcoff have negative value so that leaves us with teams looking for inconsistent or oft injured offensive talent. Good luck with that Tambi.
Amazing what a difference it makes being able to acquire good players when you're a cup contender. Tambi would give Joey Moss' left nut to get Vokoun on the terms that Washington did.
SB: Haha. Semin would get out of Toronto in a hurry.
ReplyDeleteDucey: You're so pessimist it stinks.
Nobody believes me but Mike Green isn't a one dimensional albeit a hell of a dimension defensmen. (To steal LT's bit on Ryan Murphy)
ReplyDeleteThe guy can hit. In his Blades days I remember him more as a punishing open ice hitter then I do for his offense (although that was good too)
He can get dirty in the corners. He can muck, he can fight. He has all the tools to be a complete defenseman.
I enjoy watching the Caps and Green was more committed to the defensive side of the game (along with the rest of the team) If I recall correctly there was a stretch last season where Green won player of the week. He was finally healthy and he was doing it all on the ice. Then the concussion and the rest of the year was a write off.
So why does Green have this stigma of being a soft offensive defenseman? Comes with who he played with back when Boudreau's entire strategy was letting Ovechkin play as much as he wanted and do whatever he wanted. Everyone was offense first. The dirty work of a defenseman is hard on the body and if nobody is demanding it of you. Why do it?
I'm not saying the Oilers should get Mike Green based on his soon to be UFA status and potential for injury.
But we're not getting a Sandis Ozolinsh or a richman's Andy Delmore here.
SB: Haha. Semin would get out of Toronto in a hurry.
ReplyDeleteHe might but Burke's hubris knows no bounds and he'll probably figure he can get the guy to commit.
Plus I have heard over the past few seasons that the Leafs are very interested in Alex Semin.
Based on that I still contend there is a foundation for a three way there.
SB: I think Green isn't that soft too.
ReplyDeleteI think he looks soft because none of the caps apart from Johansson this year are all 6''1 +.
He had a 100 hits, and 109 blocked shots.
That's more hits than Gilbert and more blocked shots than Vandermeer.
The only time he played the toughs he went out with something like +1,00 per 60.
Oh and Lidstrom's soft.
I've never liked Hannan. He's a very sloppy hockey player.
ReplyDeleteHe does seem to be somewhat effective, though. Hmm...
Ducey said...The pretend Oilers team that you were hired to GM regrets to inform you that you have been fired
ReplyDeleteI trust your cheque to cover my new keyboard is in the mail
belessa reality vs my expectations on any ST D move
I think the best option might be to load up huge at F to the point our D and G never have to touch the puck.
ReplyDeleteThis solution brought to you by the Wile E Coyote/Acme D solutions company
As the reigning president of the "Sign Hannan Fan Club", I am very excited you have decided to join us LT.
ReplyDeleteBased on the minutes we have from the last meeting, our membership currently sits at 2.
I suspect also think that a reasonable overpay (10-15%) for 1-2 years makes a lot of sense. Anything more than 5M seems a huge reach, and any term more than 2 years could make it a huge overpay.
Honestly, I like the 1 year deal overpay (maybe as much as 5.5M) and if he works well and we are playoff bound, great. If not, he's a 1 year player, he makes a boatload, and we can trade him at the deadline for something, and he can see what he can get next year as a FA as well.
Still gives us too many contracts, but I honestly don't care enough about Chorney et. all. At this point, they are warm bodies - nothing more. If you get a 7th for him, great. Regardless, its one less contract, and one less d-man suspect who needs to be sheltered in the pros.
All this Mike Green talk had me go to Youtube and check out his NHL record goal scoring streak.
ReplyDeleteLook at the Caps powerplay and tell me you don't see guys like RNH and Hemmer finding Green like Ovy does.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjeQP57eipM&feature=related
Damn...Arnott to the Blues.
ReplyDeleteArnott is a good fit for the Blues. They need to make the playoffs in a bad way.
ReplyDeleteBrent Sopel. RH Dman.
ReplyDeleteFree Agent born in Calgary. Good shot blocker.
Have to get rid of contracts thought, so it will more likely be a trade.
Backes-Mcdonald-Stewart
ReplyDeleteOshie-Arnott-Perron
Steen-Berglund-D'agostini
God damn. With Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk on the rise.
Blues will potentially go after the same guys as the Oil.
They have Vladimir Sobotka to spare.
Blues added Langenbrunner too.
ReplyDeleteThey want to make playoffs.
I really enjoyed this quote from Barker in the Gregor article on ON:
ReplyDeleteWhat position does Barker like to play on the powerplay?
"It doesn't really matter," said Barker. "A good powerplay doesn't really have set spots all the time. When you look at teams that have solid powerplays you see that guys are constantly moving around.
I'm pretty sure none of our PP coaches of the past 10 years got that memo.
@ Woodguy
ReplyDeleteEverybody wants to make the playoffs - some GMs just know better than to think that they can now, and rather tahn trying to in complete futility, would rather enjoy the fruits of failure.
Gotta say that they are looking prety sweet right now...
Honestly though, what teams have actually gotten better so far this off season? CBJ, LA? Rags? CAL seems to be stagnating, The BLues lose Kariya and add arnott and Langy... lateral moves. Seems like a lot of parity...
Anyone have a read on whether Alec Martinez in LA is any good?
ReplyDeleteWith Lombardi having to concentrate on getting Doughty signed, could be a good time to swoop in on their other RFA D-man.
Then again, that could damage our currently sterling relationship with the Kings...
Ducey: You're so pessimist it stinks.
ReplyDeleteFortunately, I am impervious to grammatically incorrect insults.
Its not pessimism. The Oilers have bunch of young players that have a long ways to go. I am optimistic they will get there. But I am realistic enough to know it may not be this year.
If you trade your #1 pick for Green and your kids struggle this year, you have just neutered your rebuild.
If the kids show they are going to excel through their play then by all means load up in the summer of 2012.
Fashipi - a longhair with really trendy sandals
I trade Gagner and Marcinin for Travis Hamonic. Probably an overpay BUT want the player and think that is the only way NYI makes the deal.
ReplyDeleteHorcoff gets our #2 centre slot and we get young, tough, improving RH D man to play with our kids as they get older.
Agree with Ducey no way I make the trade for Mike Green.I keep our #1 on off chance we select in top 5
Would also seriously consider Hannan in shut down role
If Tambi starts the season with the D and G we have now we'll know he wants another top 5 pick.
ReplyDeleteIf he makes a move for at least a top 2-4 D before the season starts we'll know he wants to compete for a top 6-12 pick.
Sopel is a nice bottom pair Dman, the Oilers already have, what, five of those?
ReplyDeleteI like Green but two more years of control is not a lot plus there's the concussion thing. Of course it seems everybody has concussion worries these days.
Wideman or someone of his ilk would be the best bet. A guy who can play top four who can be had for cheap.
I have a pal who is a big Sabres fan, loved Sekera, once he paired with Myers the big kid's early struggles this season went away. He'd be a nice pickup.
This team is still too thin on the blue and in net to trade that first rounder next year unless you're getting two top four D and a stud goalie for it. The top nine forwards look nice but if Whitney or Gilbert go down its lottery guaranteed and it may be anyhow with Khabibulin getting double digit starts.
Those aren't the kind of doubles ReKhab normally starts with.
ReplyDeleteOh, wait a minute! Maybe by double digit you meant two-fingers.
ReplyDeleteApologies, missed that.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=371119
ReplyDeleteI'm glad Burke is back in the news offering his opinion on contracts he won't sign and players he doesn't hold the rights to.
He seems like such a standup guy too. I'm glad he's watching out for the league's interests by not offering contracts he thinks are against the spirit of the CBA, though not actually in breach of its provisions.
Burke has truly made sour grapes an artform. I guess you need something when you come out publically saying that you have a better, smarter way to rebuild, only to have that method of rebuilding take longer and be less effective than the conventional approach.
Ducey: Well to make that comment I expect you at least speak 3 languages fluently.
ReplyDeletebut if Whitney or Gilbert go down its lottery guaranteed
ReplyDeleteWow, a guy misses 3 games to bring his career total to 3 and all of a sudden he's being discussed as an injury risk?
;)
I trade Gagner and Marcinin for Travis Hamonic. Probably an overpay BUT want the player and think that is the only way NYI makes the deal.
ReplyDeleteTOJ, I am glad we agree so much these days but that trade would be bad.
Stats from the year after each player was drafted:
Hamonic: 57 Gm 13 27 40 pts .701 PPG 126 PIM - 31
Marincin 65 Gm 14 42 56 pts .836 PPG 65 PIM -12
Factor in that Marincin was in his first year in North America (and in the WHL), is 6'5", and he is likely to be the better player.
The Oilers lose that trade even if they do not include Gagner.
Then again maybe I am just a pessimist.
I don't see how Buffalo and Edmonton fit as trade partners. Buffalo needs cap space and has only 6 D signed, so if they give up D they need to get cheap D back. Edmonton need to drop a couple of forwards to shore up the D and in goal.
ReplyDeleteWashington makes more sense becasue they have extra D that they can give up for our extra forwards.
I wonder if Smyth can play right defense.
ReplyDeleteFrom TSN:
ReplyDeleteVancouver Canucks winger Jeff Tambellini has left the club to play for Zurich of the Swiss Elite League.
Tambellini, the son of Edmonton Oilers general manager Steve, signed with the Canucks as an unrestricted free agent in July 2010 and posted nine goals and eight assists over 62 games last season.
Marc: Buffalo has eight NHL ready defenders on the roster right now (counting RFAs). Gragnani's ready to move up after a good playoffs and excellent AHL seasons and of course, Sekera remains unsigned.
ReplyDeleteA deal with Buffalo would probably take a D and a forward for cap relief. I think it was Cabbie who suggested taking Kotalik off their hands, but he has a NTC so I might suggest a Jochen Hecht return. The return could be draft picks/prospects.
Buffalo does not have the cap room to resign their two RFA defenders and, like Washington, must make some kind of move.
If the Oilers can move Cogs for a legit top 4 dman then great, but a 2nd rounder only makes no sense. Cogs looks to be developing solid PK ability so he is worth keeping around if there is no decent offer.
ReplyDeleteSekera and Wideman are both good targets in my view.
I have not seen it discussed much but it seems to me that Horcoff becomes a cap casualty before the Oilers start competing. His contribution and cap hit will not be well aligned in 2 years when the Oilers actually need value contracts.
Coincidently his NMC expires at exactly that time. I like Horc's game, but since Khabi will be off the books by then, Horc will be the low hanging fruit for cost cutting in 2013-14.
Anaheim offer on JFJ. MUAHAHAH
ReplyDelete@BDHS
ReplyDeleteOn this team Sopel is a top 4 D. With experience and shot blocking, played 70+ games the last 2 seasons plus he can help with youth development.
If things go bad, I'd rather complain Sopel should know better than Rookie is a bust.
This thread is a lot like standing around in the gymnasium eying up the girls, with very little idea how the girls were eying up the boys.
ReplyDeleteSome of these deals would make more sense if the counterparty didn't have a choice of six other wallflowers to pick from.
Then you add dynamics, where some potential dance partners are biding their time waiting for another party to hit the wallflower upgrade buffet, before swooping in to snap up a sobbing second.
In truth, being a GM would make my head explode.
The BLues lose Kariya and add arnott and Langy... lateral moves. Seems like a lot of parity...
ReplyDeleteRemember though that Kariya didn't play year.
Add to that Perron only played 10 games, and Oshie only played 49.
Wouldn't surprise me if they get north of 90pts if Perron can get healthy and they don't play Elliott much.
Marc said...I don't see how Buffalo and Edmonton fit as trade partners. Buffalo needs cap space and has only 6 D signed
ReplyDeleteExactly. Please see two nice young RFA D men in Sekeras and Gragnani, Gragnani has done his time in the minors and is ready to graduate. With honours if he keeps playing like he did in the playoffs.
What does Buff do with the other 7?
Sopel isn't top 4 D on my sons Midget AAA team. Please see redundancy chapter.
ReplyDeleteJosh: no one is talking about Horcoff's contract in a few years because we don't know what the financial landscape will be by then. While I doubt that his contract will ever be considered a "value deal", continual inflation may make it more reasonable.
ReplyDeleteMore importantly, there's already musing that both players and owners will seek some kind of mechanism from contract negotiation in the next CBA. Players like Redden and Souray might have been willing to to reach revised deals with their teams rather than languishing in the minors to avoid cap penalties. In a couple of years, that could be an option with a player like Horcoff.
Cactus
ReplyDeleteGiven that Edmonton already has too many forwards, I just can't see them making a deal where none of our forwards go the other way and where we actually bring another forward in. They'd be in a position with three extra forwards instead of two, and with Hecht and Sekara's salaries added in, almost be up to the cap.
If we turned anyone on the roster into a defenceman, the guy would be Paajarvi. Don't see originality like that too much anymore though.
ReplyDeleteSopel had 50 pts in the last 2 seasons, playing 70 or more games.
ReplyDeleteHe is a right handed shot.
He is from Alberta.
He blocks a ton of shots.
His salary was ~2.5 million last year.
He has flo.
I'd take a 1 year risk on the vet.
Gretzky:
ReplyDeleteHe had 7 points playing 71 games this year
On ATL.
ReplyDeleteI'd rather a vet log the minutes and block the shots than the young guys.
We have the time. Sopel may not put up a lot of points but if he plays a veteran role and protects the kids I'm for it.
For sure he is better on the ice than Strudwick.
Sopel had 50 pts in the last 2 seasons, playing 70 or more games.
ReplyDeleteActually he has 50 PIMS in the last two years (123gp). He has 15pts in those 123gp.
*ducks behind may not put up points comment*
ReplyDeleteWell I want another vet. Be it Hannan, Sopel, McCabe or at least someone who can mentor the D and is an upgrade from Struds.
Sopel is not the answer.
ReplyDeleteWe desparately need a No. 2 defensman not another No. 5.
Yeah, he blocked shots but so did Gilbert, Smid and Peckham and they are better imo.
Marc: if there was a way to get a player like Sekera out of Buffalo for a reasonable cost (2nd/3rd rounder and a prospect like Martindale) and the only downside is that the Oil would end up with too many forwards, what's the problem exactly? Brule's headed for the LTIR and if they won't take someone like Cogliano or Jones, we can move them elsewhere if necessary. The goal is to get a top 4 d-man for a reasonable price - roster balance and total contracts can be easily resolved in other moves.
ReplyDeleteGretzky: Woodguy just beat me to the punch. Sopel hasn't scored recently and probably doesn't add much more than the Oilers already have.
Oh and based on stats from the Yahoo website:
ReplyDeleteSopel laid out half as many hits as Gilbert last year with a whopping 36 hits in 71 games.
Yea, but were they THUNDEROUS BODYCHECKS???
ReplyDeleteNot everything has to be done the first week of July.
ReplyDeleteIn the worst case, one can always wait for what shows up on the waiver wire during training camp to collect the best defenseman that gets waived.
The Oilers get first dibs.
Except the holes on the Oilers are top 2 D and 1G.
ReplyDeleteThose don't come over the waiver wire too often.
Dr. Oilersfans2011,
ReplyDeleteyou have patience waiting....
Good news is 1G on oilers is a low bar... but that probably isn't really a solution now is it.
ReplyDeleteYandle signs 5 years @ $5.3M.
ReplyDeleteI guess I was wrong. A droid just barged into Oiler HQ. They were about to shackle it with a restraining bolt when it began to project a holographic video of George McPhee, kneeling on the carpet "Help, me, T. M. Bellini, you're my only hope" as cap troopers are heard pounding on the door behind him.
ReplyDeleteThen the mahogany door flew open and *another* droid barged in, and immediately sucker punched the first droid in the projector nub with a retractable coupling pipe.
As the first hologram faded from view, Darcy Regier materialized reading from a prepared statement "This is our most desperate hour. Help us, T. M. Bellini, you're our only hope".
Tambi: Hey, Stu!
Stu: What is it?
Tambi: Droids again.
Stu: Shaped like shiny bullets?
Tambi: Hard to say. Kind of dingy looking. I think they were handled by sand people.
Stu: You never know, maybe they shine up good.
Tambi: Nah, too risky. One looks concussed. Can't risk it.
Shrieks of metal emanate from the trash compactor beside the hulking nineties-era ice machine.
Tambi to self: Now where was I? Ah, yes, CBA Triangles for Dummies on required signatures. I absolutely need to review this cosign thing one more time.
Tambi (yells out): Lister, where's my revision timetable?
Tambi to self: Hell, we've got lots of time left. There's still August, September, September, October, and even November.
This time we'll be prepared!
Does anyone think the Oil should have been in play for Tomas Kaberle? He's basically signed for Tom Gilbert type money with Carolina and given that he's just won the Cup and earned a ton in his career already, I think the Oil could've had him with the best offer. When he went unsigned on July 1, that should've tipped Tambellini that Kaberle could be had for reasonable money. At a 3 year term, he wouldn't have broken the bank or the rebuild plan.
ReplyDeleteLEE you must be a Toronto Maple Leaf fan to believe that Tomas Kaberle is worth anything. He may of been with a cup winning team, but he was just excess baggage. His level of play just suck, and Toronto robbed Boston on that trade.
ReplyDeleteThere's no way to know re: Kaberle. Quite often (or at least it seems to me) veterans like the eastern part of the country for travel. He's been there for his entire career, wouldn't surprise me if he didn't look out west at all.
ReplyDeleteAgree he would have been an excellent player for the Oilers, but I don't know if he would have been attracted to the location.
Plus, is he over 35? No more of those contracts, please.
If I had known I was going to meld man with metal, I should have had Regier reading his Churchillian desperadogram seated behind a desk covered in fresh correspondence from Head Dwarf Puppetclean.
ReplyDeleteAlso, Tambi should have rubbed his aching forehead while complaining to Stu "besides, holograms give me a headache" before activating the Wall-E-Vador destructatomic.
(In the commentary track for Wall-E, in the bridge scene where the red dot of Hal chews the scenery, the director proclaims in the spirit of "if you can't say anything nice" I'm going to sit here for the rest of this scene and say nothing. Commentary resumes when Wall-E and co. land on the trash heap.)
Opportunities lost. OK, back to work now.
I would be very reluctant to trade Gagner, especially for an older defenceman. Does anyone realistically expect this team to contend for a championship this year? Can the team afford to wait and see if a couple of the draft picks from the last two drafts develop into quality defenders?
ReplyDeleteDeadman Waking said...
ReplyDeleteTambi (yells out): Lister, where's my revision timetable?
Lister? Lister!
Is this that infamous Star Wars/Red Dwarf crossover episode?
Or is the Lister reference more circu-locutory* than that?
*not a real word
Is this that infamous Star Wars/Red Dwarf crossover episode?
ReplyDeleteThere's some serious geeks on this website.
Lee: kaberle was so bad defensively at even the two years before this. He would have had to create 37 goals above the league average for production on the pp. just to break even.
ReplyDeleteI can't be a geek, I know nothing about password resets, and I think Oracle was that guy who gave predictions on The Hilarious House of Frightenstein.
ReplyDeleteNow, nerd... maybe.
;o)
The Hilarious House of Frightenstein was in Delphi?
ReplyDeleteMy mother-in-law is witchy-poo.
@rickibear and archie. I don't have any judgement on Kaberle really other than some likely unreliable 'saw him good' moments. Was just wondering if the advanced stats lads felt he represented good value at this price point.
ReplyDeleteAhhh, Delphi... wonder what the Banks are charging to visit their latest acquisition.
ReplyDeleteWitchy-poo, now there was a character nose.
I have never understood this: pk time in the game is equal to PP time. Everyone wants to pay big dollar for the strong even dman how is productive on the PP. they pay big bucks. but not so much for the elite pk Dman. if both are equal GA/60 in the same even situation. and the pp specialist is 15% above the league average on the PP. the PK specialists is 15% better on the PK. they have the exact same effect on the game.
ReplyDeleteThe pk specialist is usually paid less. So from a cap point of veiw it should be cheaper to get the 4 Elite PK specialists who are strong on d. the only problem is this year i made a list of these guys. In free agency these guys were getting 50 to 5% above there historical salaries. thing is it makes sense to pay them.
Montador, Hedja.....
I've always had a fetish for talismanic circumlocutions. Given my choice, I'll take twins. Space opera prospect pipelines for 500 points. I also figured out this afternoon that I'm a bit of a sargasm slut (of the pointy hat variety, in astrological nomenclature).
ReplyDeleteOver the years I've read a fair number of memorable articles from Sports Illustrated in the plush confines of dental hygienist holding pens, which never fails to focus the mind. One had the title "Never heard of Tiger Woods?" and the opening sentence "You will." Prophesy realized.
Another reported an anecdote about a Crash Davis character wrapping his arms around the Ken Griffey Jr man-child in the first week of his rookie season, only to get the response "Nolan who? Who gives a rat's ass, the guy's got to throw me something I can hit." When that's what your A-ticket teenage prospect is thinking, and he's *right*, field of dreams. (Maybe it wasn't Nolan, I'm not a baseball buff. Mutatis mutandi.)
For a sargasm slut on a fan forum with a literate manicure, you're only standing about twenty feet from the plate. "I know he's an a-hole, but he's *our* a-hole." Man, if you can't hit that out of the park, you've got no twig.
The other fat pitch is the GM making $500,000 a year (pick a number) who is obviously dumber than a bag of hammers in a dough mixer per the minds of people earning 10% as much.
I see the human trajectory as adrenaline, perspiration, spittle. First you're stressed out trying to make it, then you grind hard for your UFA golden parachute, then you coast on your gilded laurels with Teflon chest inflated while your lips wither.
Many GMs are deep into phase three. This doesn't make them stupid precisely, but it bugs the hell out of fans who think their season ticket entitles them to hormonal ascendancy. But no, half the time what you get is Teflon spittle. *Life* *is* *just* *not* *fair*.
I wasn't intending to go cross-over space opera, but the urge to give Tambi the Rimmer salute overwhelmed me half way through.
It was a strictly literary problem. Star Wars is full of dashing characters, procuring a rich lexicon of demonic hand-wringing nearly-spent forces for head office, but nothing of use for what ails this team at the present juncture. Once Tambi flushed the dented droids, that was the end of Alderaan for the action sequence.
The plot line in Red Dwarf is that they go into protective stasis for three million years while the computer evaluates the background radiation. When they finally rematerialize, it takes team dysfunction no time at all to burn through the entire ship's inventory of lunch-pail scutters leaving them with nothing but the narcissistic Cat doing flamboyant wheel stands on an ATV to manage the heavy lifting.
You just have to think that Rob Grant and Doug Naylor were serious sports geeks to come up with the "truer than life" plot line. Homer didn't have that advantage. You can't hold it against him, he did his best with what he had. With the sirens and the cyclops, there were shades of premonition.
cir·cum·lo·cu·tion
ReplyDelete[sur-kuhm-loh-kyoo-shuhn]
noun
1. a roundabout or indirect way of speaking; the use of more words than necessary to express an idea.
2. a roundabout expression
Origin:
1375–1425; late Middle English < Latin circumlocūtiōn- (stem of circumlocūtiō )
—Synonyms
1. rambling, meandering, verbosity, prolixity
Curtis Hamilton audio from camp.