- Mark Morris: "He is an old school defenceman in my books; the type of guy that everybody will appreciate over the course of time. He's not going to wow you in the beginning, but I think over time he will prove that he is a force to be reckoned with and he can be a reliable, dependable defender."
That said, he might be a player. The things we need to know about Teubert (TOI, PK TOI) are not available to us, and his boxcars (9, 2-2-4 +3) look fine but don't really tell us how he's doing defensively. From what I can tell, he's played much of the OKC season with veteran Kevin Montgomery--an AHL veteran who no doubt has contributed mightily to Teubert's early season success. The Oilers apparently wanted to recall Teubert earlier this week but were forced to recall Alex Plante due to a "papers" issue that we've discussed in a previous thread.
Teubert is a stay-at-home type, which means he is blocked by:
- Ladislav Smid, human cannonball
- Theo Peckham, rugged and dirt mean
- Andy Sutton, UFA next summer.
The way Peckham's played, if Tuebert shows even a little, he won't be blocked for long.
ReplyDeleteI picked a bad time for Vacation. I missed the last four wins :(
Knowing my luck, the losing starts now that I can actually watch.
Still peeved about this Omark business. I wish this management believed less in concepts like 'attitude, gumption, and grit' and more in 'talent, fair chance and winning.'
ReplyDeleteMattwatt: a team on a 5 game winning streak suddenly doesn't believe in winning? Do you believe in winning so much that the Oilers should pull apart a winning lineup to insert Omark? Please go read the last thread. It's one thing to make a cogent argument for Omark - it's another to make silly assertions that have already been addressed by previous posts.
ReplyDeleteWoe there Cactus, ease up on the reins. Mattwatt's not completely lost with his comments here, even LT suggested, “The Oilers are on a wonderful run that involves luck and goaltending”.
ReplyDeleteSome don’t mess with a winning line-up (superstition) while others take more a strategic approach, if you put the best line-up available on the ice you better your opportunity to win.
I think Omark should be in the line-up and playing with Paajarvi! But with this Oilers management it’s always a guessing game and I’m not sure strategy or superstition play a part!
Given the team had so many rookies last year, it was no surprise that many had predicted the Oilers to improve, in part due to the development of those rookie players. Others pointed out the cautionary note that not all players develop in a straight line.
ReplyDeleteI think Theo Peckham is a prime example of the latter. Although he was not technically a rookie last year, it was his first full season in the NHL. He was in-over-his-head for much of last year, but he did surprisingly well for someone who many thought should be in the AHL to start the season. Thus, many assumed that if he were placed in a depth D role, he would hold his own.
It's obviously too early to write off Peckham. Given that young D are the best example of "don't develop in a straight line", it would be poor asset management to lose him on waivers based on a slow start, given his overall "body of work" (as Renney would say).
This is where Teubert comes in. If Teubert can show promise at the NHL level, he provides "Peckman Insurance". We HOPE Peckham is a rough, gritty depth D that has an outside chance of being on a 2nd pairing shut-down line a few years down the road, but if not can still function quite well on the 3rd pairing. However, Peckham is NOT a slam-dunk NHLer yet, and his development curve may yet steer him out of the NHL. Having Teubert increases the odds that the Oilers will have one solid Peckham-like player.
I look forward to seeing if Teubert can hold his own! This time could use the depth on D... badly!
CC: I am not saying there isn't an argument to be made for putting Omark in the lineup. What I am saying is that arguing that the Oilers management isn't committed to winning by NOT shuffling a lineup DURING a winning streak is an utterly nonsensical argument.
ReplyDeleteIt's not superstition to hold fast with a lineup is winning. To use a football analogy, what you're suggesting is that a team that's making first downs running the ball should suddenly switch to an aggressive downfield passing play. Why change what works?
Cactus, another point of view would be player morale. Imagine you're an unsung player doing something important to keep the winning streak going, and you get kicked from the lineup so that the fans can see a YouTube video artist pad his portfolio. That's not what I think of Omark, but I imagine if *I* was bumped from the lineup for him in the middle of a winning streak, that's probably the first thing that'd come to mind!
ReplyDeleteI believe where this conversation went south is after mattwatt's comment;
ReplyDelete"Still peeved about this Omark business. I wish this management believed less in concepts like 'attitude, gumption, and grit' and more in 'talent, fair chance and winning."
What these team has to be built on is attitude, gumption and grit. Talent, fair chance and winning are all emotional decisions and will be made for the wrong reasons. When Renney talks about looking at the body of work, attitude, gumption and grit are all apart of that. We have all watched Oil Change and seen Renney's address of the players. Fair chance and talent have nothing to do with how this team will be built.
In other words, you don't HS Ryan Smyth, to give Omark a fair chance on the hope that his talent might give us a chance at winning.
Time travel hypothetical:
ReplyDeleteWould the Oilers have been a better team if they had taken Dave Hunter out of the lineup for Linus Omark?
Peckham really wasn't anything special last year either. He looked good in the early going when they paired him up with Gilbert, and people were generally impressed at the fact that he was a physical presense. Something we didn't have a lot of on our back end (Vandermmer is gritty and would fight, but henowhere near as nasty as Teddy).
ReplyDeleteI'm not saying Teubert is going to step in and take Peckham's job during this call-up or anything. I don't think he will. I actually think Peckham has been better than Teubert at every level so far.
What the heck did happen with Plante? I swear he looked a lot more mobile when we first saw him. Last year it looked like he was skating with a boulder on his back and it doesn't look like he's got any better since.
ReplyDeleteHopefully Teubert doesn't have similar problems.
Doesn't the conversation break down when opposite sides use non-quanitifiable, emotion-laden terms like "grit" and "talent"? Wouldn't it make more sense to look at things like Corsi or even Neilson numbers (as Cult of Hockey terms it)?
ReplyDeleteOtherwise it is easy to make assertions using the exact same terms and have them mean exactly the opposite based on your viewpoint. At which point it is easy to squabble like children (or posters on the internet) over issues that are completely impossible to prove.
Based on numbers, which we don't have on Teubert but will have in a couple of days, there is no particular reason to have him here rather than anyone else. But, someone does have those numbers and they are using it as a rationale to bring him up. Once again, the secrecy of NHL teams is not comprehensible.
oviness - like Ovechkin in a small way
Cactus; I agree with you on the ‘winning’ point.
ReplyDeleteStaying with your football analogy; teams change up their strategy and approach not just game to game but half to half. In football the more the run is successful the most the defence will key in on it, conversely opening up a big down field play opportunity (See BC against Riders every game this season)*#&!%!
Staying with hockey many coaches will insert different guys into the line-up to best match toughness, speed, skill, and even juggle line during games. So all I’m saying is if Renney sticks with his line-up based on superstition, that’s just dumb.
"...talent [will] have nothing to do with how this team will be built."
ReplyDeleteI agree?
I think some D look quite different when presented with a structured system.
ReplyDeleteIt seems there is a lot less running around this year to recover from defensive lapses, a player like Plante could look a lot better when not being forced to recover all the time.
Or he might have just had a great game - not much of a sample to judge from.
Whereas Omark has no pedigree and his scouting director is down the line, Teubert is the product of a trade made at the deadline by the current GM and endorsed by the scouting department.
ReplyDeleteThat said, he might be a player.
Huh? That seems a tad unfair.
Maybe Omark being down and Teubert being up has nothing to do with pedigree and has more to do with the fact the Oilers are flush in small forwards but short on Dmen right now. Who should be called up on D besides Teubert?
Maybe Teubert is getting a fair shake from the organization but an unfair assessment from bloggers who widely panned the Penner trade.
BTW if Teubert gets an assist on his callup he will have the same number of points as Penner does. You think Lombardi would do that trade again?
I am getting tired of all the whining about Omark, seriously. Hes 24 years old and has put up 0.5ppg in half a season in the bigs. Big deal.
ReplyDeleteYou need players who are gritty and can play defense in your bottom 6 and Omark isn't it. If Omark can't play in your top 6, then he can't play on a winning team, plain and simple.
Are you going to sacrifice winning games this season to keep Omark around on your 4th line, hoping that he may or may not turn into a player and surpass either one of or both Hemsky and Gagner? No. I am tired of losing and want to win games now. Glad he's going to the minors where he can show his skill and hopefully get traded for a defensive prospect or a 2nd, 3rd round draft pick.
For all you guys tired of losing, this is how you start winning. Trimming the excess fat on players with duplicate skills and dressing a team that can actually win games and has balance throughout the line up.
Teubert almost certainly to make his debut in (savour this) L.A.
ReplyDeleteBarker ruled out of Thursday's game & probably Saturday's as well, due to shoulder issue. Oilers have 8 active defencemen including the pairing C&B calls The Coral Reef, Barker and Sutton, both of whom are out of the picture. So it will almost certainly be: Smid-Gilbert; Petry-Potter; Peckham-Teubert as the three pairings, and in that order, obviously. I'd guess about a 24-22-14 split.
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ReplyDeleteBay Street: It was caught in spam but is there now.
ReplyDeleteSomeone please tell me the Oilers aren't going to deal Omark without first trying him on a line with Lander and Paajarvi for a few games. I was at the game where they played together for one (one?!?) shift and they had a few nice scoring chances. The third line isn't scoring now so doesn't it make sense to give this trio a shot? For a few games at least. I'd hate to see him go and then wonder what could have been...
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone have Renny's number? Ima gonna give him a call...
Unless of course they are showcasing Gagner in the hopes of raising his trade value.
Great chance for Teubert given that 24 is scuffling early on.
ReplyDeleteAs well as the Oilers are going, the D is still scary. I've seen 77 play this well before so I'm apt to believe his early play is real. But then you hope 5 doesn't backslide and that 44 is truly real and that somehow 6 can play 60 games a year.
Maybe I have the wrong idea about how you build a good D corps - and maybe the fact the Oilers are playing a good team D has and will cover for some inexperience and lack of talent - but this group still scares me.
they could do that if they wanted to go nuclear on the match line and put 20 with 94-10. Or if they wanted to put 89 with 94-10 and use Belanger as the 10th forward.
ReplyDelete@Black Dog: True dat.
ReplyDelete@Bubba Snickey: One. Shift.
ReplyDelete1!!!!!!!!1!!1!
I don't get that part either.
The D shuffling only proves that we're a little thin still with some decent looking kids knocking on the door. Thankfully Potter has been a revelation and allowed the "slow growth" process to happen. Things will become clearer once Barker and Sutton's futures have been decided.
ReplyDeleteOmark + F prospect + 2nd/3rd rounder for D that can play solid minutes in a 4-6 role.
Really can't wait to see how a healthy Hemsky, if thats even possible, playing with 94 and 10 impacts this lineup. would take even more pressure off things behind the blue.
Bunz is the CHL goaltender of the week:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.chl.ca/article/tigers-tyler-bunz-named-vaughn-chl-goaltender-of-the-week/108052
Cabbie: I think you're underselling the D a bit (at least given how they're playing right now). The Oilers are currently missing 3 of their top 7, which is a pretty big blow for any team to overcome (even if two of those D men are probably 5th and 6th on the depth chart).
ReplyDeleteAs for trading, I think that's a logical outcome if people keep performing at or near their current levels. However, there's no point sending Omark + away for anything less than a surefire top 4 (and preferably top 3) guy. As this offseason proved, it's really not hard to find bottom pairing guys.
November is the surest test of all of our various assumptions about the Oilers. 14 games, of which 10 will be played on the road. By the end of the month, the Oilers will have played 25 games, with a 12-13 home/road split. I think we'll have a good idea of what this team can do by then.
...As if trading for a former 1st round pick, then daring to use the player over Omark(who not only wasn't able to score any points when he had his first short chance of this season) means a damn thing.
ReplyDeleteI understand Lowetide - years spent wandering in the NHL wilderness can do that to anyone.
Interesting game, because if They win it's another huge statement game. Expect the Kings to come out flying - hope they play Penner a lot.
Weird days now that the team is back to it's winning ways. Now the bloggers are jockeying for position. Jonathan Willis for example, is hoping to stake out the "Dog in the Manger" position, lol.
With the Oilers winning, and by this I mean dominating the regular season for the first time since over twenty seasons ago...all I can say is now there doesn't seem to be anything much to complain about.
I'm only still bothering to write this out of habit.
PS: Incredible how many fans of other teams are checking out the Oilers as their 2011-12 new fave team to watch. Even Flames fans I'm told. Maybe they get a lottery pick next spring.
@Woodguy: I was surprised to read that you do a lot of work in the wood business. I never would have guessed it.
ReplyDeletePlease check out my predictions for about 7-8 games ago - when I told you gamblers to make a same sized bet on every one of the Oiler games coming up - you would have all won yourselves a packet.
@ Ducey
ReplyDeleteWhile I am sure Lomabradi is disappointed in Penner's performance thus far, I doubt he is losing much sleep over losing Teubert.
Teubery would be somewhere around 10th on the Kings defensive depth chart.
The Kings can't even find room on the NHL roster for Slava Voynov who is clearly NHL ready (2G 3P in 5 NHL games this season)and they have Muzzin and Hickey in the AHL with Derek Forbort at UND (3pts in 8GP)
Perhaps losing the chance to draft Klefbom might give him pause a few years down the road but that remains to be seen.
haha sorry to bug you Lowetide, not familiar with the posting process.
ReplyDeleteI have been reading you for years and I really appreciate the effort you put into providing us with great articles and opinions. Much better than waking up and reading the Journal like 5-10 years ago. Thanks.
Bay Street - Normally posts go up right away. I think its just if you post on the mobile site that it gets stuck in limbo (because it usually doesn't ask you for a word verification - but sometimes it does - its voodoo magic). Anyway, if you go to 'full site mode' at the bottom of the page from your mobile, you can avoid getting stuck in the spam filter.
ReplyDeleteI'm chewing a leaf rather than watching game tape, but I think Renney is trying to build a team identity where the defence are far more confident about making the automatic play. His goal is to vanquish subconscious doubt. If the automatic play consistently degenerates into an own-zone fire drill, doubt hangs around like a black mushroom.
ReplyDeleteThe worst you can allow after an automatic play is that the other team regains possession but only after a struggle long enough for defensive coverage to close any small gaps that formed in the heat of the moment.
Omark is the least useful tool in that war right now. I don't think Renney believes that Omark has bought into the need to claw with every fibre of your being for that extra fraction of a second for his mates to regroup when his defensive zone assignment is going the wrong direction.
If, out of three difficult defensive zone plays, Omark successfully shades for a quick break on two of those, but on the third play allows the other team to regain control as if he wasn't even standing there, he's going to get his ass mailed to the bus.
Any defenceman will start to wince subconsciously about making automatic plays if one time in three the play turns around as quickly as a break-out intercepted.
If you build on this foundation and the team experiences some success to add cement to the slurry, it becomes a group norm. Then you can slot Omark back into the lineup without worrying about your defense unlearning the teamwork habits their success is built upon.
Anyone who has read about change psychology knows that the first 90% of the battle is changing old habits, the second 90% of the battle is maintaining those changes when you return to the environment where the original bad habits formed (usually your family; Hi mom!).
For several years this team has been trying to play around the physical battle, without any great success measured in Ws. Omark is dangerous at this juncture if his approach involves going around the battle in any zone.
(cleaver up)
(cleaver down)
ReplyDeleteMany books on change initiative tell you to look beyond the individual. Sometimes when you remove the most talented sales person from the room ("how will we live?" is the usual first objection), everyone else discovers they were better than they thought now that shared information flows more freely.
Another thing about change initiatives is that you can't fix everything simultaneously. If you're experiencing a staggering improvement in GAA, and booking wins on that foundation, now is not the time to fuss about a perceived short fall in goals scored, if it posses any risk at all to the change solidifying.
We're only about three goals shy of mediocre, and that can be accounted against a pair of 2-1 losses to Minny. The majority of the time, whenever the team needed goals, goals were scored.
We've run a lot of sorties over the past three years giving raw players exposure to tough game conditions at the expense of team success.
Suddenly with the addition of RNH, a little more size, better balance up the middle, and a fairy-kingdom save percentage, the building blocks are strong enough to put the team first and win some games, without extracting every possible drop of skill from an inadequate talent nucleus.
The GM supplies the talent, the coach welds the talent into a whole. From the GM chair, you want to realize some upside on the Omark asset. From the coach's bench, I wouldn't do it. Not until the jello sets on team first, version 1.
Soon enough something or someone will falter. Omark will get one more chance to decide if he wants to be Peter Klima or not.
How does Klima remember that game? As his greatest glory or his greatest shame? Guys were dying out there and there he sits fresh as a daisy though about eighty years of a hundred year war. Do you think anyone in the room criticized the coach after the game for bag skating them in the Stanley cup final with a short bench until midway through the third overtime? Oh great leader, what say you about the Klima goal? I've always wondered about the aftermath inside the room of the goat horn quick change.
What these team has to be built on is attitude, gumption and grit. Fair chance and talent have nothing to do with how this team will be built.
ReplyDeleteSo we need Ethan Moreau back. Oh wait. "Attitude" was in there too.
mylog something that would help the Oilers win more than Ethan Moreau. (seriously. That was the verification word.)
Renney
ReplyDeleteHoly mackerel,we've got a lot of right handed defenceman.
Cactus said...
ReplyDeleteCabbie: I think you're underselling the D a bit (at least given how they're playing right now). The Oilers are currently missing 3 of their top 7, which is a pretty big blow for any team to overcome (even if two of those D men are probably 5th and 6th on the depth chart).
Not my intention at all Cactus. I've been as impressed and pleasantly surprised as anyone. I just dont want a kid called up, put in a difficult situation and losing confidence. If we can move the Omarks and Peckham types for an everyday D and alleviate that problem then I'm for it.
No issues with the status quo if Whitney's healthy (big if) but we've survived just fine without him to this point. Barker's injury and Sutton's suspension leaves us a little vulnerable in the bottom pairing. I have no confidence in Teddy, and I'd like to see Teubert with at least another full A year before he's pressed into action.
Petry's been ready since TC imo but I guess the numbers game means he's behind Peckham unless a move is made.
Totally healthy I'd like to see Petry as a 5-7 and Peckham gone. Might as well throw him and Omark along with a decent pick and prospect into a proposal for the Whitney insurance you refer to. If we aren't willing to go that hard then see if those two can land and everyday 5/6 to keep the Teuberts in the A and as insurance if Barker or Sutton aren't in the 2012 plans.
ducksisu shopping location for mallard hunters
DMW, what I find amusing about all these types of posts maligning Omark's lack of defensive commitment, is that previous Vancouver game.
ReplyDeleteBuddy hustled back, supported the defence, had a few nice plays including a perfect flip of the puck to clear the zone and allow the change under pressure after a bit of a dangerous pass to him. To say nothing of the beauty sequence when he held off both Sedins for a prolonged period of time behind his own net, until Belanger arrived in support and fished the puck out for an easy clear.
Omark is a clear upgrade on Jones (even with his last few good games) and that includes defensive play. Eager isn't even in the same conversation in any area of the ice as Omark except the penalty box.
As for this bunk about the Swedish Hockey Savior being a soft perimeter player unwilling to go to the difficult areas of the ice and ' pay the price', I have no idea where that comes from.
Linus is a puck hound, plain and simple, buddy will take the puck into those contested areas and take a pounding to maintain possession and often enough creates marvelous scoring opportunities from very little. Tenacious in his pursuit of the puck as well when he doesn't have it.
I see one more idiotic reference to Schremp and it may convince me that Idiocracy is indeed prophetic. Klima references notwithstanding. Omark doesn't only engage in battles, he initiates and wins them. In fact he often freakishly wins battles he has no business even being competitive in with his size.
In regards to this alleged critical error in judgement Oiler management is making in sending Linus Omark to OKC, I thought it worth passing along some comments that the Team1260 ran yesterday from their presser with Renney.
ReplyDeleteIn it, he describes the current makeup of their 4 lines as:
An 'Evens' Line: One assumes he's talking about the Horcoff line here and asking them to play the other team's top line to a standoff at the least
An Outscoring Line: Clearly he's talking about the kid line being expected to outscore the 'soft parade'
A Sleeper Line. Yes, this was his exact words. Thus his expectations for the Belanger line are one capable of busting out with some offense on occasion and playing sound defensively in the meantime
An Energy Line. I'm paraphrasing here as I don't recall the exact descriptor he used for this line but what he expects was clear - this line is expected to 'wear down' the opposition when they're on the ice.
Given that being the makeup that Renney envisions for his squad, where does Linus Omark fit in the equation?
He's certainly not replacing anyone on the kid line. Nor does he have the defensive responsibility to justify playing him on the Outscorer line. Energy Line assignment seems a poor choice for a small forward, particularly one which you expect offense from (i.e. Top 9 or bust). This leaves us the Sleeper Line. So, who takes Omark's spot in the pressbox? Gagner, Belanger or Paajarvi? You could demote Belanger to the 4th and move Gagner to center, but Gagner's problems in the faceoff are well documented. That basically makes it a 3 way competition between Paajarvi, Gagner and Omark. If I was the coach, all 3 would be facing the threat of a HS and I would breed a fairly fierce competition btw the three. What's really inexplicable is why Omark gets sent down when Gagner is still quite clearly not all the way back from his ankle sprain. If there's any mistake being made here, I daresay it's Gagner not getting the HS so Omark can draw in until Hemsky's back. At that point, all bets are off. lol
Uni: I like your points. It strikes me that while an apt description of Omark, those points could also be used to describe another polarizing forward: Hemsky.
ReplyDeleteI'm distracted by a failing bridge design at the moment so can't think for myself, but how closely would you see the overlap in those two players, NHL experience excluded?
Totally healthy I'd like to see Petry as a 5-7 and Peckham gone. Might as well throw him and Omark along with a decent pick and prospect into a proposal for the Whitney insurance you refer to. If we aren't willing to go that hard then see if those two can land and everyday 5/6 to keep the Teuberts in the A and as insurance if Barker or Sutton aren't in the 2012 plans.
ReplyDeleteI don't get this. The Oilers have
Whitney-Gilbert
Smid-Potter
Barker-Sutton
Peckham-Petry
Teubert-Plante
Why would they trade Peckham and Omark for a 5/6? You are going to trade them for a Sutton or Babchuk? Not only is it a big overpay, its short sighted.
As much as this team has won some games, they are not a Cup contender and still will not make the playoffs. Why not use the season for development and see what they have in Peckham (who is only in his second season) and Omark (who has not even played one season yet)?
You can pick up another Dman in the offseason without giving up any assets.
I'd rather unload Sutton and Barker at the deadline and move Petry and Peckham into fulltime duties at that point.
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ReplyDeleteSome of these comments are laughable. Do we really think this run is going to continue all season?
ReplyDeleteI sure don't.
I said it before, and it bears repeating (and not only in regard to Omark): Are we sacrificing the offensive development of our young players in exchange for a few "gritty" wins in a supposed rebuilding season?
I would much prefer a 10th-12th place finish with our younger players turning the corner to become closer to elite talent before their third seasons (RFA) than finish in the playoffs playing a slog-it-out defensive system and stifling our younger players' offensive skills due to being handcuffed to defense.
Sorry, but traditionally that's not the Oilers way. May be working well so far, but look at the big picture...
BTW - If we're looking at a rebuilding model, that's also not the the Penguins way or the Blackhawks way.
ReplyDeleteMore like Nashville, Columbus, New Jersey.
Rick: please demonstrate conclusively why the Oilers cannot continue to find success this season, albeit at a slightly reduced pace (hint: you can't, but if you want to flail around this point, be my guest).
ReplyDeleteI think if the first 11 games prove anything it's that this team is not a guaranteed lottery pick. Injuries and poor play may conspire to eventually place the Oilers in that range, but at this point it is probably reasonable to consider the last playoff spot as a potential goal. Again, let's revisit these macro issues come December 1.
Omark on Twitter: "renney said just a numbers game. going down to AHL to do my best and forget the rest."
ReplyDeletethats obviously code for 'youtube shootout hater'
ReplyDeleteSo what is exactly wrong with Barker's shoulder? Most shoulder injuries to a team in sports history?? Sheesh.
ReplyDeleteI don't think that's a real twitter account. @Limpanomark is a verified one.
ReplyDeleteNJ
ReplyDeleteBoston
Buffalo
Montreal
All 4 of these teams could use a top 6 forward.
Rick said: I would much prefer a 10th-12th place finish...
ReplyDeleteThere are teams (looking at you, Islanders) who have been on the rebuild for years upon years. At some point you have to turn that into something. I know you're not saying rebuild forever, but I think you are implying, albeit perhaps not intentionally, that too much success should not be welcomed and that another lottery pick is more valuable than a few more wins. I don't completely disagree. However:
1) Simply being inexperienced is no guarantee of a lottery pick. Injuries and bad luck play into it, as we have seen in Edmonton the last two years. And I don't think you're suggesting deliberately throwing games. So if you're aiming for a lottery pick, that's a bizarre gamble this early in the season.
2) A few more wins, even if they are a playoff miss, ARE valuable. In my former profession (design), a lot of people preach that you become a better designer by studying examples of bad design. It's usually mediocre (at best) designers who preach this. Sure players can learn from losing. But they're going to learn more from winning and being legitimately competitive. You learn to win by winning, or at least trying to win.
3) You want free agents to come? You want to be a desirable market? You do that by trying to win. Not by trying to lose in the name of a hoped-for future.
4) Sure they're not likely to win the Stanley Cup or the President's Trophy this year. The streak won't last - that's why it's called a "streak". But I'm utterly mystified by posters who are utterly convinced that the playoffs are an impossibility.
Finishing the season in 1st and finishing the season in 15th both seem extremely unlikely to me. But calling for a lottery finish when you're 1st in the West a month in seems to border on neurosis. Or at least such wanton defeatism that I wonder what joy cheering of rthe team can bring you?
Well, Phil Cornet thinks its a real account: "Welcome back @linusomark!" Not sure if it is really him.
ReplyDeleteRenney doesn't want him (23)rusting away.
ReplyDeleteUgh, Oilers have enough lottery picks, (hall, RNH, one could almost argue Eberle, Samwise is almost one), its time to start trying to win.
ReplyDeleteFar too many pros to actually trying to win then cons of "winning too quickly"
If the Oilers bat .500 the rest of the way they will have picked up 25 points over last season (87 points). If they manage to pick up 5 wins over that mark it puts them on target for a bottom playoff seed.
ReplyDeleteSomewhere between rabid enthusiasm and ingrained skepticism there exists reality. This team should hit the .500 average if they can escape the injury epidemic of the last few seasons. I believe a little taste of winning and a playoff round or two is just what this group needs.
Omark will get his chance. There is no way this group of forwards goes through the season without losing some games to the IR. Going to OKC made Linus better last year, and he may return determined that he will play so that they never consider sending him back.
Ducey said...
ReplyDeleteWhy would they trade Peckham and Omark for a 5/6? You are going to trade them for a Sutton or Babchuk? Not only is it a big overpay, its short sighted.
Where did I say the player coming back would be of a Sutton/Barker ilk and age? Could a 5-6 not be a younger Dman, not ready to be a top 3 but with potential to be that? Examples
Ekholm
Erixon
Savard
Emelin
Blum
If you think Peckham's ever going to be one then hair on ya.
We're recalling kids (Plante, Twobears) from the A right now that aren't ready. Why? Not to step into top 3 roles I'm pretty sure. As I said if you want one that's already there then give up Omark + projectable Dman (Peckham)+ draft pick (2nd) + prospect (Hamilton). Move other (lesser) parts to get the 5-6 insurance that keeps those two in the AHL for the year. They can move up next season when one or both of Barker and Sutton are down the road.
Rick said...
ReplyDeleteSome of these comments are laughable. Do we really think this run is going to continue all season?
I sure don't.
I said it before, and it bears repeating (and not only in regard to Omark): Are we sacrificing the offensive development of our young players in exchange for a few "gritty" wins in a supposed rebuilding season?
Maybe we're sacrificing not much because theres already talent here and on the farm that can do the job as well or better, i.e Lander, Hartikainen, that also have attributes that make this team tougher to play against = more wins.
As for not making the playoffs and given health not becomeing an issue, I see these teams as locks to finish top 8 ahead of the Oilers:
LA
VAN
SJ
CHI
after that it's a crapshoot. I'm not saying we're better than the rest just that all hard bets are off. Detroit has tourettes. Ducks have one and a half lines. Blues aren't showing anyone they're good enough and I don't see any of Dallas, Nashville, Phoenix, Minnesota or Calgary making hard cases for themselves. Colorado maybe?
Yes theres lots of hockey left but as some have already said, maybe it's time to think about making some noise NOW versus later. Make moves to solidify for NOW instead of tomorrow. There's enough quality in the system outside of some goaltending and D tweeks that make it possible.
Well, Phil Cornet thinks its a real account: "Welcome back @linusomark!" Not sure if it is really him.
ReplyDeleteWell, that Linus is mysterious. Maybe he's got two accounts going.
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ReplyDeleteFunny stuff in this thread.
ReplyDeleteI actually completely agree with Lee; Renney should rotate 89, 91, 57 and 23 to create competition in the line-up.
If 23 takes the send down well, no problem. However, if this a precursor to a trade, the Oiler's are going to get 20 cents on the dollar. Which amounts to another dumb move by the Org.