Hitchcock: "My opinion on Nugent-Hopkins has changed ... last summer I thought he reminded me of Joe Sakic, but it's Pavel Datsyuk now. He strips people of the puck, he's crafty in high-traffic areas, he dishes well, he's got great patience with the puck. But, if you're close to either one of those two guys (in ability), that's a pretty good thing."
In a world addicted to instant gratification, Nugent-Hopkins delivered with a solid performance last night in his regular season debut. Scored a key goal, Dennis Kings's chance count had him at 10-2 during EV time. His linemates included (but were not limited to) Taylor Hall and Ales Hemsky, and that line could be outstanding as the year rolls along.
Some other observations...
- Dubnyk had a nice game. I think it was a softie goal he let in, but haven't seen exactly what was going on in front of him just before it went in. Interesting if there was an angle that could show if the Pens forward shielded the puck for any length of time. Otherwise, he was very good, especially against Letang--who was exceptional on this night.
- There were some crtical comments about Horcoff in the GDT below. Just wanted to mention the captain was solid on the dot and devoted 8.5 minutes of playing time to the PK.
- Speaking of lost arguments in the face of performance, I thought Tommy Gilbert was excellent last night. #77 was 5-2 by Dennis King's scoring chances and skated miles (led the team in TOI). I've grown tired of the knocks on Gilbert, although they'll remain part of the fanbase. I've decided to focus more attention to him this year, and will have something up after the first five games in regard to role, quality of partner and toughness of opponent. We'll wait to see the math, but by eye he made some nice plays during a long night.
- Taylor Hall is so good he gets things done even on nights when he isn't driving the play. I thought he had a lot of jump early but the Pens (well coached) defenders kept driving him to the outside. He had a nice chance right at the end of the 2nd period, but seemed to lose mo with all of the penalties during the heart of the game. Buddy still delivered a pure skill pass to 83 on a play that eventually saw 93 find the net.
- I thought Cam Barker was ineffective but Dennis King's scoring chances had him 4-2. I'll have to keep closer track of him (#13 makes me think of Cogs) but when he registered it was mostly walkabout in his own end. I think there's a lot of coaching to do for Steve Smith and co.
- Darcy Hordichuk over Lennart Petrell.
- Among the blue, my eye caught Petry getting in lanes and blocking shots, along with finding his man on the outlets. Teddy Peckman was having a time with that, but played a rugged game all the same. Peckham also had a fine night on the PK.
- Laddy Smid had a good game by my eye, Dennis King scoring chances (7-1) suggest the same. Smid blocked a lot of shots and his shot from the point is noodly every damn time, but I was thankful he was an Oiler last night. Don't really recall thinking that before.
- I thought Anton Lander accomplished a lot for the role he played.
- Ryan Smyth skated miles and miles. I wish they'd use him more on the PK, although the rotation last night was effective up front imo.
- Sportsnet's new music sounds like Sunday morning news music for NBC. I keep thinking someone from OPEC is coming up next.
- Dennis King scoring chances are here.
Sportsnet's new music sounds like Sunday morning news music for NBC. I keep thinking someone from OPEC is coming up next.
ReplyDeleteBravo.
It's always tough to take away things from game one. After last year's game one, I thought this team was going to win 42 games.
Sort of.
Big win for Dubnyk, glad to see RNH score a goal at a meaningful time, and it was a huge boost to kill a five minute major that late in the game. I don't know anyone that thought this team was capable of killing a major. They did.
Smile. They won. Maybe Ryan Whitney will be back in a couple weeks. Maybe.
RSN team came across as really professional and not like something from the early 80's ITV Oiler broadcasts/SCTV taping. I didn't think that bringing Jeff Merek on board would make that big of a difference but it did. I was not channel surfing during the intermissions which is what I did all of last year when the game was on RSN or RSNW.
ReplyDeleteOn the game front... that first PK was brutal and you could tell the Pens were going to score. The Oil was all over the place. Other than that they kept it close. The H2N line looked great and Horcoff didn't seem to appear until late in the game. DD in goal was what I was hoping for and the D kept it simple for the most part.
I thought Marek did an excellent job too. The Rexall stuff was business as usual aside from a really nice interview with Ryan Smyth.
ReplyDeletejmo.
I was impressed the Oil killed all the penalties save one (1-10, including the 5min at the end). In that respect alone, this is not last year's Oilers.
ReplyDeleteRead a couple of comments around Horcoff too, and I didn't get it. He was not noticeable in a bad way, did a great job teaming with Lander on the PK and helped a little up ice.
Ted was good all night, imo, played a more complete game than Hall, but at the least earned himself the likelihood of being in Edm for 82.
Jones looks good as a 4th liner on this year's club - I was nervous every time he was in his own zone.
Repost from end of last thread:
ReplyDeleteInterestingly the Oilers an official goal differential of +1 even though they officially have 1 goal for and 1 against.
Double checked it on VAN, who has played one game and lost in SO (against PIT) and sure enough their GD stands at -1.
Oh NHL, you so crazy!
I think when looking at GD we should back out all goals for/against due to shoot out.
Those special 3 point games also seem to have goals that while are not contributed to any one players' stats, are still used in GD.
Clear as mud?
yeah, i don't think we need to go crazy applauding the SN coverage, just yet. it was better, but still not good.
ReplyDeletedubnyk looked a lot like rinne at times, closer to the blue paint, little extra movement and good reflexes for a big man. where do you shoot on a guy like that?
count me as one who doesn't think that PMS won't have much offensive success...i think it's more likely that he has a jordan staalish career without the physical play.
i think omark is in tough if his line doesn't make much happen. really had a feeling that harti would have been more noticeable. i don't want to trade him, but ricki's argument for a dman is starting to make some sense.
i was at the flames game on saturday and the oiler's were able to get out of their end with a lot more efficiency than the flames -- which is a bad statement for the flames.
Yeah, Gilbert looked very good last night. Maybe it was the beer, but I remember him making a few physical plays to boot. One of the better games I've seen him play.
ReplyDelete13 wasn't nearly as bad as I expected at evens if that means anything. To my eye, he didn't look Foster bad--though he did have a few moments.
Petry had an impressive game though he made a few errors. Definitely a top 4 dman there--just a question of when (when he'll be a top 4 d, not when he'll be playing top 4 d)
Peckham looks worse than last year--not sure if he's rusty or if he's just being outplayed by the other riff raff on our blue.
The nuge looks like the real deal in terms of his much hyped and absolutely ridiculous vision.
I didn't mind maggie on the pk though he'll need some practice at it. Having a guy with wheels and decent hands on the PK could be a good thing when he's more experienced.
The doobie did have a very good game. Rennie looked a little more intense behind the bench (determined to win) than he did last season.
woah...double negative there...and pms instead of mps...must have a bbq hangover.
ReplyDeleteOh yeah, I didn't hear the Nuge lament the fact that Hemsky was hard to play with, lol. Is he the first Oiler ever who hasn't said that?
ReplyDeleteI thought Horcoff and the entire PK had a great game. It would have been nice to see Petrell out there with them though.
ReplyDeleteI thought RNH had a decent game, he makes so many smart little plays at both ends of the ice. He lacks Hall's flash, but most of the league does so I certainly don't hold that against him.
Belanger with Smyth and Eberle didn't work well. I would put Horcoff with them and put Belanger with the Swedes.
Other than Gilbert the D struggled.
dubnyk looked a lot like rinne at times, closer to the blue paint, little extra movement and good reflexes for a big man. where do you shoot on a guy like that?
ReplyDeleteYeah, Dubnyk just eats up the net. His size is ridiculous and his lateral movement/reflexes looked a little better though it's just one game.
IIRC Dubnyk historically sucks at shoot outs, so I was surprised that he looked decent last night.
Oh, was I that drunk or did Smid move to starboard instead of Peckham? I had thought Smid didn't play on the right side.
Hemsky is still the most talented forward on this team. That wont stop the great un-washed from running him out of town because he doesnt shoot 200 times per year. He and Hall will be majic (for a short time)
ReplyDeleteExciting game to attend. Not sure when the building was last that loud. Perhaps 2006?
ReplyDeleteRNH made a lot of wonderful passes. IMO he is here to stay. One play that stands out is a time when he he stepped into the front of a penguin player behind the net and came out with the puck.
A guy behind me said we could trade Hemmer because Omark has all that skill with the puck. I love Omark but he cannot put me on the edge my seat the way Hemmer can. Hemmer can skate along with the puck skills.
This is going to be an exciting team to watch. Lots of skill, great passes, not so good in their own end.
Not only Malkin and Crosby missing but Orpik as well. The Pens are could we be the class of the league this year.
Quick thoughts:
ReplyDeleteTed has elusiveness and awareness that reminds me of a cross between a poor man's 99 and Nedved (number helps too). Decisive short passes that Hall and Hemmer received at full speed allowing them to attack or get behind D. Can't wait to see more.
Gilbert will be more accepted now that we have a little more grit on D. Won't be slighted by not filling that role.
Omark and Gagner have duplicative talents and the team can afford to move them, especially with what's on the farm, for more depth on D.
After the soft goal, DD was big and positionally sound. He earned the next game.
94 had a bigger impact than I could've imagined not counting his elbow.
Hall, Ted and Hemmer could be a monster line in a few months.
Fun game...praying for the injury fairy to stay away this year.
I was at the game last night:
ReplyDeleteRe:Horcoff, there was at least two or maybe three times he whiffed on a pass or dump in. Made me wonder if he has the wrong stick ? Aside from that, he was rock solid defensively and was good on the draws, etc.
The thing about Barker was he did step up physically and put the shoulder into a couple of guys. There was this one play in the second period he started a scrum after and oiler took an unnecessary shot. Made some decent plays on the PP.
On the goal, somehow it eluded DD. It was in front of us (albeit we are row 33) he had good position, but somehow it squeaked under his arm. My buddy thought it might have rolled up his blocker. Replay when I got home showed a partial screen out high and a possible tip. You would still like to see him squeeze that puck.
I missed the game, but saw on the gamesheet that Paajarvi had over 5 minutes on the PK. I've been hoping for him as an option with his skating and responsible nature.
ReplyDeleteWas he good?
I thought that up until the 16:00 min mark of the 2nd period that the Oilers looked like a team that hasn't played a game in a week, or a game with meaning since April.
ReplyDeleteI thought they looked slow and that it took some time to knock the rust off the wheels. Passing was just off too, I think we'll see the forwards play a better game.
Pittsburgh is a tight-checking, systems oriented frustrating bunch of bastards to play against. They hang back a lot and were all about trying to steal two points on the road while "cheating to defense" the whole way. This normally would've been a game the Oil would have blown, but they stuck to their guns.
The penalties of course helped destroy the flow of the game and even those two good shifts with 4 to go in the 2nd were thwarted by a call.
I said at the end of the game that Ladi played superb out of his regular position, so nice to see Dennis' stats bear out my eye.
Even without Crosby & Malkin that team was a very good test for the Oilers. Their D corps is very mobile & they move the puck quickly. Dubnyk played great, the goal was a partial screen, jitters but after that he shut them down hard. I'm excited to see these fast, skilled Oiler forwards play against some of these other teams defencemen! Renney coached a great game as well, keeping Hordichuk on the bench so Mac couldn't challenge him to ignite the Pens! Different weight classes but Hordichuk wouldn't have turned him down. Great move by Renney!
ReplyDeletespOILer: I noticed you'd said he played right D, but I saw Peckman over there a lot. Did they switch at some point?
ReplyDeleteGood start to the season, a lot to like.
ReplyDeleteMost of the D were not noticeable and that is a good thing on this club. Smid had a couple of moments but he and Peckham were dynamite on the PK and of course Gilbert was tremendous.
Dubnyk was very good I thought.
They're deep up front, deeper than they have been in years. COnsider that Lander and Jones worked on the PK and did a very good job. Belanger and Smyth along with Horcoff all had strong games, won faceoffs, did all of those little things.
So with Hemsky they have four veterans in the top nine plus Ted, Hall and Eberle and the two Swedes. That's a nice top nine and does not even include Gagner.
And for those folks who talk about moving Hemsky last night is a great illustration of why not. Once they got their legs he, Hall and Ted were dynamite. It depends on the cash and term and yes there is the injury thing but they really need to try and keep him around. Can't have too many good players.
He says. Again.
Henry - 91 was very good on the PK, really could not complain about any of the forwards' work in that regard.
ReplyDeleteI thought that Smid and Peckham swapped as the game wore on and that Smid was far better playing LD.
Any word on Whitney? If they're talking baout waiving Chorney he can't be far off.
I thought that up until the 16:00 min mark of the 2nd period that the Oilers looked like a team that hasn't played a game in a week, or a game with meaning since April.
ReplyDeleteSince December, you mean.
Funny you picked that time - they had like two EV chances to that point in the game. The game was a bit of a dog for the first 35 minutes or so, although the PP looked nice.
I saw Horcoff good. He has a bit more speed than last year?
ReplyDeleteOmark and Hemmer need to be better. Omark has tonnes of try but he tended to wind up in a corner where he turned it over or fell over.
Hemmer looked a little lost. He took a hit just inside the blueline very similar to the one that put him on the shelf last year. He seemed to survive it ok.
Good to see the Oilers survive their first trap team.
Oilers place Chorney on waivers! Take the Fetal position for 24 hours, starting now!
ReplyDeleteChorney's been put on waivers per McKenzie.
ReplyDeleteChorney on waivers
ReplyDeleteAnother notch on Fussies belt (if she had a belt).
ReplyDeleteBob Mackenzie twitter: EDM puts Taylor Chorney on waivers.
ReplyDeleteThe Fools! Don't they know how valuable he is?
I agree with Spoiler.
ReplyDeletePittsburgh is a tough road team, even without their killers.
The big plus for this game is that the Nuge didn't look out of place defensively very often. That's huge for the Nuge and the team.
I think, though, that they'll need to get the kid away from the other teams best soon, especially on the road. So, they might want to move the kid to a softer minutes line.
Also, I think Horcoff-Smyth is a proven combo and 94 still has some jump at evens. I'd line match with:
The Mullet - Comrade - The Bad, Bad Man (toughest)
PMS - The Frenchman - Terry "Irish" O'mark (toughs)
Canonball Run- The Nuge -Ice Man (super soft)
P.K. Machine - Lando Calrissian - Shitty-Mullet
IR: The Hobbit
Also, the kids could all get 80's style Top-Gun names:
Eberle: Iceman, Nugent-Hopkins: Merlin, MPS: Goose, Hall: Maverick, etc. etc.
Deslauriers on waivers too...
ReplyDeleteMaybe Jacques and Pouliot feel left out?
ReplyDeleteSmid is good. Tremendous tools; size, speed, balance, agility, strength. Watching carefully last night, I can see why he gets his share of criticism. Most hockey players will "cheat" in their positions a little as the play develops so they can be in the best spot to make a play. Smid always seems to be a little bit behind in this regard. You see the Penguins coming across the blueline. The puckhandler is challenged by the winger, forced to make a difficult pass to a man circling around the net. Perfect. Now all the blueliner has to do is step away from the crease in front of the recipient of the sloppy pass, and we get possession. Instead, you see Smid standing in front of the net watching this all happen. Only once the Penguin receives the forced pass does Smid head over to challenge him. He makes up for his lack of anticipation by getting there quickly, outmuscling the player, and eventually forcing that player to force a pass, but it could have been so much cleaner, maybe even turned into a quick, clean break out play. Watching this play out over and over again is the frustration with Smid. Tremendous talent, but seems to lack a little of the "hockey sense", yet still manages to be quite successful in the best league in the world.
ReplyDeleteWhat's with RNH? The criticism in his game at draft were too small to be successful at the NHL level, and too much of a playmaker to have value compared to others available in the draft. So what's this 167 pounder doing driving to the net through three large defenders, drawing a delayed penalty on his first effort and still standing with one guy hanging off of him he scores a backhander on the second attempt? Small sample, but completely the opposite of what I was expecting based on what has been discussed on this blog.
Lander looks to be a bit slow at this level. Hopefully he can compensate in other ways. He certainly had a great preseason.
Dubnyk was very very good, and we'll need lots of that.
Are we in a playoff spot this morning?
Canonball Run- The Nuge -Ice Man (super soft)
ReplyDelete@kris,
any line with Hall and Eberle isn't going to get soft minutes on the road.
LT- I guess they can go for beers after playing eachother in the lesser leagues. Maybe they could form an Oiler fallout team in Europe? I think they have franchises set up in Japan and Germany already.
ReplyDeleteI believe progress is in order this season in regards to the standings. However, with almost half the current roster being first or second year players and injuries certain to surface at some point making us even younger, I think a playoff spot is another year off.
ReplyDeleteI see a 10th place finish as likely but the on-ice product will be much more entertaining so the wait will be worth it and watchable.
Hi Grenadetatae,
ReplyDeleteQuite right. I mean that you should try to get weak matchups for that line as much as possible by throwing the other lines out against toughs, making changes when the other teams toughs come out, starting the kids in the Ozone, or at least not the D-zone, as often as possible, etc. But I am just confusing matters. You know what I mean.
After watching most of the first two Penguin games on their western swing, i was concerned that the Oilers would spend most of last night's game getting absolutely schooled by Pittsburgh. Things certainly started out that way in the first (and the first PP goal against), but good on 'em, the Oil were able to work through it and turn the tide, for the most part.
ReplyDeleteStill baffled by the Hordichuk start over Petrell, even with MacIntyre dressed for the road team. Talk about your ceremonial roster spot - barely over 2 minutes TOI for both guys COMBINED. Go with the guys who give you the best chance to win - another PK guy would have been nice given all the PK time. Sutton/Peckham can take care of the rough stuff.
I think Anaheim used to try to hide Getzlaf that way as much as possible.
ReplyDeleteLT, I didn't see Peckham on the right hand side after about halfway through the first. Now considering the amount of food and beer consumed yesterday, I could easily have been dyslexic. It was not the easiest game to watch in our household... a little more hullabaloo than normal.
ReplyDeleteMC said...
ReplyDeleteFunny you picked that time - they had like two EV chances to that point in the game. The game was a bit of a dog for the first 35 minutes or so, although the PP looked nice.
Not really that funny, since my comment essentially said that very same thing.
Thanks for the kind words about last night, guys. We're trying to make everything we do look BIG, make the stories interesting and tell them from different perspectives. Last night was kinda easy, the Oil handed us a fairy tale with the RHN story (and Dubnyk was sick too). Hope you enjoyed it.
ReplyDeleteLander on roster and Brule waived?
ReplyDeletePetry on roster over waiver eligible Chorney?
Its a new day in Oilerland.
Mr. Tambellini is now v3.2
Seeing moves that actually make the team better, I now expect a forward(s) trade for an actual top 3 D before Christmas.
He also needs to re-sign Hemsky.
Do the right thing in both respects please Mr. Tambellini.
The big thing for me is the decision to go with Dubnyk. Coach Renney said all the right things but there was legit worry (imo) they'd keep acting like the NK signing and money meant he was the starter.
ReplyDeleteThat was a big turning point, starting Dubnyk.
There are rumblings on SN today that Smyth might get a couple of games. It's going to bring up an interesting item (Kypreos made it today): what is Smyth supposed to do there? Take the hit? It's at a dangerous spot on the ice (along the boards) and rib/back injuries are possible.
ReplyDeleteAny thoughts on that?
It didn't even look like a penalty at all. Strange times. No penalty when you whack a guy with your stick after the whistle, though.
ReplyDelete@spOILer
ReplyDeleteYeah, reading back, that was a low value add from me. Whoops.
This Kassian fellow might as well buy the house next to Shanahan's.
ReplyDeleteThe Smyth penalty (while dumb) is a result of the refs being told to call hits to the head. That was the first point of contact, so the ref went with 5 and a game. I don't know that Smyth should get a suspension for it (his relatively clean record should prevent harsher scrutiny), but its the kind of call I expect to see in October. No way that gets called in April.
ReplyDeleteHaving never read the rulebook, can someone help me out on the Smyth play? Is Smyth entitled to his space there, to protect himself, or not?
ReplyDeleteWith all the talk of player safety, I've always thought the hit that Kunitz tries to throw there is the one the game should be taking out. I'm just going from memory, so maybe I'm mistaken, but the puck is long gone, there's no real hockey reason for Kunitz to throw that hit at all.
The big thing for me is the decision to go with Dubnyk. Coach Renney said all the right things but there was legit worry (imo) they'd keep acting like the NK signing and money meant he was the starter.
ReplyDeleteThat was a big turning point, starting Dubnyk.
Agreed.
As soon at I posted my last comment, I thought "...and DD started game 1 when he deserved it"
Good things.
Small steps.
The Smyth play is pretty muddy water.
ReplyDelete1) The hit was pretty late.
2) Kunitz was low and putting his head in a vulnerable position. If you're going to hit somebody late like that, and they're unaware of your hit coming you really ought to prepare for the hittee having a spastic reaction in the moment they realize they're about to be clobbered.
3) Smyth was reacting to defend himself against an honest shoulder-to-shoulder hit, rather than a low hit. So his elbows were too high. He was taken by surprise so it's not totally unexpected.
4) Smyth was pretty careless with his stick when Kunitz went down. It doesn't look like the stick hit him, but it did look pretty sloppy.
re: Sutton,
ReplyDeleteI the GDB, some comments about how bad Sutton was, etc. No comments on the play in which he decided to take the slap shot from his end at Johnson.
Seems, like an odd play unless you were watching closely prior. The Oilers managed a line change for the forwards but Sutton and Gilbert were still stuck on the ice after a long shift.
The play, which I think was a smart one allowed both dmen to change and then both teams had to pursue the puck.
Alternative universe view: he makes a pass to one of the forwards in the neutral zone and with all the bodies there, quick attack back into the oiler zone. Best case Sutton changes, but Gilbert is still stuck on the ice.
I liked the play.
I knew Horcoff was going to be used in a primarily defensive roll given the makeup of this team, but it was still shocking to see a 22.2% zonestart for last night's game.
ReplyDeleteHe took 17 faceoffs in the defensive zone. All other Oiler faceoff men combined for 16. He also had 2:30 more SH icetime than the 2nd leading forward on the team.
With 2 rookie centers in the lineup, that's exactly how he should be used.
Misfit:
ReplyDeleteDepends what the goals are this year.
I don't know what the goals are for this seasonn, but I would suspect that if the Oilers start Hall/Hemsky in the O zone all the time all you would be doing is increasing what you have to pay them in coming seasons, and for Hall, Eberle, etc, if this is a learning season anyways, maybe having them in their own zone experiencing that end of the game isn't the world's worst idea?
misfit: good catch Re: Horcoff's zonestart. That is something to watch going forward - the more consistent #10's role, the more we can say Renney is legitimately trying to win this year. Along with giving the start to Dubnyk, TR has demonstrated that he is at least willing to do the obvious things to get EDM wins this year.
ReplyDeleteIt's embarrassing that this is to be considered progress but given recent Oiler seasons this is actually an encouraging sign for me.
"awing" - either a description of Hemsky's stickhandling or a sly Star Wars reference on behalf of our friendly word verifier.
Hey Jfry,
ReplyDeleteyou said:
count me as one who doesn't think that PMS won't have much offensive success...i think it's more likely that he has a jordan staalish career without the physical play.
You do realize that you just coined a new nickname for Maggie, don't you?
speeds: It looks like we both looked at Horcoff's role with respect to organizational goals. You're being pragmatic, sure, but at this point I think Edmonton is ready for the sort of "good problems" that would come its way if the kids have strong years. As a fan, I know I'm ready for that.
ReplyDeleteDesperate, almost. It's been a long few years.
No worries, MC. Some days I'm amazed I can even read, much less write something coherent.
ReplyDeleteshowerhead:
ReplyDeletePragmatic, maybe, I'm not necessrilyendorsing that, just throwing it out there.I do think using Horcoff more in the defensive zone is a sensible way to run the bench if you're REALLY trying to win games, but if you are REALLY trying to wind games I do find it a bit surprising they didn't look for another D.
I do have to say that starting Dubnyk is a pretty good indicator that performance is going to be given precedence over resume.
Just because you're going to get hit doesn't mean your have the right to get your elbows up to protect yourself.
ReplyDeleteCan you imagine what the corners would look like if that were allowed?
Just something that I didn't see anyone else mention:
ReplyDelete- great job by 24 and 57 killing that last major penalty. I thought 24 was having a brutal game in terms of glaring mistakes but then he made a couple of nice stick plays late in the game.
also, 20 wasn't skating right at all. there are rumours of a sore back and he looked to be suffering when he was skating or when he'd come up from his faceoff stance.
ReplyDeleteAgreed on the good catch.
ReplyDeleteHere's your zone starts from last night:
ANTONLANDER 100
DARCYHORDICHUK 100
JORDANEBERLE 75
RYANJONES 66.7
THEOPECKHAM 66.7
ERICBELANGER 62.5
RYANSMYTH 62.5
JEFFPETRY 60
CAMERONBARKER 54.5
LADISLAVSMID 50
TAYLORHALL 44.4
RYANNUGENT-HOPKINS 40
ALESHEMSKY 40
LINUSOMARK 28.6
TOMGILBERT 27.3
ANDYSUTTON 27.3
MAGNUSPAAJARVI-SVENSSON 25
SHAWNHORCOFF 22.2
Looks like some coaching happened.
Not sure I'd arrange my lines that way if I'm giving 10 the heaving lifting.
I'd probably switch up 91 with 94 at the very least.
Schmidty: that is what corners look like. When players are scrumming, shoulder-to-shoulder, they're always pushing each other around with their elbows. Smyth's reaction is a fairly typical reaction to a shoulder-to-shoulder hit situation, especially when it's slower and players are struggling for position. When players like Jagr do it, they call it "sheltering the puck".
ReplyDeleteSmyth not only raised his elbow but he pushed it into him. It was a pretty clear elbow when I look at it using the PVR. It could well be a suspension.
ReplyDeleteWG
ReplyDeleteAt first glance that list looks indicative of special teams play and the automatic zone face-off.
Speeds: I think for a coach, winning is always the goal (coaches who don't win aren't employed for long), and giving your offensive stars as much time in the offensive zone as possible and limiting the defensive zone time of your rookies is likely the way to go.
ReplyDeleteI can't imagine Renney is worrying too much about how much the kids will make 2-3 years from now. For all he knows, he could be out of a job by then. Winning games will keep him employed.
spOILer: Those are 5x5 stats only.
ReplyDeleteBy "elbows up" I meant "elbows to the head." I agree that pushing with forearms and elbows are commonplace and acceptable. Elbowing someone in the head is not. Its the same as highsticking. You must be in control of your stick (or elbows) at all times. If you hit someone in the head you are called for a penalty, even if its an accident.
ReplyDeleteI don't believe Smytty intentionally targeted Kunitz but I do believe it was a minor penalty.
You look at what they did last night from a coaching perspective and I think Renney is actually going to try to win games this ear. They made the right call on the goaltender. The penalty kill was actually pretty damn decent as opposed to the chaos of last year.
ReplyDeleteIt looks like Horcoff and Belanger are going to carry the load as far as defense goes among the forwards which is fine. For years the Sedins were being air lifted into O zone starts, that turned out well for them. I can't imagine it will hurt our young guns to give them plenty of chances to suceed offensively.
If we're keeping Smyth past this season, it looks to me like one of Hemsky, Omark and Gagner are on the way out the door. There are only 9 top 9 spots and we've got ten guys and Hartikainen knocking on the door.
Now this is premised on the fact The Nuge has looked ready to go in preaseason and in the first game. That's likely premature. But generally I expected him to get sent back to Red Deer told to eat his wheaties, put on a couple pounds and come back bigger stronger etc. He's a shifty bugger out there and a wizard when it comes to passing the puck. He reminds me a bit of Adam Oates with his ability to find the open man.
But presuming he doesn't faulter in the next nine games, there isn't much point in sending Lander down to Oklahoma and playing RNH on the 4th line. Nor can I see much point in playing Gagner on the 4th line. They aren't energy players or thunderous body checkers.
Gagner has shown some talent defensively, he stil is terribly inept at draws. I wonder if the best thing wouldn't be to trade Omark and play Gagner with Horcoff and MPS. That could actually wind up being a pretty damn solid two way line with some offensive juice.
I supose the alternative is to flip Gagner or Hemsky for a defenseman. I admittedly don't like either of those options as I think you're going to be accepting a worse player back than you're giving away. As much as I like Omark's skill, I think of the top 9 forwards he is likely the odd man out. Perhaps he can be packaged with something to get us a decent right handed d-man in return. A team in dire need of forwards like Nashville or Toronto should be interested.
....OK I'll just get it over with and eat the crow now on RNH - kid looked good last night.
ReplyDelete....back to watching goalers. Will try keep an eye on Bunz and the Finns this year - most interesting prospects in net since we drafted DD (not a Roy fan at all - kid's channelling his inner JDD).
I felt that although Tom Gilbert was less of a liability in this game than in many others, that he still looked week out there. Barker looked more effective with the puck (especially on the PP) and Gilbert constantly looks like he's fighting the puck to stay on his stick when he has it. He turns pucks over in the defensive end more than any other Oiler D-man. Is this just something that goes hand-in-hand with being on the ice more than other defenders? Possibly, but you wont see a top 2 defenceman on any other team turn pucks over like this guy does. He's a good bottom 4 D-man imo. A number 3 that can play some PP some nights and a number 5 that should be seeing a lot more pine others. I wish we could sit side-by-side when the game was on so I could point out the things that I'm seeing and listen to the things you are because I think we could both mutually benefit from that experience. Someday maybe. Other than that I find your analysis to be pretty spot on.
ReplyDeleteHartikainen does not need to be handed top 9 minutes without actually outplaying one of Hall/Smyth/Paajarvi. There's nothing wrong with having him as your #4LW or having a 4LW who can play up in the lineup when you have injuries.
ReplyDeleteGabe has his behind the net stats up already, Barker's CorsiRel is -38.1. :-)
ReplyDeleteI wasn't saying he should be misfit. I said Hartikeinen is knocking on the door. He is and I expect he gets his shot when an injury comes along again. But my point was we have more top 9 guys than we have ice time for. Something has got to give as it looks unlikely they send RNH down right now.
ReplyDeleteWhen players are scrumming, shoulder-to-shoulder, they're always pushing each other around with their elbows. Smyth's reaction is a fairly typical reaction to a shoulder-to-shoulder hit situation, especially when it's slower and players are struggling for position. When players like Jagr do it, they call it "sheltering the puck".
ReplyDeleteThat is a good point too. I still think, based on the Shanahan videos released to this point, the refs have been instructed to look at a hit where the initial point of contact is someone's head and imo, decide if it isn't worth a five and a game.
They are calling all of them right now, which will taper off as the season goes along. No idea if that means a suspension for Smyth or not (I hope not).
And I thought Gilbert looked pretty damn solid out there. I supose haters are going hate and all. But geez Gilbert is not the problem. If we had two more of Gilbert this could be a playoff team.
ReplyDeleteHartikainen does not need to be handed top 9 minutes without actually outplaying one of Hall/Smyth/Paajarvi. There's nothing wrong with having him as your #4LW or having a 4LW who can play up in the lineup when you have injuries.
ReplyDeleteAmen.
Where is the unforced turnover stat? Gilbert would be a team leader on D anyways. Also to tell me that Barker did not move the puck well on the powerplay would be a blind lie. Neither is perfect and at this time I'm not prepared to say Barker is better at all, but he did look good on the powerplay and was a little nastier to have to play against in the defensive zone. Good on Gilbert for moving the puck in the right direction last night and it appears as Gilbert did more at evens but as I scroll through Behind the Net's stats it appears as if Barker played with similar (slightly better) team mates against tougher competition. I'd say over-all Barker and Gilbert had equal nights. Barker still looked more skilled and qualified for the power play in my eye. Haters come in may forms, Chris, like those who refuse to acknowledge the cons as well as the pros they see in a players game. Tom Gilbert x7 on the Oilers would not make us a playoff team imo. Maybe a fringe team. He's not hard enough to play against and his puck skills are only slightly above average imo. Gilbert had a good night on the penalty kill, he's pretty good at getting in the lanes (probably better than Barker) so he has that going for him. I hate being referred to as a hater because I'm on the other side of a valid argument. Advanced stats be damned, Tom Gilbert is not our salvation.
ReplyDeleteIf JDD is on waivers they may want to grab him. Yan Danis gave up 4 goals on 19 shots in a 7-0 loss on the farm last night.
ReplyDeleteDucey - They'd have to play him on the big club if they put in a claim.
ReplyDeleteSt. Louis looks really good against the Flames this afternoon. I can't decide if it is a matter of the Blues playing well or the Flames looking like a team that is in transition.
ReplyDeleteWhich Eskimos team do we see today? The good one or the not so good one?
ReplyDeleteSmid made a great play in close in (I think it was) the third, knocked a forechecking on his ass by the side of the net when DD was down and out on the other side. Pretty sure that saved a great scoring chance against.
ReplyDeleteSome days he's Niinimaa at his worst, others he's Jason Smith at his best. Last night was more Jason than Janne.
Tell the wife her team is going down, LT. Oh yea.
ReplyDeleteAlready have. Already have. :-)
ReplyDeleteTambellini makes a single pre-Christmas trade at his peril.
ReplyDeleteOmark won't get more than fifteen cents to the potential dollar, Hemsky won't get much either, nor will anyone not named you-know-who.
Lowetide: It's weird seeing my blog advertised - you were the only reason I made it to begin with. You of course, just wanted me to leave and instead of being a prick like most, you "advised" me to get a blog.
Speaking of my blog: Anyone who still wants to go on record with their Western Conference 1-15 list, there's still time to register your October predictions there.
Jon Willis tracked puck movement out of the Dzone for last night's game.
ReplyDeleteInteresting stuff there.
Jon has some good interpretations of the data as well.
Where is the unforced turnover stat? Gilbert would be a team leader on D anyways.
ReplyDeleteActually for last night Willis' Dzone puck movement tracking gives Gilbert 8 successful times he moved the puck out of the zone and only 1 turn over.
Neither is perfect and at this time I'm not prepared to say Barker is better [than Gilbert] at all...
ReplyDeleteLordy.
St. Louis looks really good against the Flames this afternoon. I can't decide if it is a matter of the Blues playing well or the Flames looking like a team that is in transition.
ReplyDelete56% column A
44% column B
Fucking Willis. Spends all night searching for a way to make that loser Gilbert look good.
ReplyDeletebut as I scroll through Behind the Net's stats it appears as if Barker played with similar (slightly better) team mates against tougher competition.
ReplyDeleteQualComp and QualTeam this early in the season mean next to nothing due to infinitesimal sample sizes.
I'd say over-all Barker and Gilbert had equal nights.
Ozone starts:
CAMERONBARKER 54.5
TOMGILBERT 27.3
They certainly didn't start in the same place.
The Flames will not look good for another 2 months. They always stink to start the season. And then charge back to miss it, by this much.
ReplyDeleteHey Asia. Question for you. I heard Karlsson (Cal) drops too much and thus gets beaten high. Is this something DD has to this point avoided? Or does he have the same issues on going down b/c he's so big? I haven't noticed it, but I'm no expert.
@Woodguy Good data and about what I would have expected from last night. I really enjoy the play of Petry, even if it looks less refined then perhaps at times it did last year. I find in general (in regard to Petry) that he is less noticeable on both ends of the ice so far this year than last. He's not been driving offense in the offensive zone with some of the same charisma he has shown at times but on defence he's making fewer mistakes that one could call a "rookie mistake". I did notice some giveaways from Petry last night that still show he has work to do but overall I enjoy the game he brings. Gilbert did have what I thought for himself was a better than average night (we needed it) but the week comment remains. Last night he played well and I still thought he turned the puck over in situations I was uncomfortable with. I have never said Tom was a bad defenceman but I think that we ask too much of him based on our lack of depth and that as a top 2 d-man I'm not sold on his style of play either. I would prefer any one of Niinimaa, Mironov, Hamrlik, Spacek or Visnovsky better from teams of the past. I like Gilbert about as much as I would say I liked Pitkanen or Grebeshkov. Pitkanen I think I like more now than when he was an Oiler but I'm not sure I would want him to be the best defenceman on my team if I really want to do damage. Same's certainly to be said and with Grebeshkov. I think an excellent night for Gilbert reflects a number 2 defenceman but that his average night relfects a 3-4 on an average team. If I were looking to contend in the playoffs I would want him to be relied on no more than a 3 period. Is that fair or am I one crazy pills? If so I'll keep my opinion to myself from now on and you can bask in Tom Gilbert's brilliance without me ruining it and we can agree on 99% of everything else.
ReplyDeleteFlame's are fine; superstar Iginla = check. international star goalie Kiprisoff = check.
ReplyDeleteLast made playoffs when Oilers did, lol.
I hear Gilbert reads this blog regularly; no wonder he's starting to finally get it.
ReplyDeleteA feew years ago, I wrote, trade Gilbert and keep Grebs.. Based on what I saw last night, I am now very much on the side of keeping
ReplyDeleteGilbert.
Wonder who the guy was that got him from Colorado for a washed up Tommy Salo...Some guy that knows defensemen?
shypeezr
If JDD is on waivers they may want to grab him.
ReplyDeleteJDD has a one-way contract for next year.
Yeah, no thanks
PIC,
ReplyDeleteI think Gilbert's optimal position is 2nd pairing, 2PK and 2PP. He'd thrive.
He's done yeoman's work on the top pairing on the Oilers due to lack of better options.
Also,
Tyler is starting an open source Oiler project
Looks pretty interesting.
@Woodguy Just volunteered. I may need to acquire a pvr or some equivalent before I'm much use though, we'll have to see.
ReplyDeleteSmyth's reaction to the play:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.edmontonsun.com/2011/10/10/oilers-smyths-elbow-a-major-surprise
As for Omark, it's one game, he got 11:52 of ice time (4th least on the team) and still had some nice stickwork behind the net and got 3 shots off.
ReplyDeleteThe guy's a dynamic talent and it will show up on the scoresheet soon. Only I'd prefer someone other than Horcoff centering the Swedes.
If the Oilers are to trade a player for a defenseman, I'd prefer a guy without such a high ceiling.
I like watching 23 play and I have no idea how good he could be and let's face it he's not gonna get a push over the kids so there's only so much quality he'll play with.
ReplyDeleteSo, you're not likely to get full value for him.
That being said not everyone's gonna be able to get paid or get the TOI necessary to put up points so someone has to go for a D and there's a good chance we'll still be OK even if we don't win the particular trade.
Souray 3PTS in 3GP +2
ReplyDeleteNow that is asset management.
There's a gathering storm in Gary's world.
ReplyDelete"Announced" attendance in Columbus tonight...9,387
6,306 in Dallas.
Yikes
Wasn't there a ballgame in Dallas? Might be part of it.
ReplyDeleteDon't really recall thinking that before.
ReplyDeleteLOL. Or writing it, either.
[Gilbert] turns pucks over in the defensive end more than any other Oiler D-man. Is this just something that goes hand-in-hand with being on the ice more than other defenders?
Back when Toronto won the World Series, Alomar was talked about in this way. Wise baseball observers noted he wasn't making many errors on balls he got to in his own area code. Some commented that he was adjusting his stance as the ball came off the pitcher's fingers, and that most of his defensive genius transpired before the ball was struck.
I used to wonder: Wow, how does that look to the casual fan? Love that feeling of wonder with a wow on top.
One can almost imagine a guy like Robbie getting a high-five from the coach after committing an error: "Unbleepingbelievable, Robbie; but hey, next time open your glove". "OK coach." Coaches are just so detail oriented. It's a true gift to be that far outside your comfort zone that often. It's not quite the same thing, but one has to wonder how much Gilbert is afflicted with 26m of one-armed-man.
Stud defenders are hallowed at peak. How many make it there with nary a hesitation? There's plenty of trash talk in the HOF over this. "Hey, you were pretty shaky in your sophomore season, no box seat for you; and YOU can sit beside the penalty box 'cos that's where you spent half your career." Studliness is next to godliness, but I think we remember more of it than there was, with box seat exceptions.
I've read that the number one limitation on fighter pilots is cognitive burden. There's so much going on so fast, it takes years of experience to confidently structure the attention stream. Five correct decisions in 2s not good enough; now try for 5 correct decisions in 2s in the right order. I'm talking big decisions. Small decisions come three times as fast.
The old guys must really love flying combat reaction exercises in tight formation with four fast twitch champions fresh out of flight school. You have to wonder if a few of those liver patch flight bobbles were shrewd and nervous dekes anticipating CLMs from the rookies that might have happened, but fortunately didn't. Robbie must have made seven adjustments from fingers to plate on wing tip tremor alone.
Elite defenders live in the twitchy world of anticipating things that might have been. Like breaking the sound barrier, there's a lot of unflattering turbulence until you punch through. If you punch through. There's the rub.
@LT
ReplyDeleteThe NHL counts "tickets distributed".
Don't know how many season tickets they've sold but actual attendance must have been close to zero.
"Wasn't there a ballgame in Dallas? Might be part of it."
ReplyDeleteThe night Kirk Gibson hit his "The Natural" home run of Eck in the MLB WS, we were in a jam-packed Not-So Fabulous Forum watching Gretzky's Kings host, I dunno, might have been the Flyers, in Game 3 or 4 of the regular season.
If DAL or CLB can't support their hockey teams, there's a soon-to-be-empty building on 118th Avenue that will be looking for a tenant.
I mention this in case Mayor Mandel's interested in the facts about NHL attendance, instead of merely going to New York on my dime to load up on Bettman Civic Extortion Ammo for the rubes back home.
Fighter pilots make a really funny sound when thinking hard: Shit! Shit! Shit! Shit! Shit!
ReplyDeleteClick. 2 seconds flat. Good job.
Bar Qu: In regards to DD dropping too much...
ReplyDeleteI think it's more a matter of timing than anything.
I had a chance to watch the Canucks slaughter the Oilers 7-2 a couple of years ago and I spent the game in row 7 just behing the Oilers net for two periods. JDD started but Dubnyk took over. I would say 6 of the 7 goals were scored just under the bar.
Dubnyk was only beaten twice if I recall but the thing I noticed was that both guys were a little early dropping into the butterfly.
These guys maybe 6 and a half feet tall but they aren't 4 feet wide so there is still room in the top corners. Not so much along the ice where I'm pretty sure they can cover the entire bottom of the net.
I felt that both JDD and Dubnyk were both guilty of committing too early to the butterfly. After all that's what got them too the show. However, shooters are obviously better at the NHL level than any other. And these guys were getting burned anticipating rather than reacting.
I feel Dubnyk has vastly improved his ability to read a shooter and not just depend on his size. The longer he stays on his feet the less net a shooter will see up top.
It used to be that 90% of goals were scored along the ice but I think that stat has probably reversed over the last 25 years because of the way goaltending has changed. Shooters now target the top of the net even on taller guys because they know once a guy goes down there's nothing there.
I'd be willing to bet that every goalie in the league drops to their knees for over 95% of shots. The development of backside recovery has allowed goalies to go down into butterfly and get across the net quicker without having to get up. Brodeur is probably the exception but he's old school and would be made an example of how not to be a goalie in modern goalie schools.
I think Karlsson is probably at the same point Dubnyk was 2 years ago in terms of timing/anticipation/reaction.
I know it's long winded but hope it helps!
BTW I was at the Jets/Habs season opener in Winnipeg.....
ReplyDeleteUnfreakingbelievable!
Take note Edmonton. Support your team even if they suck because the alternative is much less fun.
For me a Stanley Cup in Winnipeg would be out of this world. However, it is not by any means a necessity. To be entertained by the best hockey players in the world on any given night be they Winnipeg Jets or Edmonton Oilers or Nashville Predators is the goal.
I know it's hard to emotionally divest yourself of the home team's successes and failures but it has almost become a necessity given the fact that only 1 team every year wins the Cup. So as long as there is good effort and good entertainment I'll be happy. Go Jets! Go Oilers! Get a new building done that makes sense for everybody.
Thanks Wolfie. I kinda figured that DD is playing a pretty positionally sound game (just based on yesterday) but I don't know goalies.
ReplyDeleteI know a few guys who envy you that experience in the 'Peg. Who'd you kill to get tickets? ;-)
Everest re HF Boards
ReplyDeleteSomewhere earlier in this thread or the GDT, someone calls this a "dumb-dumb play" by Smyth.
I totally disagreed.
However, I have no trouble acknowledging it as a "dirty play".
In fact...this is more than dirty. This is 'Classic Dirty' and I love it.
Mr. Hockey, Mark Messier and many many others before & after have these types of subtle (or not) self-preservation techniques built into their mystique(s).
This is an elbow which prevents concussions and its rather sad how few hockey folks understand the concept.
As an extra measure of precise detail...I will also submit the wizardly wise placement of Smitty's stick as it whips from over his shoulder and then down like a gavel upon Kunitz' chiclets as he tumbles to the frozen canvas.
Classic. Dirty. But classic. And neccesary, to be sure.
I like Kunitz. He's a heavy hitter. Out of Regina Sask. I don't want to see him hurt.
I just want to see him slow down and take a "thinking" stride.
Next time... he will.
Summed my feelings exactly. The only thing Smytty didn't do is step over him and skate away.
Absolutely loved it, I was whooping like a madman.
Just to comment on the Smyth penalty. It sure looked like the pens player was coming in for a late hit.
ReplyDeleteIt was obviously a hit where Smyth was trying to defend himself. From getting slammed by a player, who looked at the time to be charging at him for a late hit.
I don't think he will get more games, the penalty was justice enough. I hope anyways.
I think the referee was Bruce Hood, that would have looked at a play like that - nodded his head and skated away.
ReplyDeleteThe veteran presence, eh? Exactly
I know I'm going to teach my son to protect himself when someone's coming at him. Getting your stick and elbow's up may be part of it.
ReplyDeleteIt's better the other guy gets hurt than you.
Bar Qu: I had a feeling getting tickets for Jets games was going to be insane. A friend of mine was a Moose Season Ticket Holder and he agreed to buy extra season seats for a group of guys I put together to split. I jumped the line so to speak to get in on the pre-sales. Since I organized it, I picked first, hence the season opener. Also have the Oilers in February! I'll be cheering every goal from both teams!
It isn't that Horcoff is a bad player. He gets the job done on defence but adds very little on the O side. In fact the effort is often laughable, and for what he brings, (for 50 games a year) the contracts laughable. He's the Oiler equivalent of Tim Connelly and David Legwand.
ReplyDelete@ Art Vandelay
ReplyDeleteBettman has already indicated that Rexall Place is NOT suitable for NHL hockey.
While it may seem logical to relocate a team from a sunbelt market to Edmonton, the NHL will not give a pass to anyone who is guaranteed to lose money in Edmonton.
If you can't make a buck with a sold out building, some of the highest ticket prices in the league and a Canadian dollar at its peak, the future would be dismal.
Northlands could spend a quarter billion taxpayer dollars putting lipstick on the pig but, at the end of the day, it's a losing proposition.
The Edmonton market is substantially smaller than every other Canadian team except Ottawa and Winnipeg and both of those teams have newer buildings.
'Was that Hall that made that pass from behind the net?'
ReplyDelete"Yeah, it was Hall! It was Hall. It was Hall.' said my laughing friend.
Eberle's goal could have used some faster hands¡
ReplyDeleteI can see Lander drawing a lot of penalties. Nice pass in OT.
94! Doubt Shanny gives him anything.
The giraffe was great.
Gilbert was keeping it in the zone well. I think it's funny/funny that he 'decided' to add grit to his game. I hope the rest of the team to decide to make 'better passes' and 'be more physical'. I also wonder about the coaching here.
THE NUGE HAS GREAT HANDS.
Finger Biters on Saturday. Last game Hall gets an elbow. Finger Biter also elbows Eberle in the head last game vs. in regular season, so, last game. Shanny should watch this game in its entirety.
Funny that Smyth elbow.
ReplyDeleteThe other player was clearly attempting to hit him hard, even hoping Smyth wouldn't see the hit coming.
Wily Smyth however, managed to pull my martial art teacher's kind of move when confronted by any idiot - he dealt out some rough justice on the Penguin.
When they don't allow a player to protect himself, it's ballet on ice. Who knows? Some of you will enjoy it.
What happens in two weeks with the arena deadline? If the city calls a Billionaires bluff...what happens when they lose? Future will look bright in Quebec city, Im sure of that. Their new arena will be bought with transfer payments anyways sooooo...were kinda buying it for them and then possibly giving them a team play in it.
ReplyDeleteAs mentioned earlier, the Smyth hit was an elbow - someone called it classic dirty - I like that - I agree.
ReplyDeleteYou have to play at the margins of the rules to be succesful, sometimes you go over, that's ok even if you get a short suspension.
@Unknown:
ReplyDeleteI could care less if Katz takes the Oilers out of town. In 3-5 years we end up with any one of 6 current teams who would be fighting amongst themselves to play in Edmonton.
To hell with the Oilers - it would be fun watching them move to some soft market then flounder, the pricks. It's not the 90's anymore guys.