Torrey got the gig on the Island because of an outstanding resume, and proceeded to lay waste to the idea that an expansion team couldn't win titles. The club had a ridiculous scouting department (Jim Devellano was the director, Gerry Ehman won the west) and every year they'd go to the entry draft (held always in those days at the Queen Elizabeth Hotel in Montreal, PQ) and pile on the quality kids.
Here's the NHL draft list (first three picks each year) for the NY Islanders from 1972 (their first year of existence) through 1974. Three drafts that had a huge impact on the following decade:
1972
- 1st overall: R Billy Harris (897 games) Toronto OHA
- 17th overall: C Lorne Henning (543 games) New Westminster WHL
- 33rd overall: R Bob Nystrom (900 games) Calgary WHL
1973
- 1st overall: D Denis Potvin (1060 games) Ottawa OHA
- 33rd overall: D Dave Lewis (1008 games) Saskatoon WHL
- 49th overall: C Andre St. Laurent (644 games) Montreal Red White and Blue (QMJHL)
1974
- 4th overall: L Clark Gillies (958 games) Regina (WHL)
- 22nd overall: C Bryan Trottier (1279 games) Swift Current (WHL)
- 40th overall: C Brad Anderson Victoria (WHL)
--
When we talk about the Oilers at the draft table, credit is often given to Stu (Magnficent Bastard) MacGregor. While MBS is deserving, there are a lot of guys who contribute who rarely get a mention. Leading up to the draft, the Oilers published their scouts names and areas they cover. Since it doesn't happen often, I wanted to take the time to post it so we can know the names of the men doing all this good work.
- Bill Dandy: QMJHL
- Brad Davis: OHL, tier 2 leagues in Q and O
- Kent Hawley: OHL, QMJHL, tier 2 leagues in Q and O
- Bob Brown: WHL, tier 2 leagues, USHL
- Jim Crosson: WHL, tier 2 leagues, USHL
- Scott Harlow: NCAA and American junior leagues (east coast)
- Frank Musil: Europe
- Pelle Eklund: Europe
- Robert Nordmark: Europe
- Stu MacGregor: WHL, cross checks the world
- RNH: Brown, Crosson, MacGregor
- Klefbom: Musil, Eklund, Nordmark, MacGregor
- Musil: Brown, Crosson, MacGregor
- Perhonen: Musil, Eklund, Nordmark, MacGregor
- Ewanyk: Brown, Crosson, MacGregor
- Simpson: Harlow, MacGregor
- Rieder: Davis, Hawley, MacGregor
- Gernat: Musil, Eklund, Nordmark, MacGregor
- Tuohimaa: Musil, Eklund, Nordmark, MacGregor
Any mistakes, let me know.
A very worthy post. Names of MBS's top men. I wish I could shake their hands. They've done some good work.
ReplyDeleteSays alot about your preferences when you have 1 american scouts and 3 western scouts.
ReplyDeleteHappy Europe and the Q aren't left out. Land of the gems.
LT:
ReplyDeleteYou're putting so much of yourself into Stu's draft prowess you can't help but be burned.
Not one of his draft choices has proved your theory yet...not one.
Hall and Eberle were pretty much no brainers and Paajarvi, IMO, won't realize his draft potential.
Might be prudent to wait a year or two before the coronation.
Well Christ, DSF. I've already ordered the flowers! Would have been nice if you'd mentioned this a little fricking earlier.
ReplyDeleteFINE! Anyone need potpourri?
DSF: Not just that.
ReplyDeleteHamilton, Marincin, Martindale, Bunz, Blain, Roy, Davidson, Lander, Hartikainen are all outside picks who are tracking exeptionally well.
Lolz @ Lowetide
ReplyDeletesince 2006, excluding Grabner(traded and waivered), Vancouver has drafted 35 players and they have a total 21 NHL games played.
ReplyDeleteThat's a rough stretch.
The head scout cross checks the world, but he also designs the scouting program. It sounds to me like Stu may have one of the more 'psychological' scouting processes meaning that he cares a lot about what is going on in a players head and wants to predict how they will react through pro development and in the professional leagues. We will see, in time, if things work out well.
ReplyDeleteBookie: Sounds like it.
ReplyDeleteI know MTL do that. Trevor Timmins has specific rules about scouting for each of his scouts.
Mainly they are obligated, (Unless it's an overager) to go check on the background of players (Parents, personal habits, etc) if they want to suggest one at the draft. Even for the late round picks.
I know some teams don't go there. It seems to be working.
All of this explains why the Oilers have drafted and scoured heavily over Swedes and Slovaks.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers have also taken a page from Calgary and that is "know your backyard". The Oilers seem to have a lot hands on deck in the Dub.
I see Mike Peluso threw us that gem Troy Hesketh and now I see his name isn't on the list, just as well. I'm guessing he was a Predergast guy.
Bill Dandy must be twiddling his thumbs for something positive to happen for him from the Q.
Funny to see Jim Crosson's name on here. I applied for gig with Lloydminster of the AJHL when he was running the team. Heckuva nice guy.
ReplyDeleteHall and Eberle were pretty much no brainers.
ReplyDeleteHall I can understand - but Eberle was a no brainer at 22? Projected 29th by MacKenzie.
http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=7125
Colbourne, Gardiner, Pickard, Sbisa, Del Zotto, and Gustafsson were the picks right before him.
There were questions surrounding Eberle - his speed, his size, and he was at that time barely above a PPG.
Yet he was a no-brainer?
Give it a rest, grandpa.
DM: There's 3 outside picks from the Q and all are tracking well.
ReplyDeleteCVV was outgunned by Cornet in the minors.
Don't mind DSF.
ReplyDeleteHe's probably just a little bitter that his favorite Dys prospect, Sergei Shirokov, was recently traded by the Dys to FLA for Mike Duco, an AHL tough guy.
DSF loudly trumpeted that Sergei Shirokov was an elite prospect who was better than anyone the Oilers had.
The elite prospect wasn't able to score better than .76pts/gm during his two years in the AHL and recently signed to play in the KHL. Maybe Tallon can convince him to stay in the North America.
As danny pointed out, the Dys amateur acquisition department has been a little wanting for 5 or so years, so cut the guy some slack.
LT,
I could use some potpourri. Been eating a lot of red meat lately. Lordy.
So, anyone else from HF remember the time DSF argued Shirokov better than Eberle?
ReplyDeletelol.
I thought the Oiler scouts were sharing video, and that there now was a video aspect to the scouting that everyone participated in.
ReplyDeletei.e. everyone ultiimately saw everyone, at least on video.
As danny pointed out, the Dys amateur acquisition department has been a little wanting for 5 or so years, so cut the guy some slack.
ReplyDeleteI couldn't give a flip about the Canucks, but this isn't how success is measured in the NHL, so who gives a shit?
LT: I think it's unrealistic to assume MacGregor can just be tacked on to every single region like an equal contributor. He can't possibly do that much.
Interesting that they didn't mention Matti Virmanen at all, since he was mentioned by Tambo in his post draft assessment as being really high on both Finnish goalies they drafted. I guess he is officially a pro scout, but he does do some amateur scouting as well.
ReplyDeleteEetu: Good catch, and thanks for the link. I didn't see that video.
ReplyDeleteTwo guys you left off that list of Oilers staff who do a lot of scouting are a couple of low profile guys named Steve Tambellini and Kevin Lowe.
ReplyDeleteThere is a very team-oriented approach to drafting these days, with all opinions acknowledged and respected. No more one-man bands sending them down Coke Machine Alley.
DSF loudly trumpeted that Sergei Shirokov was an elite prospect who was better than anyone the Oilers had.
ReplyDeleteThis made my morning a little better.
I couldn't give a flip about the Canucks, but this isn't how success is measured in the NHL, so who gives a shit?
ReplyDeleteSo what does winning in the NHL have to do with a post where I give DSF the gears a bit?
I remember Stu saying that they liked to "cross areas" as well, so that they got more than one take on the prospects.
ReplyDeleteAs much as it is fashionable to rag on K Lowe for various aspects of management ability, as magisterrex suggests you have to wonder what kind of input he has when defensemen are being drafted
ReplyDeleteI think it's unrealistic to assume MacGregor can just be tacked on to every single region like an equal contributor
ReplyDeleteNo doubt.
But once the regional guys have a short list, I'm sure MacGregor becomes very involved.
redne - An Albertan who stuck something out
That goof eklund says hemsky on the move to either mtl, colorado, nyi, vancouver. E4
ReplyDeleteThis seems like bs. Two teams in the division and two teams that are weak with defenseman. Doesnt add up.
Prickesh: what dean lombardi seems like lately
Let's keep in mind how long it took after that 1974 draft for the Isles to win.
ReplyDeleteAnd they would add Bossy and Billy Smith too.
Our top 3 picks by year in comparison...
2008:
22nd
103rd
133rd
2009:
10th
40th
71st
2010:
1st
31st
46th
2011:
1st
19th
31st
Isles had nicers slots.
Islanders may not have won the Stanley for a few years but they were a quality NHL team by the mid 1970's.
ReplyDeleteYeah, that's definitely true.... I remember being shocked at how quickly the powerhouse Blueshirts lost their grip over the old Patrick. It was like the Isles came from nowhere.
ReplyDeleteNow where do we find 3 mean son of a bitches like Potvin, Gillies and Trottier to play for our guys?
ReplyDeleteBlogger danny said...
ReplyDeletesince 2006, excluding Grabner(traded and waivered), Vancouver has drafted 35 players and they have a total 21 NHL games played.
That's a rough stretch.
Winning the NW 3 years running and likely to win it be default for another 2-3 years is really a rough stretch.
Also worth repeating that the Stanley Cup champion Boston Bruins had exactly ONE of their own draft picks on their playoff roster.
While accumulating assets through the draft is one way to build a winner, it's what you do after you've collected all those hockey cards that makes a difference.
The acclaimed Dean Lombardi has been doing this since he took over in LA and is now faced with the hard reality of how to get to the next level.
AS RQ has stated, drafting a bunch of guys isn't how success is measured.
It's the easy part.
ReplyDeleteAlso worth repeating that the Stanley Cup champion Boston Bruins had exactly ONE of their own draft picks on their playoff roster.
Marchand. Seguiin. Bergeron. Krejci.
Still waiting for your response to Eberle being a ''no-brainer''
Omm off the top of my head, I can name 4 Bruins drafted by Boston that played in feeding Vancouver their asses.
ReplyDeleteBergeron, Marchand, Lucic, seguin.... Do we have to see who they got from trading away their successful picks as well?
RQ, seriously? Drafting matters a little bit no? By your standard, they don't give trophies for save %s, for powerplay or pk %s, so we can't talk about those things either?
AS RQ has stated, drafting a bunch of guys isn't how success is measured.
ReplyDeleteIt's the easy part.
If it's the easy part, why didn't Vancouver do a better job of it? They could have traded away good assets like the Stanley Cup Champion Bruins, or improved their own depth at vital positions like defense when injuries came to key players?
Seems like someone can't take criticism where it's clearly warranted.
Do not like Canucks but they have a very very good team.
ReplyDeleteTrust everyone also remembers that NYI disappointed before they learned to win. Ditto Oilers!
Lots easier to add players when you are terrible. Plus do you remember the great oiler draft picks that cracked our lineup when we were real good? Mark "chicken hawk" Habscied? Selmar Odelien?Scott Metcalfe? Kim Issel? Peter Soberlak?
Course Barry Fraser retired and simply forgot to tell Slats that he used a dart board to make draft picks in mid 80's
AS RQ has stated, drafting a bunch of guys isn't how success is measured.
ReplyDeleteI think they measure it by the number of Cups you have. How's your team doing :-)
BTW, to italicize you put an i in between <> at the beginning of the part you want to highlight and then /i between <> to close it off.
Try it some time.
Course Barry Fraser retired and simply forgot to tell Slats that he used a dart board to make draft picks in mid 80's
ReplyDeleteHas anyone in the MSN ever done any investigation into what happened with Fraser?
He moved to Mexico, which probably did not help, and he had lots of success off the hop - which probably led him to believe he was smarter than everyone else. Maybe he got lazy, or maybe he hired a bunch of lugnuts as area scouts. Maybe he got lucky early and unlucky late.
It would be interesting to learn more about it.
RQ, seriously? Drafting matters a little bit no? By your standard, they don't give trophies for save %s, for powerplay or pk %s, so we can't talk about those things either?
ReplyDeleteWho said anything about trophies? Truthfully, if you build a good team and post strong run of play results for a few years, you'll eventually collect some hardware. Goal differential, shooting differential, etc with context considered is probably the best way to measure success in the NHL. Trophies do take at least a little luck, but if a team manages a 4-5 yr window of good underlying results they'll probably win something in that time, so that's a realistic goal IMO.
Drafting is one means to an end. I would say acquiring NHL talent via trades and free agency is equally important. Making appropriate assessments of internal and external NHL talent and then allocating resources accordingly probably trumps all of that. If you don't buy low and sell high and manage contracts properly, it won't matter how well you draft.
So I suppose an Oiler fan could mock the Canucks' draft record since the lockout, but their pants are down for everything else.
You're putting so much of yourself into Stu's draft prowess you can't help but be burned.
ReplyDeleteLT and 99.999% of Oilers' fans.
I'm actually a bit nervous for Stu when someone flames out. Management has never been one to take the fall. They've set many, many solid men adrift to avoid blame.
I'm actually a bit nervous for Stu when someone flames out. Management has never been one to take the fall. They've set many, many solid men adrift to avoid blame.
ReplyDeleteGreat point Derek. There's so much out of your control drafting 18 yr old kids that all you can do is try to make the best bet. Stu could make a lot of good bets, but if a kid like RNH went bust along one or more of the dmen (which is way more likely) then the rebuild bogs down heavily. If such a thing were to happen Lowe would start looking to cover his tail like he did with the coaches and the training staff, etc.
Lowe would start looking to cover his tail like he did with the coaches and the training staff, etc.
ReplyDeleteAnd the vast majority of the fanbase would turn on Stu.