Of all the great Oilers from the Stanley days, I miss Jari Kurri the most. He was a wonderful player, cheated for defense but had a scorer's knack for finding open ice and God gave him 99 most every night just to make it completely unfair for lesser men. Jari Kurri arrived as an Edmonton Oiler as the showcase talent for the 1980 entry draft.
Whatever else Oiler fans of my vintage are blessed with from this day until we draw our last breath, the thought of Gretzky to Kurri in orange, white and blue reminds us that there was a time when giants walked among us.
I do this every summer, but mostly for me. The 'GP' measure of weighting a draft is flawed as we shall see when looking at this list. I wish there was an easy answer, but short of me "grading" prospects and young players there's no better way, and if I'm grading them the Poo makes the Hall. :-)
OILERS DRAFTS
- 1980-1,056 (Paul Coffey-394, Jari Kurri-363, Walt Poddubny-157, Andy Moog-142). Kurri played on the best line in hockey for ages and at the peak of his NHL career scored 45, 52, 71, 68 and 54 goals as an Oiler. Paul Coffey was the best offensive defenseman of his era and on of the best of all time, and Andy Moog was a quality goaltender for a long time. Poddubny established himself as a solid roke player in the NHL during his career.
- 1979-1,052 (Kevin Lowe-383, Mark Messier-375, Glenn Anderson-290, Mike Toal-3, Blair Barnes-1). I'm not sure this one belongs behind 1980. Messier was a killer, an absolute killer. Anderson was a legend too, it's ridiculous they got them same year along with a durable defender in Lowe.
- 1993-602 (Jason Arnott-321, Miro Satan-217, Ilya Byakin-57, Alex Kerch-5, Nick Stajduhar-2). This draft came at a very low point for the organization (similar to the situation they're in now). Arnott was a high pick who delivered, but Fraser should also get credit for finding Satan. Two quality regulars over a long period of years makes for a very good draft.
- 2003-557 (Kyle Brodziak-175, Zack Stortini-147, Marc Pouliot-141, JF Jacques-60; Mathieu Roy-30, Troy Bodie-4). The 2003 and 2004 drafts benefit from having the lockout season. Same number of available at-bats but one more year of development than the others. No outstanding talent but several role players. The first of two drafts that I would consider candidates for Prendergast's best, I'd vote for the 2001 draft if I had a vote.
- 2001-471 (Ales Hemsky-275, Jussi Markkanen-128, Ales Pisa-53, Kari Haakana-13, Doug Lynch-2). The first Prendergast draft was probably his best one because of Hemsky alone. A decade ago Edmonton was not a successful drafting team (kind of like Calgary in the Sutter era) but Hemsky looked like a winner from the word go.
- 1996-466 (Tom Poti-230, Boyd Devereaux-230, Matthieu Descoteaux-5, Chris Hajt-1). Devereaux was a very high pick who didn't have the kind of offensive pedigree associated with lottery picks. He was a solid role player before that Dallas Drake hit and recovered his career a little later on. Poti had some exceptional skills and a lot of chaos, but he has had a good NHL career (although it may be in jeopardy at this point).
- 1981-440 (Grant Fuhr-211, Gord Sherven-84, Marc Habscheid-80, Steve Smith-57, Todd Strueby-5, Paul Houck-3). This was a nice draft, Fuhr came very quickly to the show and Habscheid looked for a time like he might be something. Goalies get nicked a little when we measure them by GP, this draft probably deserves to be in the top 5. Steve Smith was a helluva defenseman.
- 2002-440 (Jarret Stoll-286, Matt Greene-151, Mikko Luoma-3). A little misleading in that Stoll was a draft re-entry and technically belongs to the 2000 group. Greene and Stoll have turned into quality NHL players, and this draft (despite the Niinimaki miss) has to be considered a success.
- 1994-439 (Ryan Smyth-269, Mike Watt-89, Jason Bonsignore-79, Ladislav Benysek-2). Smyth is the heart and soul for the Oilers 95-06 and will play a role on the new team too. The Bonsignore pick is the biggest and most devastating miss in the team's history (so far). One of the reasons we don't remember Fraser fondly is the number of high picks that fizzled, something Prendergast never had an opportunity to do (his only top 6 pick was Gagner).
- 1989-414 (Anatoli Semenov-240, Josef Beranek-146, Peter White-26, Darcy Martini-2). You'd like a little more from a draft, but it came when they were winning every season and two useful players isn't a bad return.
- 1991-406 (Martin Rucinsky-241, David Oliver-124, Tyler Wright-41). This is the final of the group I would give passing grades. Rucinsky and Wright had nice careers.
- 1999-361 (Mike Comrie-241, Alexei Semenov-92, Jani Rita-15, Tony Salmelainen-13). I really thought this draft was going to be outstanding. Fizzled. Comrie saved it somewhat and this isn't really about what we all thought but lordy Jani Rita looked like a player.
- ****2007-349 (Sam Gagner 291, Linus Omark 51, Alex Plante-7). This draft has one more season to go before reaching the 5-season limit and has a chance to be both a top 10 all-time draft and deliver some quality in Gagner and Omark. KP's final draft looks like a good one, although with three first rounders one would hope it would have quality. This draft has an outside chance of being the 5th Oiler draft to deliver 500 man games in the first five seasons.
- 1982-345 (Jaroslav Pouzar-186, Raimo Summanen-142, Steve Graves-14, Jim Playfair-2, Dean Clark-1). Pouzar had a nice career and the Oilers thought Summanen would be 99's left-winger, but this draft fell short of acceptable.
- 2005-339 (Andrew Cogliano-246, Danny Syvret-49, Taylor Chorney-44). Cogliano is now gone but he certainly delivered on his draft number.
- 1983-322 (Esa Tikkanen-191, Jeff Beukeboom-117, John Miner-14). I think this one gets a passing grade as well, the 5-year measurement punishes this draft because the club had improved. Two solid NHL players, and in the case of Tikkanen a very unique talent.
- 1992-286 (Kirk Maltby-236, Ralph Intranuovo-22, Joaquin Gage-18, Joe Hulbig-6, Marko Tuomainen-4). This came at a time when the club really needed to add solid building blocks for the future, but it fell well short.
- 1987-235 (Geoff Smith-207, Peter Eriksson-20, Igor Vyazmikin-4, Shaun Van Allen-2, Tomas Srsen-2). Van Allen ended up having a career, but he was a late breaker.
- 1998-229 (Shawn Horcoff-188, Alex Henry-41). Another draft that looks less effective because of the 5-year rule. Horcoff most certainly helped the Oilers during the 00's but the club was shooting blanks in the first round.
- 1995-213 (Georges Laraque-126, Steve Kelly-86, Mike Minard-1). Kelly was a painful miss but he was in fact highly rated that summer. Guy Flaming has written some amazing articles over the years about the Kelly miss, and every Oiler scout stands by the decision and admits they liked him better. Doesn't change anything, but there must have been something there.
- 1984-186 (Todd Ewen-121, Emanuel Viveiros-29, Selmar Odelein-18, Simon Wheeldon-11, Daryl Reaugh-7). Odelein's injury had a lot to do with this draft and its lack of success.
- 1985-164 (Kelly Buchberger-140, Scott Metcalfe-19, Mike Ware-5). Buchberger was a nice late round pickup but Fraser was choogling during these drafts.
- 2000-153 (Matt Lombardi-134, Brad Winchester-19). It actually turned out pretty well for Fraser. Lombardi emerged as a true NHL talent and Winchester a role player. It took awhile, and of course Lombardi is the Stoll mirror.
- 2004-143 (Liam Reddox-56, Rob Schremp-51, Devan Dubnyk-19, Bryan Young-17). This draft is an extreme disappointment, although Dubnyk can still save it and Schremp looks like he might have a career. However, unlike the 2003 draft which produced useful role players this one was pure thud.
- ****2006-137 (Theo Peckham-102; Jeff Petry 35). Although Peckham and Petry took time to arrive and this measurement system tells us the 2006 draft is a fail, if the Oilers can grab two starting defenders from a draft season that's a pretty good year in anyone's books. Added to the fact the Oilers had two picks in the top 130 selections and there's some good news here.
- ****2008-82 (Jordan Eberle 69, Teemu Hartikainen 12, Johan Motin-1). Three years in and the first MBS draft is taking shape. Eberle looks like a very good one and Hartikainen could turn out too. The 2008 draft suffered from not having any picks in the 2nd or 3rd rounds.
- ****2009-80. (Magnus Paajarvi 80). A nice debut for MP and some games possible for Lander this coming season. Olivier Roy is also tracking well enough to be considered a legit NHL prospect.
- ****2010-65. (Taylor Hall 65). Hall is the only 1st overall pick on the list and 2010 should be one of the best on the list 4 summers down the line. Hall alone (should he stay healthy) will play over 375 games before 2015 summer. Many of the players chosen in this draft are tracking well, and the top 5 picks from this draft were all called early (1, 31, 46, 48, 61). It should eventually rival the Arnott-Satan draft of 1993.
- 1988-63 (Shjon Podein-40, Francois Leroux-11, Len Barrie-9, Trevor Sim-3). Len Barrie got famous.
- 1986-31 (Ron Shudra-10, Dan Currie-5, David Haas-5, Jim Ennis-5, Kim Issel-4, Mike Greenlay-2). Mur-diddly-urdler's row.
- 1997-16 (Michel Riesen-12, Jason Chimera-4). Chimera ended up having a career, but developed slowly.
- 1990-00. Thanks for coming. Fraser should have been fired, but the Oilers won the Stanley (again) and honestly not many people were paying attention.
- 2011-00: This draft should see at least 9 games in year one.
- Paul Coffey 394
- Kevin Lowe 383
- Mark Messier 375
- Jari Kurri 363
- Jason Arnott 321
- Sam Gagner 291
- Glenn Anderson 290
- Jarret Stoll 286
- Ales Hemsky 275
- Ryan Smyth 269
- Andrew Cogliano 246
- Martin Rucinsky 241
- Mike Comrie 241
- Anatoli Semenov 240
- Kirk Maltby 236
- Tom Poti 230
- Boyd Devereaux 230
- Miro Satan 217
- Grant Fuhr 211
- Geoff Smith 207
offseason is boring
ReplyDeleteThis might be anathema to some, but I think Fraser honestly got a bit of a bad rap for his mid-late 90's drafting. Not that it was great, but it's not like there were a lot of great picks right after EDM's sequence of first round selections.
ReplyDelete1979 and 1980 are tough to call. 80 probably had more talent, but the 79 group were probably more important to winning Stanley Cups.
ReplyDeleteAgreed there's no ideal measure for ranking them. It's easy to tell which one's suck though (I'm lookin at you 1990).
speeds: Part of the problem is that they kept trading people away. Satan, Rucinsky, etc.
ReplyDeleteThat late 90s team had a lot of talent, but many of them were Sather trades.
speeds: I agree with what you are saying about the '90s, but at the same time procurement of draft picks was pretty weak. I'm not saying Michael Henrich or Michal Riesen or Jani Rita were fantastic, but the fact that they didn't even come close hurts. Sather knew he was better off fleecing someone in a deal and procure those players.
ReplyDeleteHaving two drafts for the ages back to back seems like a good recipe for a winner.
ReplyDeleteThe last four drafts for the Oilers look pretty decent so maybe the team is on the road to greatness.
My favourite Slats trade was the one where he sent all those worthless "Blue Chippers" for Hamrlik.
ReplyDeleteSure Lightning fans enjoyed Bonsignoire and Kelly.
Personally, I think points work better than GP for forwards. I understand that points don't tell you everything about a player, but I think they work as a bit of a better proxy for value, with forwards, than does GP. Of course, that's a wild guess. For D, I think GP might well work better than points.
ReplyDeleteNot sure how one marries those two into one comprehensive formula.
Ah the memories LT.. I was just a little guy when a neighbor at the time who's name rhymes with Cam Connor was traded to the Islanders. Turns out he rented his house out to a couple yahoos who had the dynasty oilers over all the time... Oh, that and recording artist for capital records.
ReplyDeleteAs for that Katwalk Shoes ad, every time I see it, I get this song in my head, lol...
Of the 95-99 drafts, Kelly looks like the worst pick as compared to the guys picked just afterwards. LT, I didn't follow the draft all that carefully back then, how was Kelly ranked way back then, was he a reach or "in the range" at 6OV?
ReplyDeleteIn 96, Devereaux was a reasonable pick at 6, after him the best picks were Salei (9), Morris (13, and a big draft day reach that paid off well), Reasoner (14), Zubrus (15).
97, the Oilers took Riesen at 14, but there were no better players until Hannan at 23 and Morrow at 25.
98, Henrich at 13, a gap until Skoula at 17 but there were some pretty good players from 17-27, I think the criticism is more fair here than some other years, based on the way it turned out (not sure if it's fair based on the perception at the time?)
99, Rita at 13, then Jackman at 17, Boynton at 21 (draft re-entry), and Havlat at 26.
speeds: Kelly was certainly in the range. If the Oilers had taken Doan, I suspect Kelly might have been called in the next couple of selections.
ReplyDeleteProper management would have that 2007 draft turned upside-down. Gagner should have at least 79 less games played and Omark 70-82 more games played.
ReplyDelete"Read more"
ReplyDeleteThat's a new feature.
if we are going to make any comparisons to the 80's, Hall is messier, RNH is 99, I put Eberle as Kurri.
ReplyDeleteI know some think MP is Kurri because he is a fast scandniavian winger but I see in Eberle a quick release, high hockey IQ, excellent two way game...a lot like 17
Slightly off-topic I know, but would someone possibly explain one thing to me? What does "cheating for offence/defence" actually mean? I've been a die-hard hockey & Oilers fan since January 2006 at age 17 (am a Brit living in Britain, hence the late start), and like to think of myself now as very knowledgeable about all things hockey-related, but thats the one phrase that I've never understood... it's not one we have here in the UK!
ReplyDeleteShouldn't game totals include non-Oiler games as well?
ReplyDeleteI agree Bookie: players get traded for all sorts of reasons. Lowetide: you think you could pdate these with all-time games played in NHL? Great stuff. Another thing that would be interesting would be looking at the difference between the structure of organizations? I think it's a few things: 1) What is the ideal ownership structure:for example the old oilers with 30 owners no good. MLSE with no one really taking charge, bad owner. Ilitch taking over the "dead wings" and they became solid. 2) Management: do you need long term GM's or hire the latest stud, former hockey players, assitant GM's from winning teams, etc. 3) Arena ownership: any correlation between ownership of rinks and good teams? 4) Coaching: are teams better with a coach that takes the team when they are bad, then they improve together and win after a few years, or do they hire a stud coach right before winning?
ReplyDeleteI believe these are the total GP after 5 seasons. Is there a player who has been nicked, or did I reference it? I cut and past a lot of this so God knows what I was thinking. :-)
ReplyDeleteEasy Oil: When I talk about cheating for offense or defense it's mostly about positioning. Robert Nilsson used to do it a lot, maybe it got him fired from the NHL. He'd hang by his own blueline, the only skater not in the Oiler zone waiting for an outlet pass and a breakaway.
Paajarvi cheats for defense, man he does it a lot. Paajarvi is first forward out of his zone extremely often, it's almost Adam Oates level (Oates spent his career being the last to arrive in the offensive zone and the first to arrive in the defensive zone).
Generally cheating for defense should be a positive but I worry for Paajarvi because he's not getting enough offensive chances and this chearing for defense is probably part of the problem.
Paajarvi used to be a defenseman, that might be part of the issue.
Anyway, Kurri was elite in all kinds of ways and one of them was recognizing that play and abandoning ship.
The night EDM won their first Stanley, the goal that got them rolling happened:
1. on a line change by NYI
2. defender dumped the puck into the Oilers zone
3. Kurri was first PLAYER back
4. Kurri recognized the line change
5. 99 was waiting in his office, rh boards just before center ice (in order to avoid offside).
6. Kurri ripped a perfect pass.
7. 99 on a breakaway
8. Billy Smith 5 hole.
9. 1-0 Oilers.
I'll remember that play until I die.
Hey LT,
ReplyDeleteHave you ever thought to rank the drafts on 5 year out GP and then total GP once they all retire? It would make the rating process a lot longer but would settle the 1979 and 1980 question. No doubt in my mind that 1979 is better, but is that a great argument to have. You pick 1 hall of fame level player in a draft and it's a home run. You pick 5 in two years? Silly
Cogliano signs in Anaheim. 3 years 2.39 million cap hit.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.capgeek.com/players/display.php?id=25
So, who would have been okay with paying him that to play on the 4th line?
Addam Oates isn't in the HHOF? Wait what now? I always took it for granted that he was already. Lordie the HHOF is bush league all the way, what a joke.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers sure could use Oates for forwards and Huddy for defense coaches.
Way too much money for Cogs. Way too much. ANA can have him. That Tambo deal for a second round pick looks better and better.
ReplyDeleteSure makes that Jones deal look like a bargain.
These are great articles for a hockey nerd like me.
ReplyDeleteFor the KP draft era, I'd agree his first (2001) was his best simply because of Hemsky. But this could change.
I'd suggest the 2006 draft is the sleeper class because Petry and Peckham, have a chance to be quality NHL defensemen for a long time.
The 2007 draft still has a chance to become KP's best class though if Gagner takes a step forward this season and Omark continues to show.
I'd also suggest the 2003 class qualifies as the biggest miss when you consider who they picked versus who they could have had (and won't say any more).
For MBS, 2010 may produce the kind of star power & quality that eventually puts it top 3 (with 1979 & 1980).
Steve Smith only played 57 games for the Oilers? That can't be right. Unless its a different 'Steve Smith' than the one I'm thinking about...
ReplyDeleteThis is up to 5 years after the draft. Smith played one season in the NHL in that window.
ReplyDelete****2008-82 (Jordan Eberle 69, Teemu Hartikainen 12, Johan Motin-1). Three years in and the first MBS draft is taking shape. Eberle looks like a very good one and Hartikainen could turn out too. The 2008 draft suffered from not having any picks in the 2nd or 3rd rounds.
ReplyDeleteOf the post-lockout drafts, this one was the most frustrating. Lowe's idiotic Pronger deal manages to net Eberle at the cost of Brian Burke and Pronger getting a Cup.
If that wasn't enough, they had no picks because they were a rebuilding team in complete denial that decided to chase RFAs down. It's not the entire reason the Oilers have taken five years to get two years into a rebuild, (there are about 40 other reasons too) but it's a major factor IMO.
I think the thing that often goes unmentioned about 'Gretzky & Kurri' (and for those of you who only saw them on youtube - that tandem is the hockey equivalent of 'salt and pepper' - they were that perfect together) is their intelligence. Two very smart hockey players that thought the game as well as they played it.
ReplyDeleteI have some cautious hope that RNH and Eberle could be the kind of players to recreate a semblance of that magic we saw with Wayne and Jari. Hall strikes me as more reminscent of Mess. Take it to the net and take no prisoners. Which is why he's my favorite player of course ;)
re: copy-and-paste, I think you can remove the asterisks from the 2006 draft now. Their five years are up.
ReplyDeleteBruce: Yeah, that's for years in which the ranking changed this past season. So they'll lose the asterisks and itals next season.
ReplyDeleteWhat is really awesome is how much those giants loved Edmonton. Look at Gretzky's FB page and his website, the Oilers almost always take front and centre.
ReplyDeleteD: Remember the time, just after his last season, that the Oilers were trying to sign Messier? And remember how, just after he retired, he told the media that if he'd come back for another season, it wouldn't have been with Edmonton?
ReplyDeleteThe sentiment's fair enough - New York's maybe the only NHL city I'd rather live in than Edmonton - but he really could have kept that to himself.
(The only other candidates are Montreal and Chicago, incidentally.)
ReplyDeleteSteve,
ReplyDeleteI think one of factors that always tore Messier is how much New York revered him. I lived in New York for several years (and was fortunate enough to snag tickets to Messier's retirement ceremony when the Oil played the Rangers), and Messier is as big a name in New York as some of the major stars in other sports, including the Yankees. So Messier always had to be sure not to damage his standing with New York fans in his relations to Edmonton. Believe it or not, many New York hockey fans are REALLY sensitive to any claim by Edmonton fans that Messier is an Oiler first. More than one Ranger fan has told me, Gretzky is yours, no argument there, but Messier is ours.
I get that New Yorkers think of Messier as a Ranger first. I get that Messier might think of himself as a Ranger first. I just don't think that saying it is the kind of thing you need to do to a city suffering from an inferiority complex. I mean, Edmonton knows it's not New York (one reason of several that I prefer it to Calgary), but we don't need beloved local icons rubbing that in our faces.
ReplyDeleteMark Messier is New York first, definitely. Kind of sad, because he was the guy to grow up in this area.
ReplyDeleteWhile he claimed he values both franchises equally, there is several evidence to the contrary:
1. Lowe offered him a final year in his career with Edmonton. Lowe remarked that Messier ''looked at him funny''
2. Lowe discussed coaching/management opportunities - but Messier wanted to part because his family is settled out on the east coast. Aren't his kids grown up now?
3. You would think he'd come back here more than once every 3-4 years if he has any affiliation left with the city. Especially if he has family left here
4. Seems like for all his endorsement deals, he sports the Rangers logo/attire.
It's quite sad, actually.
________________
On the otherhand, Gretzky is a guy that truly values his time in Edmonton.
1. Wears Oilers logo/attire for his promotions.
2. Vehemently defended the city after the 2001 ''Deadmonton'' remarks
3. Speaks highly of his time in Edmonton whenever given the opportunity, and remarks he's a big fan of the Oilers and follows them closely.
4. Has indicated if he opens another location of his restaurant, Edmonton will be next.