Monday, June 27, 2011

Draft 2011 NHLE's: Interesting

David Musil (in photo with ST and Blues logo) is one of the brand new Edmonton Oilers. One of the ways we can begin to understand what these kids are as players is to dissect their numbers. Height, weight, boxcars, etc.

Although it is not a perfect tool, Gabriel Desjardins NHL equivalencies can be an interesting gauge for the big league level of these young men.

Here's a look at the 6 skaters who played in measurable leagues from this weekend's draft.

FORWARDS
  1. C Ryan Nugent-Hopkins 11-27-38
  2. C Tobias Rieder 9-10-19
  3. C Travis Ewanyk 5-4-9
What can we learn from this? I think a few things:

  • RNH is among the best offensive players in this year's draft, comparing well to a typical 3rd or 4th overall pick in the last few seasons. RNH is in the Evander Kane, Matt DuChene, Vladimir Tarasenko range offensively. Shy of a Stamkos or Hall, and in the range will all others at the top of the drafts.
  • Rieder is likely to be sculpted into a 2-way player if he's going to have a career. Players who score in his NHLE range in previous seasons have a difficult time scoring enough to stay in the lineup. Liam Reddox would be a reasonable comparable.
  • Ewanyk is going to have a tough time. Zack Stortini's NHLE in his draft year (5-7-12) was superior so we're looking at an uphill battle for this player. It doesn't really matter how well he checks, or what he does in the FO circle or even how tough he is, it's very likely the Oilers will have a better option available when he is ready to push for employment.
These kids may progress beyond what these numbers imply, but at this point (and this is completely reasonable based on draft number) Hopkins is the only forward we should expect to have an NHL career.


DEFENSEMEN
  1. David Musil 2-8-10
  2. Dillon Simpson 2-7-9
  3. Oscar Klefbom 3-3-6
  • Musil isn't known as an offensive defender, in fact he played a shutdown role in Vancouver based on scouting reports. He's a nice match in this area for Dylan McIlrath, chosen by the Rangers a year ago.
  • Simpson shows well by this metric when we consider that he didn't play a lot in the NCAA as a 17-year old. I think Redline may have been a little harsh in regard to what he'll bring offensively, but we shouldn't get too excited either.
  • Klefbom's number doesn't reflect his lack of playing time in the SEL, and the anecdotal evidence (5, 1-3-4 at the WJ's) suggests a much better player. Still, it's a line in the sand and we'd be hard pressed to suggest Klefbom is a future fixture on an NHL powerplay. Those legendary headman passes Redline mentions should result in better numbers than suggested here.
Desjardins tells us the Oilers drafted an outstanding center, three defensive defensemen and a couple of real long shots. We know that everyone on the planet suggested this draft was 40-45 names deep, so it is reasonable to expect some return from RNH, Klefbom and Musil.

After that, it's all bonus.

54 comments:

  1. Bieksa signed by Canucks as per Bob Mckenzie

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  2. LT: interesting look at the NHLEs. Do you have any idea how accurate the numbers tend to be for defencemen? It seems we mainly focus on forwards with NHLE, given the greater importance of boxcars.

    Also, as a total aside: if you ever find yourself in Southwestern Ontario/Michigan in the summer, try to find a Tigers game at Comerica Park. The park is gorgeous.

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  3. I expect you may get a pleasant surprise down the road from Musil.

    I've heard Don Hay discuss how he was using him in Vancouver several times and Hay indicated he knew he was asking Musil to forego offense to play a strictly shut down role.

    There could me more there.

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  4. Good points by Cactus & DSF - the numbers are a lot tougher to predict with d-men. You don't know the role they've been asked to play by the coach and you don't know TOI.

    Had this happen w/my son (plays travel hockey in the US). He's a shut down d-man and we've always considered that he's best when he doesn't show up on the scoresheet. Two years ago on a team outscored by 30 goals, he was the only plus defenseman.

    Last season because of necessity we started using him on PP and with better offensive players and found he had some offens to bring too. Would not have guessed it.

    Whether or not Musil or Simpson ever add offense would be icing on the cake. I'll take some reliable shutdown types on my team anytime.

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  5. Musil has a good slap shot, when he gets it off, and from what I've read that's a big problem: long slow back swing which results in difficulties finding lanes.

    Still there's something there to be worked on and he might provide better than Smid numbers when he does it make it to the bigs.

    SEL without that 2nd assist is a real killer on outlet pass numbers for Klefbom. And he wasn't getting the minutes that Brodin was getting, judging from the game reports.

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  6. From Tencer on twitter:

    Nice tidbit from Stauffer on Oilers pick at 122, Slovakian defenseman Martin Gernat: the Oilers scouts had him ranked in their top 35.

    Now that is pretty high praise by the scouts. No wonder Stu was grinning ear to ear after this pic !

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  7. I think we may see Gernat picked by the Edmonton Oil Kings in the CHL Import Draft on Wednesday. The Oil Kings traded import dman Martin Hrbas to Kamloops this morning, opening up a spot for a Dman and an import.

    The Oil Kings pick 27th, so they may need to convince other teams to lay off, but it would sure be nice to see the kid play in Rexall 36+ times this winter.

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  8. And I see that along with Hrbas, they traded the 27th pick in the import draft for the 18th pick and a 5th rd pick in the 2012 bantam draft. Movin on up...

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  9. I tweeted the Stauffer comments to

    kluedeke29 Kirk Luedeke

    @regwald Love the value Oilers got on Gernat. Actually, love almost the entire EDM draft- Tambo + MacGregor kicked butt

    And got back the response above.

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  10. @randford4life,

    Nice info on the Oil Kings. Thanks for the heads up. Hope they make it happen.

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  11. Defensive Dman???????????
    Young player in SEL: His U17 and U18 Play is a good reference against the other 1st round Dmen since 2002:

    Player-DraftYR-U18PPG-U17PPG
    R. murphy-2011-1.85-0.66
    E. Johnson-2006-1.67-0.40
    T. Erixon-2009-1.17-1.25
    C. fowler-2010-1.15-0.00
    R. Ellis-2009-1.00-1.50
    A. Larsson-2011-1.00-0.00
    Seabrook-2003-0.86-N/A
    Kleffbom-2011-0.83-1.00
    Doughty-2008-0.83-N/A
    E. Karlsson-2008-0.83-N/A
    Pysyk-2010-N/A-1.00
    Suter-2003-0.79-N/A
    Hedmann-2009-0.75-1.50
    O-E Larsson-2009-0.75-0.80
    Babchuk-2002-0.75-N/A
    I. Cole-2007-0.72-0.17
    Shattenkirk-2007-0.71-0.83
    Pitkanen-2002-0.67-0.33
    Grebeshkov-2002-0.67-N/A
    Mezaros-2004-0.57-N/A
    Schenn -2008-0.50-0.20
    J. Brodin-2011-0.46-1.00
    kulikov-2009-0.46-N/A
    Smid-2004-0.45-0.00
    M. stuart -2003-0.38-N/A
    K. Ballard-2002-0.33-N/A
    J. Johnson-2005-0.33-0.80
    T. meyers-2008-0.29-N/A

    So Dmen with Size 6'+, good defensive cover, and showed continuation of offence year to year.

    E. Johnson-2006-1.67-0.40
    T. Erixon-2009-1.17-1.25
    C. Fowler-2010-1.15-0.00
    A. Larsson-2011-1.00-0.00
    K. Seabrook-2003-0.86-N/A
    O. Kleffbom-2011-0.83-1.00
    D. Doughty-2008-0.83-N/A
    R. Suter-2003-0.79-N/A
    V. Hedmann-2009-0.75-1.50
    O-E Larsson-2009-0.75-0.80

    Pretty rare group!

    No wonder Calgary was pissed.

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  12. I was wondering if the Oil Kings had a shot at drafting Gernat.Would be a very good place for him to play.

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  13. I hope DSF's comments about Musil ring through, and he spends this Summer working on his skating and shot.

    The same can be said of Larsson (arguably) and I still can't believe the Devils had him practically fall into their laps. Lou has some kind of hoodoo going there for sure.

    Fricking frick on a frick stick I wanted Larsson in Oilers silks. It'll be night unbearable if Larsson becomes a perennial Norris calibre defenseman unless The Nuge absolutely tears the NHL up.

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  14. I don't take NHLE to forcast a player's career, just his next year, right?

    If there is literature that indicates that a NHLE in a draft year predicts the overall success of a player in the NHL, I'd like to see it. As I see it, its a pretty dicey to take a 17yr olds numbers and do much with them other than to predict what he would do next year, if he was in the NHL.

    Tobias moved from the Landshut Cannibals in the German league to the OHL last year. That must have been a huge transition on and off the ice. He could be one to watch.

    Similarly with OK-Bom. As he gets more TOI his numbers should come up. I think if Ewanyk could get some better offensive minutes his numbers could increase a lot too.

    BTW, it would appear the Oilers have really improved their European scouting, with picks coming out of Sweden, Finland and Slovakia on a consistent basis.

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  15. His U17 and U18 Play

    Tournament of samall sample size.

    U17WJC U18WJC there country or regions best.

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  16. As per twitter, Carcillo not qualified by Philly.

    I'd like to see him on the Oilers 4th line.

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  17. Any news on which RFA's have received qualifying offers today?

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  18. per Gregor on twitter. Finally, JFJ not qualified.

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  19. as per twitter, Taylor Pyatt not qualified.

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  20. The Blackhawks have traded Tomas Kopecky to Florida for a 7th round draft pick.

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  21. Thanks Reg,

    Does LT have a twitter account?

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  22. I don't know that LT has one. Maybe it's time for him to get a cell phone so he can tweet ... ;o) ...

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  23. as per twitter:

    Tyler Kennedy not qualified.

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  24. Benoit Pouliot not qualified.

    Would be perfect to add size to the club.

    Can skate, check, shoot and pass.

    It's like JFJ but with 3 more attributes.

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  25. FPB: //Benoit Pouliot not qualified.
    Would be perfect to add size to the club.//

    er....Smyth, Hartikainen, Hamilton...you're joking right.

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  26. Steve Sullivan not re-signed by NAS as per twitter.

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  27. Regwald: Think that's Tom Pyatt (Habs) not qualified, Taylor is still under contract in Phx.

    Seeing some of these guys not get qualified is just another reason why we should have waited to sign Ryan Jones. There's some quality guys that can be had for your 3rd and 4th lines for cheap every year. Tyler Kennedy? Bit of a surprise there.

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  28. Godot: Smyth's there.

    The other 2 not so much. He'd be cheap and a great complement to a 3rd line / top 6 occasionally.

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  29. Pouliout is as soft a big forward that there is. He's a perimeter floater and one of the worst top 5 picks in the last decade.

    No thanks

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  30. Pouliout is as soft a big forward that there is. He's a perimeter floater and one of the worst top 5 picks in the last decade.

    Tell us how you really feel, Jack Edwards. ;-)

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  31. Moose, could be. Sorry, will double check.

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  32. itsaleaf:

    QC: -0,009 (9th forward)
    QT: 0,031 (6th forward)

    +-ON/60 0,14
    CorsiREL: 10,4
    PDO: 991
    P/60: 2,08
    G/60: 0,86

    26 Takeaways 14 giveaways
    110 hits (3rd on MTL)
    11:32 per game

    Soft bastard heh?

    51,0 OFstart, 51,6 OFfinish.

    (8th and 8th)

    Could do worse

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  33. Anthony Stewart (Jets) not qualified according to Elliot Friedman...another surprise. Big body, scored 14 goals last year. Seemed like a guy who was finally starting to figure it out.

    I'd take a flyer on him.

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  34. Kennedy is a bit of a shocker for sure. You'd think he'll get snapped up pretty quickly in free agency. What are the odds off him signing in Edmonton?

    Better not get ahead of myself...don't want to sabotage the fail for nail.

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  35. Fpb:

    I saw him real bad for years here in wild territory. Its gonna take more than those numbers to convince me he's a legitimate candidate on the 4th line.

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  36. RFAs Michal Repik, Niclas Bergfors, Steve Bernier, Byron Bitz officially cut loose by #FlaPanthers

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  37. Is this the right place for the JFJ going away party?

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  38. brian elliot not offered a contract by Avs.

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  39. I can hear Lowetide crying from out east, JFJ not qualified. ;-)

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  40. What are the Panthers doing exactly? Trying to sink their own ship?

    It's been two times now they traded for a guy, and then let him loose.

    2010-11 Rochester Americans AHL 53 11 34 45 -9
    21 years old (Repik)

    WTF is going on?

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  41. @fpb

    Maybe Florida is Yearning for Yakupov?

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  42. @WheatNOil...i suspect that's exactly what Florida is planning.

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  43. What a fall for Bernier. 1st rounder, big body, 101 pts in his draft year in the Q,

    and nothing much since.

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  44. Tallon has done this before, he knows how to do it again. 2 Dmen drafted first 2 yrs of rebuild... check. 2 Centres drafted next... half a check, other half waiting on Yakupov. Pick up some power wingers along the way, a couple of judicious trades, a couple of free agent signings and off to the races.

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  45. It seems pretty standards with veterans, but it's the first time i've seen a team intentionally kill it's prospects bank.

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  46. Spoiler: Exept he got screwed in his trades, waived a 30 goal scorer and stuff.

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  47. @ Jake 70:

    The crying from LT was last year over MAP. Can't see it for JFJ...although maybe we'll be treated to a "sail on Crazy Train"?

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  48. The Oil have been pretty bad the last 2 seasons, but Florida looks like they've come to play for Nail. Tallon must have been plenty chagrined when both the Oilers & Avs finished ahead with RHN in the balance.

    I bet he's learned his lesson though, you need to build from the goaltender out...Elliott to Florida July 1st? Also you'd think he could have gotten some picks to jettison those guys.

    verification: sayin

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  49. Everytime I see Travis Ewanyk play I think Ryan O'Marra, just going to have a tough time pulling it all together and making a solid run to be an NHLer.

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  50. Tallon just picked up Kopecky for a 7th round pick.

    Man knows what he's doing.

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  51. Regwald said... As per twitter, Carcillo not qualified by Philly. I'd like to see him on the Oilers 4th line.


    I wouldn't hate on that either. Ben Eager might be worth a look also. What you see is what you get and one shouldn't discount the psycho factor. I like the types that are nuts enough to go after the other teams best players.

    Anthony Stewart could also be worth a look. He surged big time this year after almost being a write off.

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