Years ago (before the blog) I used to talk about making sure the prospects got their "500 at-bats" before sending them away. The idea being that seeing-eye singles and line drives into the mitt even out over a long season, and a full year in the NHL would give a better view of a youngster.
Well, we're 1500 at-bats into the Andrew Cogliano show and the arrows seem to be going the wrong way. I don't know he gets anywhere good from here. Is he a scorer? Well, not quite, although he didn't play with Lafleur and Shutt a year ago. Is he a Butch Goring? No. No no no. Andrew Cogliano has all of the defensive acumen of a Rick MacLeish and that is not a compliment.
I've always liked Andrew Cogliano, but he looks more like the next Bobby Sheehan than the next Cliff Ronning. I hope he likes the nickname "Suitcase."
•Boxcars: 82gp, 10-18-28
•Shots: 139
•Plus Minus: -5
•Corsi (Rel): 1.5 (6th among F's)
•GF/GA ON: 41-46
•5x5/60: 1.39 (7th among F's)
•5x4/60: 2.55 (10th among F's)
•Quality of Competition: 7th toughest among F's
•Quality of Teammates: 4th best among F's
•FO %: 43% in 379 FO's
•Cap Hit: $1,133,333 (RFA)
- What do these numbers tell us? His 5x5/60 performance was down year-over-year but the entire roster experienced a dip so I think it is important to keep it in context. He did play in shallow waters but so did Gagner and Sudden Sam was rewarded (I think correctly) with the better men. Still, it is hard to make chicken salad out of Ethan rifles. Cogliano's impressive shooting percentage from his first two seasons fell to earth, predictably. His season offensively is not as bad as it has been portrayed in some circles, but after three seasons you'd like to see more.
- How Could these numbers be better? Cogliano is a busy player but (in both offensive and defensive zones) often accomplishes very little. He's a loose cannon as opposed to being a player who finds areas to be useful. It's actually incredible how very often Andrew Cogliano is out of position when the heart of a play actually happens. A late-season flourish saved his offensive numbers somewhat, but the kid spent much of the year in a fog. I think he might have missed MacT's tendency to find a role for a player and stick him there (the kid line) but don't want to turn this into another MacTavish post.
- Is he going to be a complete player? As I mentioned above, I don't know how you get there from here. He isn't building a solid resume and he isn't going to beat out Sam Gagner or Taylor Hall or MPS for playing time. I'm almost certain the coaching staff will use him some on the PK and maybe that will turn him around a little (more defensive minded) but he's sure in the wrong spot on a lot of GA.
- How much PP time/PK time do you see him getting? No powerplay time, unless he has a trick pitch or something. I still think he could help a penalty kill with that terrific speed, but Cogliano needs to buy in to becoming that kind of player (Fred Shero turned MacLeish into a pretty good penalty killer and MacLeish wasn't very good at the defensive aspects of the game. MacLeish used to skate through the slot after a goal with a look of complete disgust, which I always found hilarious since he didn't do jack diddly to stop anything).
- Size isn't as big a deal as you make it to be. True, and the Oilers have thrown out a few minnows so there's more room. Still, for a team that will endure rookie mistakes from Hall, MPS, Eberle, Omark, Crosby, Stills, Nash, Young, Dallas Taylor and Greg Reeves, a guy entering his 4th season needs to be mentor to these kids. Cogs is not ready to step up (based on the evidence) as a 2-way C so I don't know how he'd be asked to train the new hires on the finer aspects of reading the play.
- What about a line of Cogliano-Hall-MPS? They could certainly increase league scoring but one wonders how often the line would have the puck. I'm not trying to be critical of this line combination, hell 5 years from now it might be a gem. But the learning curve will be immense for the Oilers rookies (remember Gagner's rookie season with Cogs?) and Cogliano's play in the middle isn't strong enough for this line to click in the NHL.
- Are they going to trade him? My guess is yes, and that on another team (with fewer players who duplicated his skill set) Cogliano will have a solid career. I'm cheering for him.
- How important is he to the organization? Not very. Among the Oiler forwards, I'd rate Penner, Hemsky, Gagner, Horcoff, Brule and Hall ahead of him in terms of "keepers" and they could trade Cogs and sign Comrie and be farther ahead in terms of 10-11. He has trade value and at this point that's probably the route to go.
- Your projections are ridiculous. Are the Oilers going to score 200 goals by your estimate? Yes. They scored 214 last season and I think they'll score more this year.
By The Numbers
•07-08 5x5 per 60m: 2.28
•08-09 5x5 per 60m: 1.69
•09-10 5x5 per 60m: 1.39
By The Numbers
•07-08 5x4 per 60m: 2.52
•08-09 5x4 per 60m: 3.39
•09-10 5x4 per 60m: 2.55
Predictions Past 2009-10: 82gp, 22-25-47 (.573)
Performance in 2009-10: 82gp, 10-18-28 (.341)
Prediction for 2010-11: 82gp 10-20-30
Running in place despite the speed
Time for Cogs to move on.. hoepfully somewhere where he will get a chance to play.
ReplyDeleteSaid it before, will say it again.
ReplyDeleteCogs for Boyd Gordon. If Cogs scores 20 goals for them the Oilers are still ahead of the game. A lock down defensive center to kill penalties that is a 55%+ face off man
Under Renney shift control. Horcoff, Brule, and Cogliano looked themselves.
ReplyDeleteCogs: 21GM 5G 10A +2
Full season 19G 38A +7
I am sorry but he and brule were hit machines the last 1/4 of the season.
Cogliano is a 18 goal scorer which puts in the upper half of second line scoring for forwards. 3 goals short of first line scoring.
You people are bloddy nuts to get rid of goals.
Penner brule Cogliano as a secondary comp line
Under MacT Cogliano went from fast, fast rookie on a protected and blessed Kid line to an interesting secret weapon when the ice opens up such as during overtime. Last year was lost for this player and others. The coach couldn't figure out what to do with him and didn't bother to work it out because he had big problems everywhere.
ReplyDeleteBefore the Oilers trade Cogliano to sweeten up a Souray trade for someone else's problem, I'd like to see and overtime situation come up with the opposition having their second or third defense pair out and Cogliano go over the boards with Hall.
The Oilers pattern of putting everyone through the growing pains of a player for three or four years then trading them for picks just annoys me. It makes them into a perpetual development machine, like the Montreal Expos of 1994-2005 and the Florida Marlins of 2002 to now.
If they trade Cogliano, it better be for a good player that helps now. Otherwise they should find a use for him.
Also, not to dig at you LT because I probably have more respect for you than any other hockey columnist, but does has Cogliano really displayed less defensive acumen than Gagner?
I don't know how anyone puts Brule ahead of Cogliano.
ReplyDeleteTwo thumbs up for the Snark
Henry: Exept the Expos shelled out some good players from time to time.
ReplyDeleteI say let Renney try to make a defensive forward out of him because lord knows we need some. If he is unwilling or unable to accept a checking/penalty killing role ala Marchant/ Draper/Lehtinen, then it's time to move him. I don't know why a player like him wouldn't want to establish themselves as a 3rd line guy who is going to try and win a Selke and some Cups. Oh wait I remember. $$$$$ Everybody and their dog tries to be a top 6 forward to get the huge payday even if the writing is blatantly on the wall as in this case. Blazing speed + no hands= learn to check or see ya later.
ReplyDeleteThat is a strong anti-Cogliano screed. I like the tone of it, even if I don't agree with it.
ReplyDeleteIt may well be that Cogs needs to see a few more NHL cities before he turns into Dan Cleary, but I can see that happening.
He certainly improved on his Cleary skills (screening, net crashing, hitting, back-checking) last season.
I will go out on a limb and say he's the 2010-11 version of Penner. So just like Penner wasn't much loved on the Oilogosphere last summer, but turned it on this year, that's my prediction for Cogs in 2011-12. He will pick it up a notch.
I don't know how anyone puts Brule ahead of Cogliano.
ReplyDeleteAlphabetically?
The problem for Cogliano isn't really him (it might be, but I don't think we know for sure yet), but rather the redundancy on the roster.
ReplyDeleteThe Oil have to make a decision between Cogs and Brule. Which smurf do they keep?
It appears they both racked up their best offensive seasons with unsustainable shooting percentages.
From what we know, Brule is more willing to play wing.
They're both a bit of a dog's breakfast on D.
To my eye, Brule is tougher along the boards and in the corners. Both go to the net well for smaller guys.
Brule is a better at the dot. Both suck at distributing the puck and won't be much help to a PP.
They're about the same age, but I'd have to give the slight edge to Brule for trending upwards.
I'd have to say I think I'd keep Brule at this point, although it's close and my loyalties lie toward our own pick, the potter of back-to-back-to-back OT winners.
If only Cogs was a tenacious forechecker in the mold of Dvorak, they could keep headmanning the puck and let him go chase.
I wonder what Cogliano, a decent to good (but not excellent) prospect, and Calgary's 3rd round pick in 2011 could get you on the trade market?
ReplyDeleteA Young Quality 2 way Defenseman?
Hate to interrupt this sausage fest, but there is speculation that the Oilers will sign Belanger - via Richard Cloutier
ReplyDeleteOf course he's on that site which I rarely visit
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?blogger_id=131
I will go out on a limb and say he's the 2010-11 version of Penner. So just like Penner wasn't much loved on the Oilogosphere last summer, but turned it on this year, that's my prediction for Cogs in 2011-12. He will pick it up a notch.
ReplyDeleteCogs might pick it up a notch, but I don't see the comparison to Penner. While joe fan was critical of Penner last summer, many in the Oilogosphere were supportive, siding with Penner over MacT. Others looked at underlying numbers suggesting that Penner played well, but was just unfairly maligned. Aside from saying OTC screwed up Cogs (as Rickibear suggested), there isn't anything to say Cogs played well and isn't getting credit.
I'm not saying don't trade Cogliano. However, lets try to get a grip on what sort of player he is. Just because he is small and fast doesn't mean his career needs to look like Todd Marchant's.
ReplyDeleteCogs doesn't dump and chase and you are never going to be able to make him into a forechecker. He doesn't anticipate and use that blinding speed to get breakaways. Not to mention he has no idea what to do on defence and is at best a mediocre face off man.
So why on earth do you keep him? Because when paired with outstanding offensive talent he scores. It is as simple as that. The Oilers actually have the talent to create the opportunities Cogs can exploit.
He thrives when he can close late and fast. His shooting percentage his first two years wasn't absurd for a guy who likes to get so close. Last year they stuck him out on the wing a lot and expected him to shoot more and as a result his percentage went down.
Let me say it clearly, Cogs is a scorer. Put him with Penner and Brule and watch him score more than well enough to justify his spot on the second line. Stop trying to make him something he is not. We need that something (a shutdown C who can kill penalties - Eric Belanger) but all the wishing in the world isn't going to make Cogs that guy.
If we do decide to trade Cogliano, which I think would be ill advised, then get a quality defence prospect who can grow with the core of the team. I'd be trying for Maxim Goncharov.
Great post LT.
ReplyDeleteI too think he'll be traded, probably to sweeten a deal (perhaps with Souray?) Read somewhere (via Twitter i think) that Kaberle will likely get traded this weekend. Is Kaberle a player management might try to go after? Could it be done? I know we'd need more of a solid defensive defenceman... and that Kaberle strikes me as more of an offensive d-man. I don't know, but I could see Cogliano being traded to TO...
I guess the important question here is, would this be a good trade for Edmonton? and should they try to get Kaberle?
just thinking aloud...
If we sign Belanger, Tambellini's off-season will be promoted from "doing well at hitting the low-hanging fruit" to "addressing team needs as well as can reasonably be expected". As for the roster being too crowded, no problem: make the rookies - especially the AHL ones - fight it out for however many roster spots are available.
ReplyDeleteIsn't HockeyBuzz that site that just makes shit up, though?
I think Cogs is better than suggested here.
ReplyDeleteHis early results were artificially inflated by an unsustainable SH%.
But his results this last year were the result of bad qual team and qual comp. that was beyond him.
He's still young enough to find his game, and to settle in as a winger. I'm still optimistic.
Really needs to learn to PK, though, especially with more offensively talented guys coming in.
Wouldn't it be lovely if our management actually showed some faith in their own workmanship and went out and filled the dubious roster spots with veteran talent. Like try adding Mike Mottau, Eric Belanger, and Arron Asham. We'd certainly be back in the playoffs and the kids would get a chance to be part of the playoff experience. Some would spend more time in the AHL than as things currently stand and that would be good as well.
ReplyDeleteI think we've already gone too far to be a lottery team again so we might as well go for a return to the playoffs. As is I figure we end up 17-23 and probably at the lower end. However, a few mroe signings, a skillful trade or two and we'd be there. At the moment we are just headed for a very frustrating limbo.
I think that Cogs spent 70% of the season with Ethan Moreau. I expect him to do better this year unless he is traded to Columbus.
ReplyDeleteIsn't HockeyBuzz that site that just makes shit up, though?
ReplyDeleteYes it is.
The latest poop has Kaberle heading our way as well.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletelinnaeus said...
ReplyDeleteLike try adding Mike Mottau, Eric Belanger, and Arron Asham.
I think we'd be running into contract issues. Just Belanger would be nice though. Very nice.
Dare to dream:
HALL HORC HEMS
PENN GAGN EBER
PAAJ BELA BRUL
COGL FRAS STOR
JACQ
REDD
This is as balanced a forward roster as I have seen in years (except age-wise, of course).
If Souray stays and plays, and he and Khabby can stay healthy, this would be interesting.
But Belanger ain't coming here, Souray and Lowe won't kiss and make up, and after sweating for 30 days in one of those AZ tent prisons with the pink oufits, reKhab is just gonna dehydrate into one giant russian raisin.
"There's no water bottles in prison, boy!"
Dare to dream:
ReplyDeleteHALL HORC HEMS
PENN GAGN EBER
PAAJ BELA BRUL
COGL FRAS STOR
JACQ
REDD
I'd be a little surprised if reddox makes the team ahead of Giroux or Omark.
I think we can put the Belanger talk to bed. From Spector's Hockey:
ReplyDeleteEric Belanger admits he's signed a new one-year contract with an NHL team but cannot yet disclose the club's identity as it is currently working on a deal which would affect its salary cap space.
Unless we're signing him to a whopper, Éric's goin' cup-huntin'.
It looks like many of us here are still pretty big Cogliano fans.. Although I'd love to see him develop into a contributing (year after year) offensive player on this team, there are too many top-6 options that rank ahead of him and that is without the inclusion of MPS or Eberle... (LT's list: Penner, Hemsky, Gagner, Horcoff, Brule and Hall)
ReplyDeleteA big question for me is why he had so little success on the third line (was it all rifles?! - I thought so for much of the year, but could it also be the role? - LT made great points showing his lack of success in this role, nevermind the faceoffs)
Id love to see it, but I feel that the new crop will be given priority from the org.. when MPS was drafted I felt cogs was the most a risk of being pushed out, simply by a similar player with better draft pedigree.. We'll see.. as some have said, Cogs was making progress late last year and that showed (me) that he responded to the coaching.. perhaps being a 4th year pro gives him the edge to win a job in camp and keep it?!
All in all, I think he'd look good playing for the Leafs (not much comp for top-6 there at least)
PAAJ HORC HEMS
ReplyDeletePENN COGL BRUL
HALL GAGN EBER <-- Butter Soft
JONE FRAS STOR
This is a line up made to fit Cogs in a significant role.. but based on the criticisms of Brule and Cogs, that 2nd line need to butter soft - expect that that third line would need it even more..
This line-up just doesnt work..
OR
ReplyDeleteHALL HORC HEMS
PENN GAGN BRUL
PAAJ FRAS STOR
JONE COGL EBER
dunno.. its too late..
maybe swap in reddox for eberle, as per previous 'need for PKers' discussions...
Remember that picture with the three naked oilers. (of which Cogs was one?)
ReplyDeleteWe need to get rid of all of those guys.
i wouldn't mind if Cogs was gone next year. waited long enough for yet another underproductive smurf to develop.
ReplyDeleteIsn't HockeyBuzz that site that just makes shit up, though?
ReplyDeleteI've always known them as the site that gets most of its inside scoop from HF threads.
I've always known them as the site that gets most of its inside scoop from HF threads.
ReplyDeleteIt's circular. Hockeybuzz makes up rumours for the hf board communities that are the biggest and dumbest. (Like the Oilers fanbase)
If he's producing that little, he certainly shouldn't play 82 games for this team. No reason to.
ReplyDeleteOn Cogs:
ReplyDelete"Suitcase" is a good nickname, but what about "Sweetener"? That's what most of us have been calling him for the past couple summers. I like the kid. Hell, I love the kid. Does he have a spot on this team? Sure doesn't seem like it.
Feels more like we've had him waiting for a standby flight outta town since Heatergate. Even now, I'm anticipating the Kaberle deal/non-deal to be the bump in the dominoes that finally sends young Andrew away. But we shall see...
Also:
Matheson's got a nice piece about Pisani that provides an interesting perspective on the FA situation.
Kind of an aside - but I suppose it might be relevant given an impending Cogliano contract and the necessary roster spot:
ReplyDeleteThis appears to be the year of the incredibly cheap veteran and we have a team with rookies who need to learn and be looked after. Why aren't we out there grabbing depth (NHL depth) left and right?
i was on Hockeybuzz once and couldn't stand it, HFBoards too and rarely go on that one anymore. i come here, Oilersnation, and Sportsnet mostly now. much better!
ReplyDeleteLMHF#1, because this team has had that need for years now and hasn't addressed it.
ReplyDeleteThey did it in 05-06 (a bunch of solid but unspectacular vets) and it was a really good team, but ever since then they've had huge holes in their lineups and filled them with kids learning on the job.
The vets you sign in the offseason don't have to be world beaters. Hell, signing a guy to do nothing but fogo (face off, get off) in the defensive end would be a great move.
The biggest problem for Cogliano, assuming he wants to stay a centre, would seem to be Sam Gagner. Right now they're both 2nd line centres at best, and Gagner is the favourite for that role. If Gagner were ready (or capable) to step up to the first line, I think there would be room for Cogs on the 2nd assuming Horcoff becomes your (super expensive) 3rd line checking centre.
ReplyDeleteIf you could get something going like:
Penner-Gagner-Hemsky
Hall-Cogliano-one of MPS, Eberle, Brule
for your top 6, then Cogs would definitely have a spot on this team. A Hall-Cogs-MPS line would be crazy fun to watch, though probably a defensive disaster. The problems here are A) is Gagner ready to play 1C? (Probably not.) B) is Cogliano strong enough defensively to cover for Hall and/or another rookie's mistakes learning on the job? (Probably not.) So you have to slot Horcoff in at 1C because he's the only guy left on the roster who won't get killed in that spot, and Gagner and Cogliano compete for 2C. Cogs won't cut it as a 3C, he sucks at face-offs and isn't strong enough defensively, quite frankly I just don't have confidence that he can take a tonne of DZ draws and get the puck going the right way. So either he's gotta go or someone else does.
Basically, I have every bit of confidence that Cogliano can succeed on the top 6 of some team somewhere with decent linemates, but here, he's redundant, and he hasn't done enough to prove he's better than the other guys vying for his job. If either him or Gagner can prove they can outscore the tough competition, then I think there's room for both on this team but as long as neither is 1C material, one has to go.
I suspect there will be a few more vets they'll have a look at but they'll be camp invites who are desperate for a contract.
ReplyDeleteChances with/without Cogliano
ReplyDeleteVia Mirtle:
ReplyDeleteAccording to multiple sources, free agent centre Eric Belanger has a one-year deal in waiting to return to the Washington Capitals. The contract is believed to be a slight raise to... $1.85-million.
He goes on to mention Kaberle, and quotes Burke as saying the Leaves have had no talks with the Caps.
Can't help but let my mind wander to that old Souray-to-WAS chatter (Mirtle even namedrops Shelly). They've got the space and a thin enough blue to give Souray a twice-over, but would they give up anything we want?
I figure Knuble (no chance) or Gordon (too affordable) would be at the top of our list. Mirtle suggests Fleischmann is whom the Caps want to send packing. Cogs+Souray for Fleischmann+prospect/pick? We're essentially swapping defense/FO-challenged pivot-wingers and offloading Oscar the Grouch (giving WAS the League's scariest PP blue in a hot minute).
I like Cogliano, but Gagner is the superior option, and when played together, are too small to provide the Oilers with anything winnable up the middle. So one of them has to go, and it's not going to be Gagner.
ReplyDeleteCogliano should be at the top of the Leaf's summer wish list. But who do they want to trade him for?
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletebut there has been debate among fans and media types as to whether or not Cogs is a top 6 player here. if he isn't, then there appears to be no room for him as we seem to have plenty of tougher, bigger guys for the 3rd and 4th lines.
ReplyDeleteQuain,
ReplyDeleteGiving the chances w/wo for every player is awesome, thanks.
One interesting stat is to see what 89 and 13 do with 27 and 67 on their wings.
When playing with 89, 27 goes from 49.6(away) to 55.6 (with), for a net gain of 6% (206 events with)
When playing with 13, 27 goes from 54.2(away) to 45.4(with), for a net loss of 8.8%. (153 events with)
When playing with 89, 67 goes from 43.6(away) to 56.6(with) for a net gain of 13% (129 events with)
When playing with 13, 67 goes from 46.3(away) to 48.9(with) for a net gain of 2.6% (141 events with)
These two comparisons really help the argument that 89 is ahead of 13 in development.
One glaring stat on 13 is with theformercaptainehtandouchebag
18 with 13 had 43.8%SC, while 18 away from 13 sinks to an abysmal 29.9% for a net loss of 13.9%!!
I'm sure 18 playing toughs away from 13 contributed to the drop, but that's a huge number.
If 13 stays an Oiler he needs to re-invent himself a little bit as he simply will not pass Gagner.
Not that thrilled with the Fleishman rumour, he has the worst RelCor on the Caps with a -10.7. He had 5/13 RelCorQC and RelCorQT 6/13.
Note:
ReplyDeleteIf I wasn't clear on the 18/13 numbers, it was to support the boat anchor theory that 18 had on 13, and that 13 helped him alot.
That being said, when comparing 27 and 67's ice time with 89 vs. 13, 89 comes out on top and its not close.
The samples sizes are smallish, but similar enough to come to some conclusions.
Seeing a few regular season games will probably a great good to this place. Right now so many maybe's.
ReplyDeleteI'd be nice to get a defenseman with what they eventually decide to throw away.
The guy you'd want to grab from WSH is Brooks Laich. 20+ each of the last 3 years. Big C.
ReplyDeleteI'm thinking though that WSH isn't insane enough to give up a guy like that...unfortunate.
It's now obvious that Souray has negative value around the league (which is unsurprising), so anything we get back for his is also going to have negative value. I'd be very surprised if Laich was seen to have negative value.
ReplyDeleteIf the Caps take Souray, they'll want to send us an overpay in return. Looking at their chart on capgeek.com, I don't see anyone who fits the bill.
ReplyDeleteMaybe this would work to solve multiple problems for the Caps and helps us long term.
Send them Souray (overpay) and Smid (underpay?) and Cogs (cheap and value as prospect)
We get Poti (only one year left, but Caps save some cap-space to purchase rentals at the deadline) and a decent young-ish forward from their roster.
I don't know what they think of Poti, so maybe this won't work. But it gives the caps 2 D-men who can play. It allows them enough cap room to sign a guy like Mitchell and maybe have a little room for a rental at the deadline. They get a guy with potential in cogs.
The Oilers get a guy who can fill in the top 4 on a crap squad, who's cap hit expires after this year when we might want the space. (Souray's doesn't) And they hopefully get one of Washington's good, young-ish forwards who will really help balance out this lineup.
Not a great deal for the Oil (selling low on Cogs, Souray, AND Smid) but it might help balance out the roster for 2011-2012 and helps with cap-space now.
Pretty much guarantees us a lottery pick, too.
Steve:
ReplyDeleteExactly. Which is why I suggest the Cogliano-Fleischmann swap would be the centrepiece of a deal. They get the (presumably) more affordable version with more upside and Souray becomes the sweetener, now that they have the space.
If we could get a prospect for Souray, they would be damaged goods, but what do we care? Also picks are often undervalued at this point, especially by a team that should be competing for the President's.
Still, I can't help but feel like I'm blueskying right now. WAS will probably pull off a much more sensible team with a less desperate team.
EDIT: "WAS will probably pull off a much more sensible *deal* with a less desperate team."
ReplyDeletekris:
If the Caps take Souray, they'll want to send us an overpay in return... I don't see anyone who fits the bill.
See my Fleischmann babble above.
I don't know what they think of Poti
He's an alternate for the Caps. Not a dealbreaker, but lends to a sense of how they feel about him.
cogs and gagner were rookies together....so it dont say much when you ask how much gags struggled when on the same line as another rookie who didnt play CHL..... but NCAA. He went from 47 some games going to school EVERYDAY to 82 vs gags who played 68-72 some reg season games, and playoffs while not attending school....be that high schol, college, jr college, canadian college or the NCAA
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletekris why would we want poti back?!?!?!?! didnt work the first time around....smid is more or less the same player minus his age factor. look at numbers over.
ReplyDeleteSMID NHL TOTALS = 253 games; 4 goals; 30 assists; 34 points;191 pims at age 24
vs
POTI NHL totals 717 games; 63 goals, 231 assists; 294 point; 536 pims at age 33
Hate to say this, but Quinn mishandled Cogliqno.
ReplyDeleteHe'll never be a good defensive player, but he has some strong points to his offensive game.
If the Oilers keep playing pin the 2-way center tail on him, they'll continue to get poor results.
If Renney picks his spots, puts him at LW and gives him a chance to be himself instead if trying to push him into a role he's Ill-suited for, he has the chance to surprise a lot of people.
The Oilers would be fools to trade him now unless the return is excellent. At worst, he builds up value and brings a better return at the deadline. At best, he becomes a keeper.
well said rick!!! would hate to give up on this kid and have him bite us in the ass sometime down the road
ReplyDeletekris why would we want poti back?!?!?!?!
ReplyDeleteBecause we want to get rid of Souray, and the only way to get rid of Souray is to take back somebody we would rather not take back. That's how trading negative value players works.
I don't make the Souray/Smid/Cogliano for Poti+ trade unless we've got another UFA veteran defenseman lined up. Otherwise, we're playing Strudwick 70 games and throwing rookies into the fire, which is no way to rebuild.
Edit to my above: that's not the only way to get rid of Souray; we could also through in assets until they offset Souray's negative value. But I'm not sure we have any real assets we're looking to move, especially not just to get rid of Souray. So the most realistic way to get rid of Souray is to trade negative value for negative value.
ReplyDelete[url=crush-the-castle.com]Crush The Castle[/url]
ReplyDelete