Yesterday's qualifying offers give us a strong indication about the kind of roster Tom Renney will employ in 2010-11. In the spring before he was hired, I posted a "Tom Renney in a box" post that looked at the type of roster he used with the Rangers. Renney employed end-of-the-roster fighters/coke machines/goons who routinely averaged less than 10 minutes a game. In 06-07, Colton Orr and Ryan Hollweg were regulars and fought 16 and 15 times respectively. Other very physical regulars included Brendan Shanahan (in photo), Sean Avery (acquired mid-season) and they also spent some at-bats on people like Jed Ortmeyer and Brad Isbister (and remember these are just the forwards).
That's a lot of beef, folks. So, when we talk about free agency and trades, the Oilers shopping list should include the following:
- right handed 2-way center
- veteran right winger who can serve as mentor to the kids
- 2 quality defensemen
- someone from the goon squad
This isn't the sort of team I enjoy watching, but then again watching Ales Hemsky get knocked around and injured isn't much fun either. Derek Boogaard is available (apparently), and I'd like to see them sign him just because he has done so much damage to the Oilers. Don't care if they play him, just keep him away from the Oilers skill players.
As for buyouts, we should hear something today. If we don't, Ethan rifles, Patrick O'Sullivan and Robert Nilsson will remain on a still-crowded depth chart. We wait.
I wonder if they will keep one of O'Sullivan or nilsson, if only for "protection" from the rookies coming in. Hall is obviously here all year, but I think the org is trying to be cautious with MPS and Eberle. I think they have internally agreed that if patty or robert beat the kids out in camp, then they send the kids down. No harm in letting them dominate the minors for half a year then call them up. And with both having no trade value, i wonder if they hope to see them play better to start the year, allowing them to deal them when injuries hit some of the contenders and then call up the kids. the more I think about it, the more I see them bringing back o'Sullivan (who can kill penalties) and robert (older version of Eberle and omark) to start the year and hoping they play well enough to move them.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the harm to the team by keeping them around (Ethan rifles has to go for chemistry and all that). We are rebuilding, so why not let the kids grow together in the minors and if they play well then they have value in trades, and if they suck again then you send them down and hope someone claims them, while bringing up the kids to replace them.
I can see them starting the year with this:
Hall-Horcoff-Hemsky
Penner-Gagner-Nilsson
O'Sullivan-Fraser-Brule
Jones-Cogliano-Stortini
And the only UFA signings are depth dmen.
I suggested Carkner as the useful piece to complete Garrioch-rumored Souray for Cheechoo trade.
ReplyDeleteToo much dead money and not enough player until you factor in Souray's injuries.
And on a side note, grebeshkov not qualified. i know he was frustrating, but wouldn't he be a solid cheap dman who can play in our top 4? not sure what he'll sign for, but i wonder if he would take a $2 mill 1 year deal. I would take him back at that price, even with the warts on his game. unless he's bitter about the deal, he seemed to bve happy in Edmonton and mentioned liking it here.
ReplyDeleteThe only concern is to make certain the young stars are able to mature without any concussions. If this means they ice a bottom 6 of goons I'm all for it. The dynasty Oil were, back in the day, the top goons in hockey and that's including the Flyers.
ReplyDeleteRenney essentially took the most disfunctional team in the NHL and turned it around almost overnight.
ReplyDeleteMy biggest concern with this roster is who the heck is going to kill penalties? And what happens if Horcoff or Fraser is the guy in the box?
ReplyDeleteI would have to think that based on the roster they are putting together and rumblings of interest in the past that the Oilers will be making a strong push for Colby Armstrong.
ReplyDeleteAt 27, he is a physical, experienced 3RW that I think could be a positive contributor and has the edge that Edmonton has been lacking of late.
I know this sounds a lot like last season as well, but adding one of Dominic Moore or Manny Malhotra would be a wonderful thing as well.
Penner-Horcoff-Hemsky
Hall-Gagner-Brule
Paajarvi-Malhotra-Armstrong
Jones-Fraser-Stortini
Lots of extra pieces there (Nilsson, Cogliano, POS) to either be dealt or dumped. I still think that there are clubs with blueliners collecting more than they're worth who would happily swap them out for those young forwards.
Either way, there's some decluttering that needs to happen, and some players up front on the FA market who could fill needs and be value signings IMO. Should be interesting to see how aggressive Tambo is when it comes to making changes...
A few interesting comments from Matheson's article today:
ReplyDelete- Ryan O'Marra: "...has played three minor-league seasons with 37 points, but didn't look out of place in a call-up for three games this season. He's realized he has to be a face-off/ penalty-killer/checker type to play in the NHL."
- "Olczyk said there has been no decision yet on whether the Oilers will buy out all or some of Ethan Moreau, Robert Nilsson or Patrick O'Sullivan..."
- On Souray: "St. Louis is the latest possibility; at the draft there were reports that the Blues might be interested in swapping Eric Brewer for Souray."
right handed 2-way center - I don't even know who that would be, I have Matt Cullen but he is left handed.
ReplyDeleteveteran right winger who can serve as mentor to the kids - Oh, you mean like Fernando Pisani?
2 quality defensemen - Aaron Johnson should beon of them, the other we get back in the Souray deal.
someone from the goon squad - My personal fave is John Scott, but we'll see what happens.
@DBO,
ReplyDeleteI could see keeping O'sully around as well and possibly nilsson. With Quinn moving up in the world, maybe renney will have better luck with o'sullivan. There's a good player in there somewhere, just doesn't come out often. This would also allow for some seasoning for the younger guys in OKC, as you've mentioned, which mgmt has preached. If we send Eberle, MPS, Omark, etc to the AHL first, it would help them be contributors when they do arrive in the show, instead of just being able to hold their own. We're in no rush here, development is key.
I can see Oilers management making a big pitch for a middle of the pack D-man from the UFA group. An Andy Sutton type with Khabibulin-esque cap hit and term.
ReplyDeleteO'Sullivan can teach Taylor Hall how to play in the NHL.
ReplyDeleteNilsson can teach Eberle how to score big time goals at NHL level.
That's why you keep these wily vets around.
misfit: you nailed my concern heading into the summer. Right now the team does not have any PK'ers up front except Horc (unless Fraser is).
ReplyDeleteHas to be addressed via FA.
Still have to cull more from the herd though to do that. POS/Nilsson are not PK'ers, Moreau is willing but unable to do it anymore.
Maybe they've not done buyouts yet because they think someone might take them? If Tambellini can get more than a bag of pucks in return he's a magician.
If they're all still here on July 1st, he's smoking the drapes.
Bringing Grebeshkov back if he's willing is an absolute no-brainer. Though he may head to Russia.
ReplyDeleteRe: Souray for Brewer - what the math says...
ReplyDeleteOver the past 3 seasons, Brewer has lost 80.3% the amount of games to injury that Souray has (82 vs. 102), but his cap hit is only 78.7% of Souray's.
So, on paper, this would be a value deal.
Oilerdago: Fraser was the Blackhawks' #1 penalty killer in 08/09 (forwards). He was basically a 2nd unit guy last year though. Chicago's PK also improved quite a bit last year, so hopefully that wasn't due to less Fraser.
ReplyDeleteWe definitely need some goons to keep our players from getting hurt. If Minny had a goon or two, I'm sure PMB and Sykora wouldn't have suffered those cuncussions last year.
- Is Brewer anything more at this point then an expensive warm body? Sure, he's better than Chorney -- then again who isn't -- and it would be good just to get rid of 44's money and maybe nothing better's out there but I won't be the least excited about him coming back.
ReplyDelete- I'll believe we have a vet RH pivot when I see one.
- I haven't gotten to line construction yet but I liked the 27-89 combo and if Hall's the golden child then put him PVP with the 10-83 duo.
Brewer only has a year left on his deal. That in itself makes it worth doing.
ReplyDeleteThanks misfit. That makes two. Would seem that right now the only other PK candidates are Reddox and O'Mara and can't see both of them making the roster with all the other kids.
ReplyDeleteI think Hall was drafted to be a center for this organization and will get a long look there.
ReplyDeletexxx-Horc-Hemsky
Penner-Gagner-xxx
MPS-Hall-Eberle
xxx-Fraser-Zorg
This would be the home line up where Renney could dictate matchups and hide the kids as much as possible. If MPS or Eberle don't make it there are lots of options (Cogliano, Brule, POS ) for Halls soft minutes wingers.
Bottom line is that Gagner has to pull his weight and then some this year. Just has to. Renney can't hide the rooks (2 or 3 as mentioned by the management)and Gagner as well.
Oiler Pk:
ReplyDeleteHorcoff, Penner, Fraser, Jones, Cogs? Hall?(he played it in WFC), Stone?, O'Sullivan?
Not exactly a murderer's row of penalty killers
Matt. N - agree, Hall only played wing in this last year.
ReplyDeleteIf he doesn't retire, Modano is going to become a FA. I'd make room for him on the 4th line for 1 year just to let him room with Hall on the road.
Matt: if you use Hall at centre, wouldn't you give him the best linemates? i realize Renney likes PVP, so maybe you flank Hall with our best wingers. How about:
ReplyDeletePenner-Hall-Hemsky (PVP)
MPS-Gagner-Eberle/Nilsson (soft minutes/shelter)
Ladd type???-Horcoff-Brule (checking line/tough minutes)
Jones-Fraser-Stortini
That's a tougher bottom 6 (what tambo said he wanted), a PVP top line if Hall can handle it, and a true checking line with some grit, along with a 4th line that should be decent in their own zone
I hope they don't play Hall at center. He's had success at LW being centered by Horcoff types pretty much his entire career (Bailey, Henrique). I think he locks down the top line LW spot, which allows the Penner-Gagner-Brule line to be kept in tact (or replace Brule with Eberle if the kid earns it or Brule wants too big a raise).
ReplyDeleteIf you trade Souray for Brewer you're also essentially getting a second round pick as well since that's about what Brewer would be worth at the trade deadline as a playoff rental. Assuming he's healthy I suppose. I like it.
ReplyDeleteI have a difficult time believing that all of Hall, Eberle and MPS will be in the Oilers' line up.
ReplyDeleteThere's a significant push to make OKC competitive and to ensure that our players have success in the AHL before breaking into the NHL. I think a "Spezza" development program might be in order for at least Eberle and MPS, Hall is likely ready, but Olczyk did say that there might be the possibility of Hall playing in the AHL because of his years of service in the CHL. I don't know enough about the rules to speak with authority, but I'm certain someone reading will.
Buyouts might be in order for POS and Nilsson, but what if you were able to pass them through waivers? This team will be nowhere near the cap or ready to compete for the Cup for the duration of their contracts. How competitive will your farm team be if these two happen to find their way there after 35 games where Eberle is a point a game and MPS is the same?
OKC could have a first line of:
POS - Nilsson, Jacques :)!
The dynasty Oil were, back in the day, the top goons in hockey and that's including the Flyers.
ReplyDeleteThere's a difference between Mark Messier (or Bob Clarke) and Colton Orr.
Renney essentially took the most disfunctional team in the NHL and turned it around almost overnight.
Okay, I think we've entered "Ignore Hunter" Zone.
2 quality defensemen - Aaron Johnson should beon of them
The Staios deal was nothing short of highway robbery, but now you're just going overboard.
If Eberle is starting the seaosn in the A, and if Gagner is as small as I remember, don't we actually need a top 6 RWer of the non-smurf variety?
ReplyDeleteI am not holding out much hope for buyouts. Welcome back to the team, Cappie. Look we got rid of the evil mean coach. Again.
I would say Hall plays wing but he's decent at draws and I can see Renney using him for that.
ReplyDeleteDBO:
ReplyDeleteIf you've got the PVP line, what's the point of a checking line? Putting your best defensive players out there to take on the second toughest opponent line? I'm not a fan of that argument.
If Renney wants to run a PVP strategy, Horcoff is our #1 center next year. Flank him with Hemsky and Penner. True that it doesn't give Hall the best linemates on the team, but unless we've given next year over to a development year already, Horcoff and not Hall will be the player that gets us wins.
Hoo said...
ReplyDeleteBuyouts might be in order for POS and Nilsson, but what if you were able to pass them through waivers?
Wouldn't you want to know before buying them out? Why buy them out if some team will pluck them off the waiver wire? Why buy them out if they can pass through and be buried in the A? Why do we not see three Oilers on waivers?
If KP and PQ were fired for not being up to snuff, how does Olczyk still have a job?
I suspect the Oilers will keep these crappy wingers around as buying them out isn't a huge gain and it at least creates some competition for spots. (The young kids have to earn a spot rather then get one by default)
ReplyDeleteWho knows maybe there will be more urgency to Nilson and POS' game?
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletei always wondered how Nilsson would do if he played with some legit talent like MPS? so IF we ended up actually keeping him, it may not be all bad!
ReplyDeletedorito: You can play against tough competition and still be in an offensive role. I think what most people consider to be a checking line would be a line that gets the majority of the defensive responsibilities. First shift after a powerplay, when there's a faceoff in the defensive zone...that sort of thing. Players who can start their shift without the puck, re-gain control of it, and get it going in the right direction.
ReplyDeletei always wondered how Nilsson would do if he played with some legit talent like MPS? so IF we ended up actually keeping him, it may not be all bad!
ReplyDeleteNilsson's got sufficient offensive skill to be a legitimate NHLer. The problem is that he brings nothing else to the table, and that his offensive skill isn't sufficient to overcome that. So yeah, if we keep him he may score 20, but he'll do it against the softest minutes, eating up icetime that could be used to shelter kids.
Today's waivers: Oystrick (ANA), Moreau, Nilsson, O'Sullivan (EDM), Fedoruk (TB), Brashear, Rissmiller, Voros (NYR). All buyout eligible.
ReplyDeleteper bobby mac
Ask and ye shall recieve Smarmy.
ReplyDelete"Renney essentially took the most disfunctional team in the NHL and turned it around almost overnight."
ReplyDelete@ Steve: Obviously you know little of the 7 straight years out of the playoffs New York Rangers, with sights such as Mark Messier reading the newspapers during team practises.
Renney gave the survivors of Sather's purge a game plan, and got them into the playoffs right away. What's your problem with that?
PS: Marty McSorely, Dave Semenko, and Ken Linseman, all say hello.
Why on earth would Tampa Bay and New York waive (buyout) 3 enforcers? Don't they know these guys are the key to success in the NHL?
ReplyDeleteIt's well udnerstood here hockey is all about outscoring, and that it doesn't matter how you do it - which is true in the grand scheme of things. But if you're protecting a one goal lead late in the game, would you rather put out the line that outscores its opposition 5-4 over 60 minutes, or the ones that outscores 2-1? It's situationally useful to have both high event outscorers and low event outscorers - the latter is what you want out of a checking line.
ReplyDeleteFor that matter, when you're defending a one goal lead late in the game, you might rather put a line that gets *outscored* 2-1 over one that outscores 5-4, since the objective at that particular moment is to prevent the other team from scoring, and the first line on average does that better than the second (of course, the second line could situationally adjust its place to become lower event in that circumstance).
@ Steve: Obviously you know little of the 7 straight years out of the playoffs New York Rangers, with sights such as Mark Messier reading the newspapers during team practises.
ReplyDeleteOh, my apologies: I thought you meant he took the *Oilers* and turned them around *literally* overnight. I'm not actually familiar with his work with the Rangers, so you could well be right.
Moreau, Nilsson, O'Sullivan (EDM)
ReplyDeleteWow, Tambi 3.0 is downright predictable doing the normal things that are required to run a team succesfully. That's pretty boring. It's more fun when they are swinging for the fences. Remember how much fun we had discussing Heatley last year!
Oil Kings take Kristian Pelss with their first pick in the CHL Import Draft.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.chl.ca/importdraft.php
Any Oil Kings thoughts for next year? Or are they still a few years away...
ReplyDeleteJapan and Paraguay going to penalty kicks, if anyone cares.
ReplyDeleteScratch that. They just might end up punting them.
ReplyDeleteWell, the three stooges are on waivers. Doubt we have any takers though. Teams would prefer to grab them on re-entry or after the free agent period I'd imagine. Nice try by Tambellini though. Can't say he's not working right now.
ReplyDeleteThe summer of Steve is on track. Three boat anchors waived. A good small ball trade.
ReplyDeleteThere is hope.
Will anyone paid less than Moreau be bought out?
ReplyDeleteAnd how could I forget. A good draft by MBS. My bad.
ReplyDeleteRenney was promoted to head coach for the Rangers who had missed seven straight years with their 90 million payroll. He organised them into a playoff team overnight, which attests to his high skill at working with young players.
ReplyDeleteBut in the end he couldn't take the rags to the next level, and got canned. He was effective for two seasons.
Am getting sentimental, missing the old Moreau. And am feeling guilty about letting my fustration with Moreau's game turn into hate.
ReplyDeleteAnd best of luck to POS. The kid deserves some good luck.
Nilsson was a fun player to watch. I wonder if this will make his dad mad enough to quit.
In case anyone is interested, the Oilers will carry a cap hit of $1.685M this year, and $1.398M next year for the buyouts of Nilsson, Moreau, and O'Sullivan. This is of course assuming nobody picks them up off waivers (can't see it happening, but you never know).
ReplyDeleteThank you, Lord.
ReplyDeleteThat really is a glimmer of hope at the end of the tunnel and not a locomotive, for a change.
Renney is not a very clutch coach.
ReplyDeleteThis is of course assuming nobody picks them up off waivers (can't see it happening, but you never know).
ReplyDeleteIt's also assuming that they buy them out. Putting them on waivers is a no-brainer whether or not buyouts are in the works.
hunter1909 said...
ReplyDeleteRenney essentially took the most disfunctional team in the NHL and turned it around almost overnight.
Wait a second, I thought Pat Quinn turned it all around. Which direction are they going now?
@ Steve
ReplyDeleteWhy would you choose noon on June 29 to put them on waivers if buyouts weren't in the works?
@ Steve
ReplyDeleteWhy would you choose noon on June 29 to put them on waivers if buyouts weren't in the works?
Fair question. About the only answer I can offer is "to keep their options open", or maybe "because that's when teams will be looking to get guys of the waiver wire".
But yeah, buyouts are probably in the works.
Boondock:
ReplyDeleteHe was actually Edmonton's second selection. With the 4th overall pick they took an American defenseman, then it appears they traded with the Chilliwak Bruins to take Pelss.
Also, it appears that our Martin Marincin is a hot commodity. First overall in the import draft to the Prince George Cougars.
-----------------
So Ethan, how does it feel to be bought out by a team you captained to a 30th place finish?
Today is a good day.
It's finally happening! Can someone help me with a depth chart?
ReplyDeleteC: Horcoff, Gagner, Fraser, Cogliano, Stone, Comrie (UFA)
L: Penner, Hall, MPS, Jacques, Jones
R: Hemsky, Brule, Stortini, Eberle, Omark, Pisani (UFA)
Do I have positions right? Am I missing people?
Hunter, to be fair, Lundqvist also had a lot to do with that turnaround. As good a job as Renney did, there's little doubt that without Henrik in net the Rangers wouldn't have 'turned around overnight'.
ReplyDeleteIt's like Hitchcock turning around the CBJ 'overnight' when Mason was playing lights out, but all of a sudden he's a bad coach once Mason struggled this season.
I'd rather the Oilers just eat the salary or bury it in the minors for those 3 players since they're all expired at the end of this season. Start next season with a clean sheet and no lingering after effects. That's a fair bit of coin for Katz to swallow though.
kris said...
ReplyDeleteRenney is not a very clutch coach.
That's not going to be a problem with the Oilers for a years years yet.
It's finally happening! Can someone help me with a depth chart?
ReplyDeleteStone is UFA
I still have a small hope that the Oil end up with 1st overall in 2011 as well.
ReplyDeleteIf you're going to dwell in the basement you might as well do it right. Franchise defencemen don't grow on trees (although Adam Larsson could still flame out for all we know).
I think I can bear another season of suck as downpayment for a decade of watching Larsson smoothly separate forwards from the puck and then hit a breaking MPS or Hall up the ice with a seamless tape to tape pass.
Can we give Taylor Hall the C yet? He's easily got the best winning track record in the Oilers organization. He'll know how to lead*!
ReplyDelete*Bookie sarcasm i.
Uni: it ain't happening unless our goaltending is even worse next year. Hall, Hemsky and a (hopefully) healthy Horcoff should all but guarantee that.
ReplyDeletePlus they have a pile of money to address the D.
I still have a small hope that the Oil end up with 1st overall in 2011 as well.
ReplyDeleteFlorida
Depth Chart:
Shawn Horcoff
Sam Gagner
Colin Fraser
Dustin Penner
Taylor Hall
Magnus Paijaarvi
Andrew Cogliano
Ryan Jones
JF Jacques
Ales Hemsky
Jordan Eberle
Gilbert Brule
Zack Stortini
Tom Gilbert
Ryan Whitney
Ladislav Smid
Theo Peckham
Nikolai Khabibulin
Devan Dubnyk
Jeff Deslauriers
I think I can bear another season of suck as downpayment for a decade of watching Larsson smoothly separate forwards from the puck and then hit a breaking MPS or Hall up the ice with a seamless tape to tape pass.
ReplyDeleteI will get as much joy by watching him go to the Bruins.
There's always hope.
I still have a small hope that the Oil end up with 1st overall in 2011 as well.
ReplyDeleteIf you're going to dwell in the basement you might as well do it right. Franchise defencemen don't grow on trees (although Adam Larsson could still flame out for all we know).
Even if he does uni, there's a potential franchise centerman available in Ryan Nugent-Hopkins from RedDeer, and another flashy RW in Kelowna's Shane McColgan. Both were coming at close to a point per game in their rookie seasons in the Dub.
Lotsa nice talent in the top end of next year's draft.
I can't say I'm a huge fan of the potential buyouts either. It seems to me they would be better off confining the pain to this year. However if they basically hate these three guys at this point, I'm not sure what else they can do.
ReplyDeleteWhere online can we look at who is on the active waiver list?
ReplyDeleteFrelbo - in the NHL section of TSN there is a 'Transactions' page. That's as close as it gets I think.
ReplyDeleteOkay,
ReplyDeleteI agree that it would've been easier to tank if we'd kept the three buyout-amigos.
Of course, it would even easier to tank if we played all three kids against fairly tough opposition all season. On the other hand, there are advantages to not being a train wreck of a team: helps with UFA signings, confidence for the kids, some of your players might have more trade value, etc.
But that's purely academic at this point. The Oilers would like to improve and take a run at the playoffs, I think.
That brings us to free agency. If the Oilers do free agency right -look for bargains, find guys who can play tough minutes, don't go for the shiney bauble- the team could have an outside chance of a playoff spot.
But free agency is where we've screwed up in the past.
Fingers crossed that we don't
a.) Sign pluggers to inflated deals
b.) Overpay a guy with inflated boxcars to a long-term deal
c.) Screw the Gagner deal. (We should lock him up super-long term NOW. Give him a Hossa-style, lowering numbers deal to lower the cap hit.
I believe Sean Couturier will be N1 overall.
ReplyDelete96 points in his pre-draft year.
As for Nilsson : D=. I'm just a bit lost at how they figured keeping Jacques around as more legit.
FPB,
ReplyDeletereplicated skill sets.
If Gagner and Brule and maybe Cogliano are all staying, and we're adding an Eberle, Nilsson is 4th on the smurf depth chart.
JFJ is presently in Newfoundland learning how to give and take a pass from Howie Meeker's illegitmate son, Gary Dornhoefer.
Sorry 4th at best, and likely 5th
ReplyDeleteCogliano better than Nilsson?
ReplyDeleteCogliano had a quite a bad year. Anyways...
I'll repeat: Sorry 4th at best, and likely 5th.
ReplyDeleteAnd I personally would be looking at these players over the past 3 years, not just 1.
With the cap going up there is probably enough room to absorb the buy outs although i am sure that the Oilers would like to be well under the cap if they are truly in a rebuild mode.
ReplyDeleteAccording to Mark Spector:
ReplyDelete"Oilers captain Ethan Moreau has been bought out, according to his agent Pat Morris."
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/2010/06/29/nhl_freeagent_chatter/
End of an era...but not comparable to Modano's
Is Modano right handed? Would he be a good 3rd/4th line centre? He would be a great mentor for the kids. Like when Oates was here. He definately taught Stoll and Horcoff a few things about faceoffs.
ReplyDeleteIf Nilsson, O'Sullivan, and Moreau are indeed bought out, here's the net effect:
ReplyDeleteWith No Buyout
---------- Dollars Cap
2010-2011 6637500 6925000
2011-2012 ------- -------
====Total 6637500 6925000
With Buyout
---------- Dollars Cap
2010-2011 1397917 1685417
2011-2012 1397917 1397917
====Total 2795834 3083334
Difference
---------- Dollars Cap
2010-2011 -5239583 -5239583
2011-2012 1397917 1397917
====Total -3841666 -3841666
Bottom line:
- Katz saves $3.8M real dollars (minus whatever the replacements cost for this year)
- Tambellini has $5.2M extra cap space for this year, but $1.4M less cap space for next year to play with
- Renney eliminates three underperformers from the dressing room (likely replaced with rookies?)
Oil Kings take Kristian Pelss with their first pick in the CHL Import Draft.
ReplyDeleteHandy to own a CHL franchise.
That's 3 picks that didn't play in the CHL last year that will this year.
Very good idea.
Re: 3 stooges
Honestly surprised that Nilsson is there as his biggest crime is being lazy.
This makes up for keeping JFJ on the roster.
Remember, according to Vish, all JFJ needs is to watch some Lucic videos and the light will finally go on.
Actually he's a player that will benefit from some sports psychology if they hire one. He just looks panicked every time the puck comes near him.
You know Tambo could almost be done up front:
ReplyDeleteIf the go with Hall as a C, they could go:
Hemmer - Gagner- Penner
Eberle- Hall - MPS (or sub Brule, Cogliano)
Brule - Horcoff - Stone/ Cogliano/ Jones
Stortini - Fraser - Jones/ Stone
Certainly if they are going to play Horcoff on the top two lines, and get a 3rd line center, they are going to still have a glut of forwards.
I can't see them fitting in Comrie unless both MPS and Eberle are farmed out.
2010-11 is a success regardless of what happens from here on in. Garbage out, cool toys in.
ReplyDeleteCan't wait to hear what crap comes out of Moreau's interview after the buyout.
Wow, loving Tambo 3.0. He's acting dare I say it...logical?
ReplyDeleteWhat impresses me about the moves is the players let go clearly fall into 1 of 2 categories.
1) They can't or won't be sent to the AHL and don't contribute to the long-term competitiveness or development cycle of that squad.
2) They were key contributors to last year's debacle on the big club and don't project as starters on a Stanley Cup contending squad.
It's funny to read comments that maybe Pouliot or O'Sullivan or Nilsson could've been better with just 1 more year. LOL
These guys are losers, non-performers and a waste of cap and roster space.
In the modern NHL, there are certain clubs (Montreal, Colorado, Philadelphia, New Jersey, Detroit) that contend nearly every year and they do so because they realize a basic tenant of the competitive balance under the salary cap: waiting on non-performers gets you nowhere. Today's GM has to be ruthless when it comes to performance evaulation.
Professional sports is and should be the ultimate "what have you done for me lately" profession. Unfortunately, it seems that only the coaches are held to that standard while players are giving numerous opportunities to repeat their ineptitude.
It seems patently obvious that none of the players failing to receive Qualifying Offers or being waived performed to a high standard last year. Thankfully Tambellini realizes this and is cutting out the deadwood.
It's absolutely awesome to see this organization's focus shifting from marginal NHLers towards legitimate prospects. Welcome aboard prospects. Good riddance suspects.
Oilers have bought out Ethan Moreau, Patrick O'Sullivan and Robert Nilsson, making all 3 players UFA
ReplyDeleteper pierre lebrun
Real_ESPNLeBrun
ReplyDelete@TSNBobMcKenzie Yes was just going to post a clarification, they technically won't be ``bought out'' until tomorrow once they clear waivers
3 minutes ago via web in reply to TSNBobMcKenzie
does darcy tucker do anything for anybody? physical veteran presence, seemed to do ok with the kids in colorado last year. not sure that he brings a lot more to the table than pisani, but with so many kids could you have room for both?
ReplyDeletewhat about bringing back winchester on a one year deal? the blues seemed to get a good year out of him 2 years ago, and he can lend a physical presence without being a hands of stone.
Does anyone have a link to confirm these buyout speculations? I can't find any info verifying this on LeBrun's Blog. Thank you.
ReplyDeleteDamn, they sure cleared waivers fast, if they really are bought out. I wonder if they actually hit the wire yesterday and we didn't hear about it.
ReplyDeleteDespite my best efforts, I've been unable to hack Bettman's laptop and I'm thinking I might have to learn Hebrew. I thought the Gemmatria and the Sephiroth would suffice, but apparently not.
http://twitter.com/Real_ESPNLeBrun
ReplyDeleteThanks, Michael. Didn't see your post before posting my comment. That makes more sense.
ReplyDeleteSpOILer, you just need the right materia. Have you defeated the Emerald monster yet?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=533153
ReplyDeleteMaybe a little of "the cart before the horse" syndrome here with the buyouts
ReplyDelete"Confusing. Even though Moreau, O'Sullivan and Nilsson have been told they WILL be bought out it's not official til they clear at 12 et tmw."
http://twitter.com/SportsnetSpec
Maybe Tambo got a little too excited now that Lowe's letting him play GM for real ;)
ReplyDeleteuni,
ReplyDeleteI have achieved Kether, defeating the terrible dragon Ouroboros, and was reborn as Filius Sapientiae, but that was naught but a blind alley that led to a You-tube clip of long dead Borscht Belt comedians.
Unless you're talking about FFVII, in which case, no.
Would be nice to hear some context around this one:
ReplyDeleteThe Edmonton Oilers, embroiled in a battle to get public funding for a new rink in the Alberta capital, are now negotiating to operate the one in Hamilton.
Edmonton Oilers president Patrick LaForge and other members of franchise owner Daryl Katz's business team were meeting with Hamilton city councillors today to negotiate a deal to take over operations of Copps Coliseum and the proposed 2015 Pan Am Games sports stadium.
Per tsn.ca
Just listening to Oilers Lunch. Some debate on the choice of Boogaard and Scott for possible acquisitions to protect the kids. Stauffer sounds confident the Oilers will get someone. Interesting that Stauff and Brownlee both felt Laraques is not in the conversation.
ReplyDeletespOILer: Reason you haven't been to hack into Bettman's computer yet is the wrong password.
ReplyDeleteTry "Napoleon".
Oilerdago...
ReplyDeleteDude, Napoleon was 3rd on my list after Fuck Canada and hotbum1952.
hunter, I think a few games need to be played before this team can be considered turned around.
ReplyDeleteSo does this top Bucky being left unprotected in the expansion draft as the least dignified exit by a captain in Oilers' history?
ReplyDeleteedit: Renney essentially took(the Rangers), who at the time were the most disfunctional team in the NHL and turned them around almost overnight.
ReplyDeletesheesh.
Heck yeah, all three of Moreau, Nilsson and O'Sullivan bought out.
ReplyDeleteTambs is having a good summer so far.
hunter, I don't think Jagr is coming. It's going to be tough.
ReplyDeleteAnd now for Renney's next act, watch him turn Cogs into a man who can win more than 30% of his face-off's.
ReplyDeleteThink the the Rocky & Bullwinkle schtick. "Hey Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat".
Pocklington had Houston.
ReplyDeleteKatz will have Hamilton.
Stauffer intimated that the thought at Northlands is to just pick up another NHL team if the Oilers leave.
He (Stauffer) also said that it wouldn't be easy for Edmonton to get another team if the Oilers leave.
I think Stauffer is right about Northlands, but wrong about another team wanting to relocate to Edmonton.
Fun times.
Pocklington had Houston.
ReplyDeleteKatz will have Hamilton.
Pocklington also had Hamilton.
I seriously doubt the Oilers will move to Hamilton. Do you see Katz giving any of his cash to the Maple Leafs and Sabres as territory fees?
ReplyDeleteThis is just posturing pointed directly at Northlands.
However a new rink is financed, area levies or otherwise, both Rexall and Northlands want to run it.
ReplyDeleteFor the record, I think Katz is committed to Edmonton.
ReplyDeleteBettman is also on record saying that any new team in Southern Ontario will be an expansion team, not a move.
It would make sense to contract a team or two before granting another team in Southern Ontario, they could get north of 400 million in expansion fees, which they wouldn't if they just allow a move.
Katz has to fight the league and the Leafs for the privilege of moving into a building that has no luxury boxes.
ReplyDeleteKnock yourself out Darryl.
Hasta lasagne, don't get any on ya.
C Ya.
anon - Darcy Tucker is terrible, seriously, he plays the bottom feeders and does little against them, can't check his hat (he never could), PK or do a damn thing worthwhile
ReplyDeleteforget him
The Oilers have gone from Holy mackerel we have a lot of forwards to having not enough.
I have no problem with the housecleaning. Jacques should have gone too but he is big and they think he might turn the corner (I disagree of course) and most of all he is cheap. His QA would be ~ 600K I think, lees than Pouliot and Potulny, a lot less than the three caballeros
I'm surprised they had the guts to gas all three but its the right move imo. Moreau is done. O'Sullivan is a headcase, no surprise really considering his upbringing and Nilsson is the biggest dogfucker I have ever seen since i worked construction one summer and we had a guy who spent his days sleeping in the truck (union shop). Guy has terrific talent but he's a tease and he had to go. I will bet that he has a terrific spring with whomever he catches on with and wrangles another contract because I think that's how he rolls. His last hot streak netted him three years for 6 mill.
Then why even look into taking over Copps Coliseum operations if it's as easy as that to de-bunk an Oilers-to-Hamilton move?
ReplyDeleteIs there another explanation besides posturing? What will be the public line?
That the real fight, Rexall Sports vs. Northlands.
ReplyDeleteKatz tring to get public funding while shutting out Northlands is a really tough sell in this town.
Steve,
LOL!
Forgot that.
Hamilton, always the bridesmaid.
Zoning, design, funding model, improvement taxes, ticket taxes. What the city provides. What the city gets back. The easy issues.
ReplyDeleteNorthlands vs. Rexall as operator. Hardball.
//Would be nice to hear some context around this one:
ReplyDeleteThe Edmonton Oilers, embroiled in a battle to get public funding for a new rink in the Alberta capital, are now negotiating to operate the one in Hamilton.//
Katz intends to run an arena management company. You can begin hiring in earnest for the business now, and have actual revenues and profits from the business by buying Copps. Size also gives you scale to negotiate with the ticket brokers and with the talent agencies because you can deliver more than one building, and one in the Toronto market.
Katz has to fight the league and the Leafs for the privilege of moving into a building that has no luxury boxes.
ReplyDeleteKnock yourself out Darryl.
Hasta lasagne, don't get any on ya.
Which is exactly why it's not going to happen, and exactly why Oilers fans don't have any reason to worry. The Anschutz Group operates the Sprint Center (owned by the Kansas City gov't) and has been trying for ages to get either an NHL team or an NBA team in there, but the Kings and Lakers aren't going anywhere. Settle down, children.
So if the Oil buy the three muskateers out, looks like the cap hit will be around $1.5 mill for the next 2 years. A savings of $4.4 million this year. With the cap going up by $2 mill, it gives the oilers a lot of room under the cap (looks like according to Cap geek almost $19.5 mill). So need to reup the RFA's (which could cost around $10 mill).
ReplyDeleteSo the Oilers will have around $9.5 million to spend if they want in order to fill out their roster. They could add 3 solid NHLer's, (2 dmen and a 3rd liner) for around $6 mill total and still have some room to make moves mid year.
If Katz is smart he positions Hamilton not as a threat but as a model. Copps, new Pan Am, AEG, scale.
ReplyDelete2010-11 Edmonton Oilers
ReplyDeletePLAYER BONUS CAP HIT
FORWARDS
Shawn Horcoff — $5,500,000
Dustin Penner — $4,250,000
Ales Hemsky — $4,100,000
* Taylor Hall — $3,750,000
* Sam Gagner — $2,300,000
* Gilbert Brule — $1,750,000
Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson ($625,000) $1,525,000
* Andrew Cogliano — $1,300,000
* Mike Comrie — $1,250,000
Jordan Eberle ($312,500) $1,158,333
Ryan Jones — $975,000
* Colin Fraser — $750,000
Zack Stortini — $700,000
* Jean-Francois Jacques — $525,000
DEFENSEMEN
* Eric Brewer — $4,500,000
Ryan Whitney — $4,000,000
Tom Gilbert — $4,000,000
Ladislav Smid — $1,300,000
Taylor Chorney ($190,000) $941,667
* Theo Peckham — $650,000
* Jason Strudwick — $550,000
GOALTENDERS
Nikolai Khabibulin — $3,750,000
* Devan Dubnyk — $850,000
BUYOUTS
* BUYOUTS — $1,685,000
LOST VIA REENTRY WAIVERS
NONE
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER SIZE 23
SALARY CAP $59,400,000
PAYROLL $50,375,000
BONUSES $1,127,500
BUYOUTS $1,685,000
CAP SPACE $8,467,500
Total guesses on some of these, but we're looking at about $8.5M in cap space next year. I'm guessing they want to free up as much as they can over the next 2 seasons so they can add some quality pieces in free agency when this team is even close to contending again...
So buyouts will happen. So bye bye 2 guys. Lineup?:
ReplyDeleteHall-Horcoff-Hemsky
Penner-Gagner-Eberle
MPS-???-Brule
Jones-Fraser-Stortini
Gilbert-Whitney
Smid-??
Peckham-???
Strudwick (I assume)
So as I mentioned before, after the RFA's are signed we'll have almost $10 million. What 1 forward and 2 dmen do we target?
Would teams still consider Moreau's contract for the upcoming season a "bonus" if they grab him off waivers?
ReplyDeleteOr does he become a "bonus" value when he is bought out or picked up at half price on recall?
It appears that Tambellini isn't leaving any dead wood standing around.
Sorry, remove Souray and you save another $5.4 mill. That's $15 million to fill out 2 dmen, 1 forward. i begin to wonder if they do make a minor splash by signing a solid dman for decent money ($3-4 mill per season). Does anyone object to Michalek on a multi year deal for $4 mill?
ReplyDeleteContext?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.thespec.com/News/BreakingNews/article/798487
1. "He stressed this is not about moving the Oilers to Hamilton".
2. This is about extending the time for Rexall to develop a proposal. In April they were given until July 1.
Some linkage in the development of the Edmonton & Hamilton biz models?
DBO -- Souray's contract will have salary coming back, you can be assured of that. We won't have close to $15M in cap space. Even with our all-rookie lineup and no UFA signings, and a rather decent dump of Souray for Brewer, the Oil only have $8.5M in cap space as noted in my post above. $8.5M for a rebuilding team should be the minimum, so I'd suggest they don't make any UFA splashes. I'd only sign cheap UFA's to replace some of the rooks...
ReplyDeleteSo with O'Sullivan and Nilsson bought out, Tambellini and Pouliot not qualified, Horton and Bernier traded, Burns available and Kostistsyn disappointing to say the least, is it time to reassess whether 2003 really was one of the strongest drafts of all time?
ReplyDeletePaginng Hbomb:
ReplyDeleteLooking forward to your long promised "sail on" post about thecaptain on the drak side of the Al Gore.
Also,
It was Laforge who stressed that the Hamilton thing has nothing to do with moving the Oilers. So I think it will be at least 6 months before he throws out a veiled threat to move.
I can't say I'm a huge fan of the potential buyouts either. It seems to me they would be better off confining the pain to this year. However if they basically hate these three guys at this point, I'm not sure what else they can do.
ReplyDeleteFor this year, I'm willing to bet that the marginal cost of the buyouts plus replacements versus the original salaries (if any) will be worth the improvement in player quality. As for next year...are we going to spend to the cap next year? Or close enough that $1.4M is going to be a problem? I'm not convinced.
As for Nilsson : D=. I'm just a bit lost at how they figured keeping Jacques around as more legit.
I'm not upset at losing any of the three, but that second sentence remains a valid question.
In the modern NHL, there are certain clubs (Montreal, Colorado, Philadelphia, New Jersey, Detroit) that contend nearly every year
I think you can make an argument for one and a half of those clubs actually being every-year contenders.
Interesting that Stauff and Brownlee both felt Laraques is not in the conversation.
That's because the last time he showed an interest in being an enforcer was before the lockout.
Is there another explanation besides posturing? What will be the public line?
"We know how to run an arena; look at what we've done in Hamilton! We don't need no stinking Northlands!"
"We know how to run an arena; look at what we've done in Hamilton! We don't need no stinking Northlands!"
ReplyDeleteThe new PanAm Stadium dev. may be more relevant than the Copps part of a deal.
Hmmm, Hamilton Oilers..... around a 2 hour flight from Moncton and only 1 time zone over, buy center ice, see all games and get to bed at decent hour.....hey I am liking it....do it Big D....lol....just kidding....I could NOT cheer for an Ontario team....even if they were called Oilers....
ReplyDeleteI think the Hamilton thing is purely a real estate investment, especially if AEG is on board. Done properly a stadium complex is a cash cow.
ReplyDeleteThe British government paid AEG to take the Millennium Dome of their hands and they turned it into the most popular and profitable concert venue in the world. It's important to note that it does not have any sports teams as a tenant, so all that profit is coming everything else that you can put in an arena, and from the rental income from all the bars and restaurants and retailers in the complex.
The traditional North American arena financial has always required one or more teams as an anchor tenant to work, but AEG has figured out how to develop profitable complexes without an anchor tenant (though it's obviously desirable because you start each financial year with 40-50 dates already booked).
I think that's what Katz has in mind for downtown, and he and AEG probably see an opportunity to do the same thing in the Southern Ontario market. They don't need a hockey team for this to make sense.
I think that's what Katz has in mind for downtown, and he and AEG probably see an opportunity to do the same thing in the Southern Ontario market. They don't need a hockey team for this to make sense.
ReplyDeleteWell, it's been stated that they want to attract an NHL tenant at some point, which is where the fear in Oilers fans comes in. But as stated above, AEG runs the Sprint Center but the Kings are still in LA. And the Kings have actually lost money in recent memory.
Marc makes a good point.
ReplyDeleteAEG would be a great partner to have in that business.
If you look at True North Sports and Entertainment, they run a very tidy business in Winnipeg with a smallish venue.
Katz didn't make his billions selling pharmaceuticals, he made his billions recognizing that the Canadian pharmaceutical retail business was ripe to be consolidated, so he worked his ass of to do that before the American consolidators got there first, and has done very well.
Perhaps he sees the same thing for sports/entertainment venues.
Regardless, Laforge will at some point put out another veiled threat to move. Book it!
I really don't think Oiler fans have much to worry about to be honest. it doesn't make much sense to move a profitable team to Southern Ontario, not when there are so many unprofitable ones in the league. And in any event, as was noted above the league really want to put an expansion team in southern Ontario so everyone gets a cut of the fee, rather than move one there and see the Leafs get all the pay off. I can't see any way that the league lets Katz move the Oilers.
ReplyDeleteAccording to Bob McKenzie twitter:
ReplyDelete"MTL ACQUIRES DUSTIN BOYD, DAN ELLIS AND FC FROM NASIN RETURN FOR SERGEI KOSTITSYNAND FC"
Interesting...there goes the idea of trying to snagging a so-called veteran cheap goalie...
visiondude.. They still have to sign him. Ya never know.
ReplyDeleteI mean, wait... We're SET in goal. SET I tell you.
Weird trade considering Boyd and Ellis are UFA's, and Kostitsyn is an RFA.
ReplyDeleteI guess it depends on what the "future considerations" going both ways end up being...bottle of Jack for a bottle of Fin du Monde or something like that?
Probably conditional picks depending on who gets signed by whom. Otherwise, it's Montreal's headache for a chance to sign a depth guy and a 1A goalie.
ReplyDeleteAccording to McKenzie, Boyd's an RFA, though he's eligible for arbitration and it sounds like he'd get more than Nashville wants to spend on a 3-4th liner. Late round picks are the future considerations for both teams, based on whether or not each team signs the players they got.
ReplyDeleteEllis has already tweeted that he's excited but that might just pro-athlete talk. I can't see why he'd be excited to step into the same situation he was in in Nashville but maybe he's really stoked about this. In any case, he has to sign first so we'll see.
It's not my money but if you're in for a penny then you're in for a pound so even though we're unlikely to contend that doesn't mean we should walk away from a Michalek who could still be good enough to help us when we are ready to get back into the playoffs.
ReplyDeleteI don't know if the plan is to play all the kids in '11 and all at once give them experience while also giving us another lottery pick but I don't want to be thin on D just for the fuck of it either.