Stu (Magnificent Bastard) MacGregor is on the record with his assessment of both Tyler Seguin and Taylor Hall. He doesn't tell us which one he likes better, but there is some good information here.
- A partial on Hall:"Taylor is an offensive dynamo. Uses his great skating and power to get to the hard areas and score goals."
- A partial on Seguin: "Tyler is an offensive centreman with very good hand skills. Quick hands, quick reads, excellent reads. A good skater that plays at a high tempo."
There's quite a bit more on that link, it's worth the trip.
Wouldn't it be great if Edmonton had a shot at either of those two get kids....oh wait... they do! Can't go wrong with either one. Edmonton will get a great young player to build around and for the fans to fall in love with. Tyler/Taylor, whichever, its going to be good for the franchise!
ReplyDeleteWhat a moment for this franchise. Historical. First overall pick, a new face, a new hope. I've got goosebumps, and we're still 5 days away.
ReplyDeleteI know may be in the minority, but I really hope that Tamblowe doesn't make a bunch of trades for picks in the 2010 draft. Teams always give up too much for draft picks in the week leading up to or on draft day. It's like a sailor coming to shore after weeks at sea. The price he is willing to pay at the brothel is much higher than it was when the ship was still 10 miles out. The time to get draft picks is at the trade deadline or in the offseason. The time to pick up solid NHL talent is on draft day when shitty teams want to show their fans that they are quickly reloading to turn the ship around. They trade real NHL threats for future potential.
Hopefully Tamblowe's plan is measured with a multiyear plan as opposed to trying to load up with as much "potential" from the 2010 draft and then icing an AHL team next year with no assets to trade for 2011/2012 picks during the season. Hemsky, Penner, and even Souray will be more valuable when teams are on the ice competing and looking for that elusive last piece of the puzzle to make a run for Stanley, not now when it is 27C outside and everyone is thinking about the 2010 crop of draftees.
Seguin: same point total, 8 more goals than Hall, on an inferior team, and with one year of junior LESS than Hall, with WJHC experience still to come.
ReplyDeleteTranslation: Seguin = better player, better potential.
Best player available: Seguin.
My feelings are generally that if we draft 1st overall we need to take Hall on the basis of best player available. He has an established level of performance at all levels of play available to him so far. Quite frankly from the growing amount of interviews available from both players I prefer Hall's team-focused approach and genuine modesty.
ReplyDeleteI would be equally happy with drafting at 2nd overall and taking whatever player is available there, on the condition that Tambellini is able to extract good value from the trade. A player like Wheeler would not be enough.
More than anything though I can't wait for the draft to come so that the focus of discussion will finally shift from Taylor/Tyler.
OFL: You could make an argument that Hall making the OHL at a younger age is more impressive.
ReplyDeleteYou could also argue that being on a offensive powerhouse like Windsor would have afforded Hall less chances. I know that seems like a crazy argument but consider this. I play on two different co-ed ball hockey teams. On the one I am far and away the best offensive player and if I'm not scoring or creating chances for my teammates, my team doesn't score. On the other team I'm one of many threats.
I know I put up less points on the stronger team. I don't get as many opportunities because the offensive burden is shared. On the weaker team the ball almost always come to me when we attack. On the stronger team the offense doesn't have to run through me.
Just something to consider...
Seguin: same point total, 8 more goals than Hall, on an inferior team, and with one year of junior LESS than Hall, with WJHC experience still to come.
ReplyDelete1. Pro-rating for games - Hall had 11-12 more points.
2. Hall has a quicker release and is projected to be a more profilic goal scorer in the NHL. Note that Hall put up 45 goals as a 16 year old.
3. Inferior team - true, but that is balanced with more TOI.
4. Seguin one of the first cuts in December for the national team. Hall has dominated whenever facing adversity.
Hall is the better choice, and who we will likely pick on Friday.
LT: Long time reader, first time poster. I always recommend this blog to friends as the place for intelligent Oilers talk. Thank you very much, and keep it up.
ReplyDeleteWolfie: I very much agree with the argument that Hall's powerhouse team would afford him less chances. I've had many experiences similar to yours throughout minor hockey. I would always put up way more points while carrying the load for a weak team, simply because no one else could produce any offense. On a strong team, a) I wouldn't get the same icetime, and b) my linemates could always produce something without me.
Seguin's sport away from hockey is lacrosse and his favorite actress is Jessica Alba...
ReplyDeleteHall's favorite movie is Avatar - his favorite activity away from the rink is cooking...
I say we choose Seguin - let Boston have the "girly man"... ;-)
Wow!
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers are going to have one of these two guys in 5 days!
I think it just sunk in.
LaForge doesn't even have to shine up the bullhorn to sell some hope.
It will be real.
MPS & 1stOV.
Should be fun to watch.
WG:
ReplyDeleteI can add Eberle to that list without blushing. Kid has done everything you could have ever asked.
After that I think there's a ledge where you add kids like Petry, Peckham, 31st OV, Lander, etc in... but I think we have a legitimate shot at having 3 guys becoming 3 difference makers in the near future in 1st OV, MPS and Eberle.
Woodguy said...
ReplyDeleteWow!
The Oilers are going to have one of these two guys in 5 days!
I think it just sunk in.
LaForge doesn't even have to shine up the bullhorn to sell some hope.
It will be real.
MPS & 1stOV.
Should be fun to watch.
Yeah, well, a little perspective.
TB has Stamkos, Hedman, Vinny, St. Louis, a real NHL goaltender and they're not carrying a bunch of lumps like Horcoff, Khabibulin, Moreau, Nilsson and O'Sullivan and still aren't a playoff team in a much weaker conference.
The barn isn't even half burned to the ground yet but I'm happy you're excited.
I'm curious how Horcoff is a bum, but Tampa is lucky to be paying Lecavalier twice as much to stand at the opponents blueline and wait for breakaways.
ReplyDeleteI'm absolutely dying in anticipation here for the draft. I'm hoping that we have a little bit of excitement along the way, in the form of a trade or 6. I'll already consider the off-season a success if Moreau is moved... I'll be giddy with excitement if Nilsson and O'Sullivan are as well.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, more on topic... I'm putting faith in MBS here. I know much more about Hall than I do about Seguin, so it wouldn't be fair for me to say the Oil "need to draft (insert name here)". Stu and his crew have seen countless hours of these guys, so the right decision should be made.
PJO
ReplyDeleteSeriously ....... moments before the Oilers announce their pick have someone put you in restraints!! If the Oil take Hall you will hurt yourself with your celebration. If they take Sequin I am seriously concerned that you will hurt someone else.
Corsi,
ReplyDeleteDid you forget to kick your daily puppy today?
No candy to steal from a baby?
I was 11 years old when the Oilers won their first cup, and there hasn't been this much promise since Messier left (except for the spring of AughtSix).
I've been a season ticket holder or shared seasons since the 2004.
No need to lecture me on perspective, I have enough that even Laforge would be daunted to sell it all.
We're getting the first overall dammit!!
WOOOHOOO!!!!!
There has been a billion posts about these two guys and some people still think it's spelt Sequin.
ReplyDeleteCorsi thinks Tampa has a real goaltender. That's all that needs to be said.
ReplyDeletePDO said...
ReplyDeleteI'm curious how Horcoff is a bum, but Tampa is lucky to be paying Lecavalier twice as much to stand at the opponents blueline and wait for breakaways.
Here ya go:
13G 23A 36P -29
24G 46A 70P -16
Both had bad seasons but a bad season for one is a career season for the other.
Vinny, poor season playing with dregs and a bad wrist. 8.1 shooting percentage.
Horcoff had a bad season playing with dregs and a bad shoulder. 10.6 shooting percentage.
But one is still twice the player the other is.
Next.
jon k said...
ReplyDeleteI would be equally happy with drafting at 2nd overall and taking whatever player is available there, on the condition that Tambellini is able to extract good value from the trade. A player like Wheeler would not be enough.
Wheeler represents more than has been paid in the past for similar moves. So basically it sounds to me like you're saying don't trade down, since you're giving it an impossible price tag..
Smarmy Boss said...
ReplyDeleteCorsi thinks Tampa has a real goaltender. That's all that needs to be said.
Really?
Nittimaki: 49 GP SV%. .909 GA/AVG. 2.87 Cap hit: 600k
Khabibulin: 18GP SV% .909 GA/AVG 3.03 Cap hit: 3.75m
You figure it out sunshine.
Enough said.
@Smarmy Boss:
ReplyDeleteI started dating this girl a few months ago. Her dad is a big Oilers fan, and I think he's pretty awesome. He pronounces Seguin as See-quin (like those things you find on dresses). I haven't the heart to correct him. lol
You know, I think the mere mention of these two prospects puts Oiler fans in crappy moods.
ReplyDeleteMan. Can't wait until Friday.
It's gonna be fun, one way or the other. To tell you the truth, LT since we know for sure it's one of these two guys, I'm more interested in seeing what other moves come about.
ReplyDeletejon k, Wolfie and PJO very effectively sum up why Hall is the BPA, and probably why most scouts have him rated as such.
ReplyDeletei agree with them wholeheartedly, but if MBS goes another way, which i don't think he will, you've got to give credit to his judgment.
I think the discontent comes from realizing there is a decision to be made...
ReplyDeleteand...
...we all have intimate personal experience with the crew about to make it.
(I am stealing someone else's joke here, but I forget whose. Speak up to claim it.)
'With the first overall pick, the Edmonton Oilers are proud to select Keegan Lowe.'
For those that want to point out Lowe's son is not eligible...Robin Kovar.
Nittimaki: 49 GP SV%. .909 GA/AVG. 2.87 Cap hit: 600k
ReplyDeleteKhabibulin: 18GP SV% .909 GA/AVG 3.03 Cap hit: 3.75m
You figure it out sunshine.
Enough said.
Where exactly was it mentioned that Khabby was a real goalie?
Woodguy said...
ReplyDeleteNittimaki: 49 GP SV%. .909 GA/AVG. 2.87 Cap hit: 600k
Khabibulin: 18GP SV% .909 GA/AVG 3.03 Cap hit: 3.75m
You figure it out sunshine.
Enough said.
Where exactly was it mentioned that Khabby was a real goalie?
Well, admitting you have a problem is the first step.
Some tall forehead here suggested the Lightning don't have a "real goaltender" but it appears they do have one on a bargain contract.
Was it you?
spoiler: I guess it depends on how you value Wheeler. Boston fans can't wait to get rid of Wheeler and his performance this year was underwhelming to say the least. His rookie season largely seems to be the result of riding high on luck.
ReplyDeleteI place more value in the 32nd overall pick than I do in Wheeler.
The Oilers are NOT going to trade down and are NOT going make a deal to pass on Hall unless they are convinced Seguin is the BPA, which at this point I no longer think they do.
ReplyDeleteI initially thought that the Seguin stories were circulating to inoculate Oiler Nation for a possible loss of the lottery ("we actually had Seguin rated higher on our lists so we still got our 1st overall" sort of stuff) but once we won the lottery it has served as a marketing bonanza to create a debate of who to take. Good on them, but the choice has not deviated for a long time.
They are doing their due diligence, and good on them, but Friday's first pick will be Hall.
Wheeler's also somewhat of a problem child too.
ReplyDeleteBut fans tend to over-react. There's no doubt he's a useful player. I'd have to say he's worth more than the 32nd.
He's not my kind of guy and I'm not that interested in making the team immediately better. But he would be a reasonable offer and I'd have to think long and hard about it. I don't see a big difference in Hall and Seguin myself so getting a Wheeler out of the deal would be a real bonus.
And assuming we can and will clear some cap space.
I'd be asking MBS how close he thinks the Top 2 are before saying yea or nay.
Highlander, I hope to Gord that optics does not play a role in the decision. If so, we're back to chasing shiny objects.
ReplyDeleteWell, admitting you have a problem is the first step.
ReplyDeleteAgain, no one was saying Khabby was a good goalie.
Some tall forehead here suggested the Lightning don't have a "real goaltender" but it appears they do have one on a bargain contract.
Was it you?
So now you've gone from real goaltender to bargin goaltender.
Way to validate Smarmy's point.
Some tall forehead here suggested the Lightning don't have a "real goaltender" but it appears they do have one on a bargain contract.
ReplyDeleteNiittymakki is a pending UFA. They do have Mike Smith however (42 GP, 3.09 GAA, .900 Sv%, $2.2 mil).
Which is one reason they also didn't make the playoffs last year.
Time for DashingSilverFox/FakeCraigMacTavish/I forget his third handle/Corsi to get a new handle. First post from "Corsi" I knew who it was. How sad is that?
ReplyDeleteGog:
ReplyDeleteFunny, you said what I was thinking... though I needed 2 posts, guess I need to work on my anti-troll work...
There's no doubt in my mind that Hall is the sexier pick. He's likely the more entertaining player too. I think he has more natural ability than Seguin. His shooting and skating are top echelon. His physical bravery, his will to win and his composure under pressure are all without dispute. And I was very impressed with his back-checking in the MC. He's coachable. The better player, right now.
ReplyDeleteI think Seguin is more intelligent with his on-ice choices and is a better student. He's blessed with a great deal of natural ability too, just not quite as much raw skating and shooting ability as Hall. His passing is a least as good, perhaps slightly better. Excels in all situations. I don't think he's satisfied with the player he is right now and has the requisite drive to get better.
Which grouping of talents do you all like better? Pretty close with strength in different areas. And how is it possible to decide who is going to be the better player 3,5,7 years down the road? Neither of these players is likely to bomb out, barring serious injury.
When it's this close should organizational need come into play? Is it better to have a Bure or an Yzerman? Which type is harder to come by?
Do we consider Hall a pure winger, or do we play him at 1st PP, winger at EVs to start with, then a development to C at EVs to eventually get him away from the wall and the corners?
Or do we consider Hall a pure winger and take the pure center? The true 1C everyone wants. Or was it the pure sniper everyone preferred? (lol) Is the difference merely a matter of taste or is it substantive? I don't think it is. I think Cs have a greater influence on the game, myself.
Which guy would Hemsky prefer? Is that even a reasonable consideration? Should re-signing Hemsky have any weight in the decision? Which choice will give Hemsky greater success? I'd call the edge to Hall there because he can provide a more immediate impact.
Should we take the guy we can put back into the Juniors so we can safely suck one more year?
An easy choice between these two fine lads, I guess, in that it would be tough to go wrong with either. But it's a tough choice in that there's no way to tell which one's going to carry you to the Stanley Cup.
But dammit, they had better get it right!
Which style of player does it make more sense to build a team around...A Messier type, or a Gretzky type? Weight or Guerin?
ReplyDeleteHow good are both players? As star prospects, suppose Crosby was a 10, Stamkos a 9, Kane an 8, and Gagner a 7.
ReplyDeleteWhere are Hall and Seguin?
Is one an 8, the other a 9?..
ReplyDeleteThis was pretty good. I didn't have to make another post and Corsi ran himself in circles.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteIf that excerpt is consistent with the rest of the article, I'd say the tone conveys that he'd like them to select Hall. Much more emphasis and excitement in those comments.
ReplyDeleteTo the guys who argue that playing on a better team is just as or more difficult to pick up points because their team mates are "equally" dangerous.
ReplyDeleteWould it also be fair to say that a team with one major scoring talent will always be matched against the toughest D men whereas the same can not be done against a multi talented team.
Can we all just go to sleep and wake up on Saturday morning.
As long as the Oilers pick one of the two of them I will be happy
Hall is the better choice, and who we will likely pick on Friday.
ReplyDeletePJO: Maybe in your opinion Hall is the better choice. What OFL has shown is that a reasonable and structured argument can be made for selecting Seguin, and if the Oilers were to select him over Hall on Friday, it would be a justifiable decision. This debate constitutes a matter of opinions, not facts (i.e. "Hall is the better choice"). Your continuing disrespect of the opinions of those who oppose your chosen position is proof that you arrogantly continue to fail to grasp this concept. Which, considering the source, isn't the least bit surprising.
I don't think anyone is going to take the opinion of an individual with no less than 15 separate bans from Oilfans.com as "fact" anytime soon. This being said, we may see a similar meltdown to when PJO, also known as Sundeep, was banned for the first time from said site approximately 5 years ago (almost as humorous as the 14 or so attempts to re-enter the discussions, only to be called out by more active members of that particular board within the first couple of posts by any of his re-registration aliases) if the Oilers are to select Seguin on Friday evening.
Add to this a known record of being expelled from various other online fan communities dating back to 2003 (Sportsnet fan forums, Esksfans.com, HFBoards), his "I'm smarter than you, your opinion sucks" approach to posting, and personal attack methodology when challenged by others, he is nothing but a nomadic troll who has not changed his spots in nearly a decade. The greatest irony is his criticism of other posters with terms such as "HF Clown", when he is the individual posting from his parents' basement with the maturity and intelligence of a 13-year old.
As for Corsi and his other aliases (FCM, OTB, and DSF by my count), he and PJO can join Traktor and Hunter as the Oilogosphere's equivalent of Souray, Moreau, O'Sullivan, and Nilsson, in that pretty much everyone else would love to see them disappear by the time September rolls around.
Just a memo from someone who is purely a reader and never posts to those more active in the discussions - don't feed the trolls, they may be few, but their garbage behavior drowns out all the excellent commentary that happens in these threads.