Somewhere along the way things fell apart on the Crazy Train. Drafted in the watershed season of 2003, JFJ scored 12 in his 17 year old season in the Q and then improved to 20 and then 36 goals before graduating to pro hockey. As an AHL rookie, Jacques scored 24 goals and things looked bright.
Along the way he began having back issues. He missed half of 07-08 and 08-09 was pretty much a writeoff. It came as a surprise for many of us when Pat Quinn decided Jacques belonged on the top line in the fall of 2009, but it's one curious choice after another when it comes to Mr. Jacques. The Edmonton Oilers have devoted 1322 even-strength minutes to the NHL career of JF Jacques and have received 9 goals and 8 assists. That's about .77 points per hour, but it was much worse for the first 50 games or so. Things are looking up! I think someone in the organization has gotten stubborn on him. I suspect someone in the organization believes he can still turn the corner. I suspect JF Jacques is gonna get run over by about 10 MBS draft picks pdq.
JFJ 10-11
- 5x5 points per 60: 0.85 (12th among regular forwards)
- 5x4 points per 60: nil
- Qual Comp: 11th toughest faced among regular forwards
- Qual Team: 2nd best available teammates among regular forwards
- Corsi Rel: -10.4 (2nd worst among regular forwards)
- Zone Start: 47.9% (2nd toughest among regular forwards)
- Zone Finish: 52.3% (5th best among regular forwards)
- Shots on goal/percentage: 28/14.29% (best among F's but DNQ)
- Boxcars: 51gp, 4-1-5
- Plus Minus: -6 on a team that was -52
- What do these numbers tell us? First, I have to point out a problem with the notes above. Although behind the net.ca tells us JFJ played with the 2nd best available linemates, he in fact played with Colin Fraser and Zack Stortini (22%) and Colin Fraser and Ryan Jones (12.5%) most of the time. So, there's a disconnect. That said, we know that coach Renney was rolling lines over much of the time so it's probably right to assume Jacques did play the soft minutes.
- What did he get done? Not much. Jacques isn't really a player at this point. I mean, he can skate like the wind and he's big so I guess Renney thought he could combine with MacIntyre and Stortini to make one useful player. The roster makeup last fall was curious, I don't know what role they felt Jacques could fill.
- How could these numbers be better? They are. In 06-07 they gave him 5 hours of even strength time and didn't get one damn thing. We're walking in high cotton now. JF Jacques spent a long time looking for a goal, remember.
- Well why do the Oilers keep him if he's no good? Jacques popularity among the Oilers management group today is probably the same reason that got him drafted: hockey men can't resist a combination of size and speed. If he could take a pass and make one, we'd be in business.
- The Oilers didn't have a lot of choices. Sure they did. The Edmonton Oilers sent down Liam Reddox and Linus Omark (among others) and kept the Crazy train. This reminds me of the period where the Oilers refused to make a decision on Jeff Deslauriers for fear of losing him to waivers. I mean, it makes you laugh except this is the team we cheer for and these decisions to keep guys like Jacques have impact all down the line.
- Yeah but they need big physical guys! No, they need actual NHL players. Jacques has experience but it's not good experience. I don't think he wants to fight much because of back worries and then there's the whole take a pass make a pass problem.
- So he won't be back? I bet he will be back. When you've got a love Jones there isn't much anyone can do for you.
- What happened to him? Either the injuries and long layoffs ruined him or he wasn't that good anyway. I think the back problems flushed him.
- Maybe he'll catch on with Detroit. Yeah, they'll waive that kid Abdelkader and bring in Jacques. Detroit drafted Fred Williams a long time ago. They learned.
- What should an Oiler fan do? Read The Road to Hockey Town. Katz is Ilitch and he hasn't figured it out yet.
- Three really smart coaches employed him. Craig MacTavish was in the business of developing talent at the NHL level (something Detroit doesn't do) and God knows he tried; Quinn was off the meds and Renney is coaching like he's in an Albert Brooks movie.
Prediction for 2010-11: 25gp, 1-1-2 (.080)
Actual 2010: 51gp, 4-1-5 (.098)
Make it stop
Make it stop
ReplyDeleteAmen.
For the love of all things sane just stop putting this guy on the roster.
If I have to hear Vish talk about how they finally figured out how to make JFJ figure it out for the 4th time I'm setting something on fire.
In 2003 he was selected by Edmonton Oilers round 2 #68.
ReplyDeleteDid we hope for more from this type of pick? This was back in the "Flying Fridge" mind set, right ?
Do you think he suffered during the era of no farm system, or was it his back ?
( I am thinking 50/50 split )
typot: where you cook your ty
Couldn't care less about the crazy train right now. Time for Bobby Louuuu to come through like he always does in game 7!
ReplyDeletex2 for WG's comment.
ReplyDeleteSeeing actual potential take a seat for JFJ and SMac on a regular basis is the only evidence a lawyer would need to convict the GM and coach of mismanagement.
ropyro - an incendiary rope
Chokesy pulls through again lol. The Van fans at work are blowing gaskets. Their puffy chested arrogance is replaced with humble fear lol.
ReplyDeleteWhat does illitch mean?
ReplyDeleteIt's hard to believe these days that he had such a bloody promising AHL season.
ReplyDeleteIt Has to be the injuries that changed everything.
It just has to be.
@Dennis: I want to agree with you, I really do because I was once a Jacques booster.
ReplyDeleteBut Michel Riesen reminds me that AHL players don't always have what it takes to take the next step.
@WG: Which surprises me, because like Dennis suggested - his AHL numbers suggest that at some point he had a clue about point production.
ReplyDeleteOT:
ReplyDeletehas sweden named a full team? does omark have a chance of getting the call now that the barons are done?
He stinks
ReplyDeleteWell in hindsight--and this isn't something I recall anyone mentioning at the time--JFJ and Poo debuted on that shared team so it's possible they were leading a charmed life.
ReplyDeleteI thought Pouliot would be terrific and Jacques scored one fewer point that season. Hell, Winchester had a bunch of points.
If Jacques was Winchester, I'd be happier.
ReplyDeleteWhy am I PVRing a Classic NHL showing of G7 '06?
ReplyDeleteI hate myself.
Jacques never looked good with NHL players. Never. Not once.
ReplyDeleteThey should have seen this guy all of twice and turfed him.
commonfan13, is it because losing in game 7 of the SCF is always preferable to finishing dead last in the regular season?
ReplyDeleteIs the title of this article a reference to The Tallest Man On Earth, by any chance?
ReplyDeleteI thought he was referencing Bob Dylan.
ReplyDeleteHow could you compare one of the worst Oilers ever to one of the greatest Dylan songs ever, especially when there are about a dozen Dylan songs that fit Jacques ineptitude so much better.
ReplyDeleteHow about this bit of altered verse:
Deflates, just like a woman, yes he does,
His relCorsi rates, just like a woman, yes it does,
And he skates just like a woman,
But he breaks just like a little girl.
wasn't expecting the zone start/finish metric to like him so much. If it wasn't with that abysmal corsi we could start thinking of him as a possible defensive forward.
ReplyDeleteEach day that JFJ remains on the roster serves as a reminder for many of us how poorly managed the 2003 draft was. While KP was an improvement over Barry Frasier, only slats made a bigger mistake in the first round.
ReplyDeleteContrast that with where a team like Nashville found Shea Webber (middle 2nd round) and it magnifies things. Am ready for this guy to get flushed so we can just move on.
Going to be interesting to see how Vancouver plays Tues. They came out good last night but poor puck handling by Schneider was the difference. Take that out and they win. Now the pressure is all on them. A defining moment for their coach and Bobby Luo.
@Brad
ReplyDeleteIllitch
Bill Needle: I agree, it's one of Dylan's best. I have no idea why anyone would think it's wasted on Jacques, in that the themes of the song (personal loss and to a lesser degree life changes one doesn't control) are the exact themes of my post.
ReplyDeleteDid anybody else notice in that Ilitch Wiki page, the Ilitch family were given the key to the City of Detroit, as was Saddam Hussein? I make that 4 degrees of separation from Toonces to Hussein. ST>Katz>Ilitch>Mayor of Detroit Rock City>Hussein.
ReplyDelete"Rhydrown" - Rhy not when your time finishes 30th again.
That should be "team" finishes 30th
ReplyDeleteUnless a kid like Hamilton eats his lunch and his lunch-dessert at the same time in TC, I suspect Jacques will be back for another year on the 4th line. Fortunately, I believe he'll be UFA after next year and we can finally be rid of him.
ReplyDeleteOh, and Best of luck to the Vancouver Canucks in their upcoming Game 7 tilt Tuesday.
Oh, and Best of luck to the Vancouver Canucks in their upcoming Game 7 tilt Tuesday.
ReplyDeleteYou forgot your sarcasm emoticon
dimpt - a misplaced dimple
Lowetide: Your view of the song shows you have a sense of melancholy and disappointment with regards to Jacques; a sense of what might have been. In that case, your song choice is an appropriate one.
ReplyDeleteBut for the fans like myself (and I've burned many a pixel on your site writing about Jacques' lack of playing ability) who have never felt that Jacques has disappointed because he's never shown any potential at the NHL level, a more pointed song is required.
The worst part of the Jacques fiasco is that about the only people who think that Jacques has something to offer as an NHL player are the ones who make the decisions about who plays and who goes.
If Jacques's on the roster next year, I might as well pick another team in October to cheer for in the playoffs instead of waiting for November, when the Oilers will be mathematically eliminated from the post-season.
800 words expended on JFJ. LT, your dedication knows no limits!
ReplyDeleteThe Oil of yore once had a player much like Jacques by the name of Curt Brackenbury. He at least provided some entertainment value to compensate for his lack of skill.
JFJ is like a mid 70's Lincoln Continental. He may turn some heads in appreciation of his sheer bulk, but in this day and age he's functionally useless.
And the Lincoln corners better...
ReplyDeleteThe Oil of yore once had a player much like Jacques by the name of Curt Brackenbury. He at least provided some entertainment value to compensate for his lack of skill.
ReplyDeleteBrakenbury couldn't skate.
He took a lot of charging penalties in a time where they rarely called it because it took him 1/2 the rink to wind up and once he got going he couldn't stop or turn very well.
JFJ is a very good skater. $0.05 head and hands.
I think its more $0.05 head than hands given that he actually scored in the AHL.
His brain hampers his game, which is why I think he panics so much on the ice.
Kevin Lowe has spent 7 years trying to crack that nut. Its time to give up.
If my some miracle of miracles JFJ suddenly "got it", his body gives out too often to play professional hockey.
Time to "Poo" him and just decline to qualify.
Man, Carolina came out huge in the first period. All over us.
ReplyDelete...we realy needed to capitalize on that 1st period powerplay...
ReplyDelete...uh, Hemmer with a shot that almost tied it up...
...bad penalty by Greene... E-Mo such a beauty on the PK... Huge kill...
...how was that not a penalty shot on the Staios glove save?
Harry Neal on the refs: "They've just decided to play a song that nobody knows the title of."
ReplyDeleteBill Needle: lol, yes I think the song choice is a good one for me.
ReplyDeleteIn the summer of 2007, I wrote this about him:
Left Wing Jean Francois Jacques. It's like watching your son sing off key at the school Christmas concert: it's a train wreck but you don't love him any less. Jacques' lack of effectiveness at the NHL level is somewhat baffling, as his AHL performance (plus his training camp) implied he was ahead of a few first rounders. I don't think they can give up on him, but JFJ will need to show a lot this fall.
--
That was three point 5 summers ago. I'd like my spanish boots of spanish leather now, please. :-)
...Man, tbose Fernando/Gem SH chances to start the 2nd are beyond painful. I should shut this off.
ReplyDeleteNote to Rem: Ward doesn't have a hole in his chest - maybe aim somewhere else next time...
ReplyDelete..forgot how good Jussi was in this game...
...off Gator's ass and in for 2-0. This might not be our night.
ReplyDeleteDid the 'Canes have that old bald WWF announcer working for them that Spring?
Oilers tweet...
ReplyDelete#Oilers have agreed to terms with D Martin Marincin on a 3-year entry-level contract. Details to come.
I think we'd better capitalize on this extended 5 on 3...
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteBob Cole openly angry at Stoll and Pronger for not shooting...
ReplyDelete...horrific hooking penalty by Smyth kills the 5 on 3. I don't think we should be in any hurry to re-sign him.
Fennando! Why is he the only guy trying to win this game?
ReplyDeleteNo shots on the PP with 7 to go in the 3rd. That had to be better.
ReplyDeleteFernando within an inch of tipping one in with 3:30 to tie it. That's the one I'll never get out of my head.
ReplyDelete...Neal now takin time to pay tribute to Pendergast...
I don't know what Mac T drew up during that TO, but I'm guessing that wasn't it...
ReplyDeleteI hate Glen Wesley's wife.
ReplyDeletecommanfan13,
ReplyDeleteWhy?
Now I'm sad at work.
ReplyDeleteShots on goal/percentage: 28/14.29% (best among F's but DNQ)
ReplyDeleteBoxcars: 51gp, 4-1-5.
The notion of a guy playing 50 games and not qualifying for shooting % metrics pretty much says it all
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI rewatched that game last night as well too and I did that because that's probably the game I remember least from that entire run.
ReplyDeleteI remember being crushed by that loss and being outside on a warm Monday night having a beer and a cigarette and trying to process it all:)
It was a helluva run but it all started getting real for me when Pronger scored that PS goal in G1. Moreau scored shortly after or at least I know that when he scored it was from a terrible angle.
The Oilers had won 10 of their last 13 games heading into the Finals and when you saw how G1 started off you had an idea that things were so lined up that they'd take the series in five games.
So when it was going good I allowed myself to finally believe and that leads to the same feeling as when you let yourself think you're gonna land that girl you always liked: when it doesn't happen it hurts all the more.
But then Smith pinched with the Oilers up by three om G1 and now it starts going the other way and Roli gets hurt and it's hang on by the fingernails time.
To look at G7 again was to see just how well the Canes played and that being all the more impressive considering how the Oilers played in G6. Sure, that goal goes in off Smith's pants in G1 but the Oilers didn't get nary a look until the third period.
Some other things:
- twice 83 picked a pass out of the air and didn't break a fucking stride. it was something to see.
- 10's certainly lost a gear when it comes to skating. when I think of him from that run, there's two things that come to mind:
1. blocking that shot in G5 of the Wings series as the clock was running out.
2. the old Pat McLean fav when 10 chased down Neidermayer who was lauded every game for his skating and who was playing great overall.
- Torres is a sideshow now because of the last few weeks but back then he was a real player. there was one play where he dumped and chased and he beat the Canes defenders so easy in the ensuing race that he had time to stop and try and set up 34 in the slot.
- I remember Ty talking about the Matt Greene penalty festival;) and even though I knew some of the endings, I still expected him to take more penalties than he did:)
- how I still felt comfortable with peca being on the ice.
- the way that Jussi kept us in there.
as for that Hawks series, I feel as bad now about their chances as I ever did.
ReplyDeleteI'm trying to read as much as I can about that series and heading into G6 the Dys said they had some things to try and slow down Chi and boy did they ever.
Time and space was limited and when the Hawks dumped and chased they weren't up for the battle like the Dys were.
I know that Luongo didn't look good when tested - the last save he made was excellent but he mishandled two rebounds just previous to that - and I guess that's what Chi can hang onto.
But Burrows woke up, the Hawks are back to living off the Bolland line and Toews looks flat out drained.
I guess Renney thought he could combine with MacIntyre and Stortini to make one useful player.
ReplyDelete...who we'll call "Zach Stortini".
(Late to the party and haven't gone through the comments yet. Apologies if someone already made this joke.)
I'm with Woodguy. JFJ thinks the game poorly and always has. He'll skate right past the puck to hit a guy, and give up the odd-man rush without a second thought ... or a first.
ReplyDelete"tuffic" - a guy who is neither tough nor terrific.