What happens next?
Music!
Aggressive on the forecheck, the penalty kill spends more time in the opposition zone and most importantly that ridiculous passive PK is out the window with Ginger in town. Reddox has formed what I believe to be an effective PK unit with young Andrew Cogliano, another benefit of having #85 around.
As a Liam Reddox fan I know this will be short-lived. The Oilers don't have any idea what they have here and will lose him on waivers eventually to a town where the management team will use his strengths and overlook his weaknesses. Reddox has played in 66 NHL games and is 5-14-19 -7 on a terrible club. I hope he gets a shot with an NHL team one day.
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Jim Vandermeer is back in the lineup and that's important. The Oilers need him to play a lot over the next 5 weeks in order to get a pick for him. I suspect he's worth a 4th round pick in today's NHL, but defensemen always get more than they're worth at the deadline.
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Elliotte Friedman's article (I wrote about it here) about the Oilers quietly shopping Penner and Hemsky is an eye opener. If you were hoping this team was going to compete next season, that's a tell. We should be prepared for another lottery pick if Steve Tambellini sells them off for prospects or picks.
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Coyotes are 10 games better than the Oilers in the standings and the big difference is the number of actual NHL players. They seem to be saving Kyle Turris too, that coaching staff is killer. Oilers coach Tom Renney seems to have given up on Gilbert Brule (or maybe his injuries tag team I don't know) but we have to give credit where due in regard to Andrew Cogliano.
We should be prepared for another lottery pick if Steve Tambellini sells them off for prospects or picks.
ReplyDeleteAnyone want to go in on a pitchfork and torch stand in Edmonton?
Not only it's like being in a coal mine these days, but a Welsh coal mine, 2 miles under the ground.
ReplyDeleteTrade away the only two established NHL forwards? For what? The right to be the Florida Panthers north?
Trade them Tambellini, I dare you.
* Plus Horcoff, of course!
ReplyDeleteSteve Tambellini is an idiot if he trades both Penner and Hemsky.
ReplyDeleteWe are already lacking actual Nhl players and he wants to go ahead and get rid of two of the best forwards on the team!
Coach wrote an article recently about how Oilers are 'managing' to lose and this will be a big blow. We have been rebuilding since we got rid of Smyth, cant we just start competing now? specially when we are this close to start competing again!
Good call LT. Kudos on Cogliano for playing good hockey without Penner carrying him around. Reddox is playing well and should stay.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers quietly shopping Penner and Hemsky isn't a huge surprise. I don't think they should move them because I doubt they will win the trade if they do. But it makes sense to inquire.
the only problem i hv with vandermeer is that he is paired with foster!
ReplyDeleteI would much rather see him paired with sort of a PMD
Sean is correct, you have to ask what the return might be. We can criticize the trade, if made, but you can't criticize shopping them around.
ReplyDeleteIf Steve Staios could get a third. I bet Vandemeer can get at least that.
ReplyDeleteLast year Lowe and Tambi were talking about a five year rebuild which in their mind means they need at least three or four years of lottery picks.
I wish the team would move to Quebec and we could get a real franchise moved in here from the south.
If Toonces trades one (or both) of Penner and Hemsky, we can add that to our list of reasons why he doesn't qualify to be an NHL GM. Along with creating a 3 year rebuild plan then keeping players on ELC's up with the club while it happens.
ReplyDeleteI have no doubt he will burn it all down again this summer. Because he got so much good press for doing that last summer, and no criticism for failing to do anything else.
LT in your eyes at what point does the team stop stockpiling picks and prospects and tries to compete?
ReplyDeleteIt seems that we have a plethora of prospects in the system now with more pushing on the door to enter the pro leagues next year. I know depth is important but at what time does the number of quality prospects hit the critical level where you cannot actual manage to groom all of them properly and the organization starts giving up on players because they are slower developers. (I have concerns about how the Oilers develop players already)
A lot of people seem to think the team should just keep trading everyone for picks and prospects, but it doesn't seem to me to be the best way to compete, ever.
Why trade a Ryan Jones when you can add a Glencross to the line next year and make that line even better?
Hemsky and Penner gone, to replace with who?
Is the strategy really to get rid of any actual NHL player (other than Horcoff) and fill the slots with kids?
God I miss the days when winning was part of the culture here.
ReplyDeleteFully agree with Sean and Highlander. It makes good sense to see what Hemsky and Penner would bring in return. Don't forgot people that the are UFA and the end of next year. Smart management will have a plan in place if the free agents are not interested in re-signing or want more money then makes sense.
ReplyDeleteAs for Renney we do owe him some due with his work with Cogliano.
MDF: I think the management/ownership has created their own "denver boot" for this season. Playing an ineffective NK as much as they do, not attempting any outside deal to address the PK, and on it goes.
ReplyDeleteIF the Oilers would address center (faceoff circle, PK), the blue (another veteran with a wide range of skills is required) and goal (someone to share the load with Dubnyk) this summer they should be able to compete.
They HAVE a goal scorer in Hall, and they HAVE a lot of skill.
The Oilers HAVE the kings and jacks, the face cards are here. It's the 6's and 7's they need to get and they are out there.
But this is a Lowe/Tambellini production and their decision is the trigger.
my personal feeling is that if the Oilers deal away Hemsky and Penner for prospects and pics, it just tells me they don't care about the product on the ice and it is all about accumulating more pics for some time in the future ... if/when they ever get good.
ReplyDeleteas a season ticket holder I find it hard to stomach another 5% price increase for a team that is intent on putting a crappy team on the ice and year after year while reducing salaries. It's a pre-lockout approach to cost control.
my interest in spending good money to attend games is becoming less and less. I get tired at the lack of management decisions to be competitive, address obvious short comings on the team or even make a trade to improve during the year.
i am beginning to think that the best approach is to just watch the games at home, turn off the bad ones, pay my $50 for annual renewal on the seat registry and hope one day there is a chance to get tickets again.
maybe that's harsh, but 2006 is a long time ago ... 5 years actually and since then it has been all downhill.
Meh, I'm not so sure that I'm seeing what you are in Friedman's article LT. I don't get the feeling that just because they're shopping them means they are looking for picks or prospects.
ReplyDeleteI would trade Hemsky if we could fill a need and not just get draft picks.Agree about Reddox as i do not know what else he has to do to get a fair shot here.As good as Jones has been i still dont think he kills penalties very well as he tends to run around.I think are rebuild or reload started when Stu M took over are scouting and so far with his record i dont think getting more picks is a bad thing.Adding more talent to Hall Eberle and Mps is not a bad thing...Patience is a key i think we will be rewarded with a contender in3 years with the direction we are headed.
ReplyDeleteLT that is the trouble, it seems every year the management of this team creates a "Denver Boot." Do they not realise that it is a new era and unless a team starts winning early in the year they are pretty much out of the play off race early?
ReplyDeleteI understand wanting some picks and prospects but really when is it enough and in reality what can you expect back in trade value for them?
it seems pre-lockout we had a lot of quality prospects for established player trades but not so much anymore. (The Halak trade did include some quality prospects) The only prospects who usually tend to get traded are prospects who have worked their way out of their organization.
I feel for you Regwald. You paid a lot money for a product that is kept deliberately terrible. They even took more out of your bank account for the priveledge.
ReplyDeletePocklington would be proud of these shysters.
Actually I don't mind that they are putting Hemsky and Penner out there. Good GMs should see what is out there. Plus I would blame either player if they looked at this organization and who was running it and decided they'd rather be playing hockey somewhere else.
I wouldn't blame either player is what I meant to say.
ReplyDeleteLT...Would you trade Hemsky for Steckel,ALzner and a second as it would help us in two areas of need and also gives Wash. secondary offense which they seem to be lacking and with Semins track record in the playoffs they might be interested.
ReplyDeleteThe worst part of the trading Penner and/or Hemsky idea is that there is no way they get near equivalent value because everyone is going to undervalue them.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers have the worst defense corps in the NHL by a fair margin. They are mediocre on defense and terrible on offense. The problems on the powerplay can be attributed to defencemen who suck. Watch them tonight--they get the puck in good positions and don't shoot, then get the puck in a bad position and do shoot, and they couldn't keep the puck in the offensive end to save their lives.
The consequence of how unimaginably bad the defence is, is that every forward on the team is better than you think because they have to get their points all by themselves.
The forwards the Oilers have right now are good enough for a playoff team. The problem is the defencemen are horrible (especially on offense).
There is no way the Oilers win a trade involving Hemsky or Penner. They are first line players good enough to play on Stanley Cup teams. No way they get the kind of return they merit.
SB agreed with the comment regarding not blaming Penner or Hemsky for moving on.
ReplyDeleteReports state that the dressing room is a pretty good area now and everyone gets on and they have fun together. It will be interesting to see if this will be enough for guys like Penner and Hemsky to take less than market value to stay here like many other teams players did (Canucks, Red Wings).
I think if they leave its a huge tell about the faith the players have in the management to run this ship properly.
Alzner would be the sort of young high end stay at home defensemen the Oilers really need.
ReplyDeleteEveryone needs to remember that we have Hemsky and Penner for the remainder of this season and all of next season after which they are totally free to sign wherever they want.
ReplyDeleteSo, we are trading 1.5 years of either or both players.
If the players are willing to sign a new contract, they should probably be kept here. If they are not willing to do so - get what you can.
While I think the Oilers should try to start winning next year (unlike the clear plan to throw this season), there is no sense sacrificing the future (as in 2012-13+) to do so.
Yeah I hear the clubhouse is good and it seems like Katz is doing a fine job of treating his team right with all these golf outings and bringing the dad's on a road trip. (If I were a player I'd love the last one)
ReplyDeleteIt really boils down to whether or not Hemsky and Penner believe the management can take the team in the direction they claim. Most of the time that seems an impossible dream.
I'll add that this team is close to a playoff team right now.
ReplyDeleteThey are a good even strength team that will get better.
Their problem is that their special teams are atrocious. This recent losing streak is because the powerplay cannot score goals and the powerplay cannot score goals because the team lacks a powerplay defencemen.
This team is two players away from contending for the playoffs. They need a faceoff winning PK specialist and they need a powerplay defencemen.
That's it. It doesn't make sense to trade what they already have to fill holes that don't exist.
MDF - agreed - the hope is that these two players see a positive future on this team.
ReplyDeleteHemksy might be more inclined to stay given the opportunity to play with Hall and some of the other young talents here. I think Penner might be drawn by the big lights of southern California or other locals. I am just guessing, but it seems to me that Edmonton might not be a good fit.
What is their wife/girlfriend status? This is probably a key factor in their decision making!
I haven't seen how Alzner is progressing but the answer from my end is no. Steckel does address need but Hemsky's loss means there's another hole (a bigger one).
ReplyDeleteDealing Hemsky at this point for something less than a quality NHL player still in his entry level deal doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
I'm thinking a healthy Brandon Dubinsky, that kind of thing.
I'll add that this team is close to a playoff team right now.
ReplyDeleteYep - just thirteen teams separating them!
I wish we had good pro scouting.
ReplyDeleteBest case scenario would be for the Oilers to target a couple of players in other organizations or the AHL that suite our needs (shutdown defenseman 3rd line center with size) and who may have lost favor where they are. Better yet wouldn't it be nice if they could target players who they knew would develop better in their system than the system they are currently in. These players generally only require picks or swapping of prospects, no giving up existing talent.
The Oil used to be good targeting players like that, Glencross, Hejda what the heck happened to our pro scouting, was there a change in personnel? Now it seems any free agent signing or trade is a dud (other than Jones that was a good grab)!
book¡e - from what I have heard Hemsky's girlfriend is an Edmontonian dont know about Penners. I think personally I would rather see Penner stay than Hemsky if it comes to one of them going. We have Gagner and Omark who are playmakers but a big power forward is something we dont have other than Penner. Hall and Pajarvi will be there in time, just not yet
ReplyDeleteLT..is it possible that we over value Hemsky and just maybe that is the reason he hasnt been moved yet.At what point do we get concerned with all his injuries.With the young studs we have is his value to us diminishing or do you see him as a tutor per say to the young guns.My concern is he eventuaaly a second liner behind Eberle and will this affect his value later as his contract ends ....then what is his value in atrade a year from now with another injury shortened season.
ReplyDeleteMDF: I think the management/ownership has created their own "denver boot" for this season.
ReplyDeleteI think you mean, "management/ownership is a denver boot and will be as long as they are in charge."
I mean, it's easy to create a crappy team, when you're a crappy manager who creates crappy teams on his best days.
"We should be prepared for another lottery pick if Steve Tambellini sells them off for prospects or picks."
ReplyDeleteThats a given this year.. so I guess you are inferring that the oil could be going for THREE straight # 1's!?..
genius.. how could tambs be held accountable if there is no plausible chance to compete..
Steckel, Alzner? These are disaster trades. That is nowhere near enough.
ReplyDeleteA shutdown defencemen? What this team needs is offense from the defense.
It's pretty hard for me to criticize management when the ideas that come from the fanbase that criticizes management are so bad.
I refuse to budge on the idea that the 2011-2012 Oilers could be an excellent team, even an outside contender with the right parts added at the deadline. That is, the Oilers could be great as soon as next season with league average management. (WHich we won't have and we won't have a call for because the media are baked.)
ReplyDeleteRemember, 1.) There's a lot of parity in the league right now. Every team in the league has a couple of holes. The best teams are solid, but not invincible in a seven game series.
2.) The Oilers have a shitload of caproom for next season. Capgeek.com has them at 42MM committed to 16 players. Let's assume the cap is, say 61MM. That gives them 19MM in cap room to fill in the roster. And note, some of those spots are 3rd pairing/4th line, low salary spots. That means we could offer huge dollars on a few one year overpays that wouldn't hurt the longterm cap situation or carry any real risk.
3.) On average, our core players are good value for their cap hits. Sure, sure Horcoff and Khabi are overpays, the latter very much so. But Hemsky, Eberle, Hall, Gagner, Whitney are excellent, excellent value, and Gilbert is fair value.
4.) All the kids will look a little better. Hall could be a killer.
When you say "we should be prepared for another lottery pick", you mean outside of the one we're getting this year, right?
ReplyDeleteWhile I think the Oilers should be talking extension rather than trade for 27/83, I don't think trading one of them would be such a bad idea. Trading both would be a nightmare, though.
The biggest problem I have with trading them is knowing that it'll create a hole in the roster than may not be filled for 3-5 years. Getting assets (even quality ones) for effective roster players is one thing. Filling holes with qualified personnel is another altogether. It's the latter that Tambellini has failed miserably at.
If Hemsky or Penner (both wingers) are traded to fill a vital team need (center, defense), I don't see the problem. Hall, Eberle, and MPS all project to be top6 wingers--unless Hall moves to center--and there are big holes on this roster when it decides to compete. I like both players quite a bit and think they'll still be contributing when the kids get very good, but dealing a winger for a position of need seems like a long-term necessity.
ReplyDeleteWith the Hemsky/Penner discussion, you have to wonder if mngmnt is floating the trial balloon or if the players have asked their agents to initiate the conversation.
ReplyDeleteIn public at least, the few words that have been said are all the right ones (from Hemsky that I recall) about wanting to be part of a re-build, liking the locker room, etc. Not sure if Penner has said anything.
But what goes on in private may not be known for sometime. Nothing would surprise me - except management being proactive. They seem to be more the types that respond after a bomb blows, vs the kind that prevents it from happening.
I still think we need to keep at least one of Hemsky/Penner for the remainder of their deals even if it means losing them for nothing.
ReplyDeleteGetting nothing in return (aside from $4.1M-$4.25M in cap space) is still better than not having the vetran support in the top 6 during this period where all of Hall/Eberle/Paajarvi/Omark are just getting their feet wet in the NHL.
Captain Obvious...Ithought Whitney and Gilbert were our offensive defensemen as they are being paid that way.Who is our shutdown guy that we have.What has Hemsky done for us in the last few years other than 2006.Jerome Iginla he is not so why do we expect to get that kind of value for him.Is he a first line right winger on a contender or is he a support player.I dont think he leads you to a cup as your marque guy.Good player yes,great no.
ReplyDeleteCaptain Obvious.. you dont think having a player like Matt Greene on this team wouldn't provide a needed boost to the back end?
ReplyDeleteIn my opinion it seems the defencemen we have that can move the puck are limited in doing so because their partners who they depend on to keep the puck out of the net don't do a very good job.
How much freedom do you have to get creative when you have to keep it in the back of your head you need to get back to your own zone to help cover up?
its nice seeing guys like Petry and Gilbert having the confidence to take the puck behind the net or to the net without having to worry what is going to happen if the puck suddenly goes the other way.
Yes, I meant a lottery pick beyond the one that is already in the bag.
ReplyDeleteIn regard to worrying over Hemsky's injury history, yes it's a worry. But if I'm trading 83, its 100 cents on the dollar. this is a guy who can impact a game and they don't grow on trees.
If ST deals him for a 2-way role player then we need to start making signs and parading in front of the Oilers offices in peaceful resistance. Seriously.
Its pretty simple really, to repeat what I just posted myself.
ReplyDeleteIf you can sign them then you do so unless whatever you bring in is better.
A pick or picks are not better than a proven NHL player.
Neither is a prospect unless that prospect is can't miss.
The Oilers need equivalent or better to these two guys. I don't blame them for seeing what is out there and if they cannot sign them then they need to move them but Penner scores twenty five to thirty goals a year and drives results and Hemsky scores nearly a a PPG and does the same.
If you want to move one of them to address a need at D or centre then that is fine but they need a frontline centre or Dman not a guy who may be good in a few years.
The Oilers have been getting diminishing returns for quality players for years. Its why they are so shitty.
Get rid of them for a poor return and in two years we'll be moving Whitney, Gilbert and Gagner, we'll still be in last place and we'll have to replace those guys too.
And a few years after that it will be Hall, Eberle and Paajarvi.
You don't get rid of good players unless the return is the same.
I agree with LT and Black Dog here. No need to give these guys away.
ReplyDeleteAlso note, the are not UFA in June, they are under contract through next season as well. There is lots of time to pull the trigger on that type of deal if one or both want to walk.
Preliminary discussions, sure, but this team lacks experienced NHL players ... getting rid of two more for prospects, picks or roll players just moves mediocrity to a new lower level which will make the NYI seem like heaven.
Oiler management has been given a free ride by the MSM and, sorry, by most fans on the net. We keep saying the team is way better that last year. Last year was an absolute abomination.
ReplyDeleteLove the kids, love how they attack at every turn but the roster is no better this year than last year.
And management because they keep telling us we are "rebuilding" get a complete pass. We have undersized skilled forwards ....lots of them. How has that changed? We have no specialists on face offs, PK, PP. How has that changed?
So when ST and Lowe sit on their hands and say we are in a rebuild-- what they are really saying is other than the amateur scouting department, they have absolutely no clue as to how to build a championship caliber organization. And if anyone can point to moves that show they can: love to see them
If they trade Hemsky and/or Penner they had better get an awful lot for them or they will have 3000 empty seats per night and they will not be in the third tier of cheap seats.
Not a threat-- just a business reality.
LT I agree with the peaceful resistance if they do something that stupid.
ReplyDeleteMy bigger fear is the mainstream fans, the ones who pay for tickets and buy jerseys no matter what the team does. These fans are the ones that Tamblowe point to and say see our fans support us.
I am a bit hazy about the Oilers in the early 90's (I try to repress those memories).
What was the final factor to stop the fans from attending the games and cause the attendance to plummet back then?
The Other John: seems we are on the same wave length :)
ReplyDeleteLet's say the Oilers are following the Chicago model, well then if you do deal off 27 and 83 for picks or prospects I guess you're hoping that Lander or Pitlick is the next Bolland and that 91 or Hamilton is the next Ladd and that you can basically keep drafting your way to being a winner without having to keep anyone.
ReplyDeleteThe best move might be to deal one of these guys if it brings in the big pivot or D that we need but if you're moving both then Jesus Christ I don't know how long it will take us to win.
Having both 27-83 around allows the kids to grow without being checked or keyed upon too much but if you move both for more youngsters than, yeah, you can write off 2012 and then you've got one year left of the kids being on their first contracts.
13 is +4 in his last 18 games and I don't know if the chances would say that's luck or bought and paid for but we know Renney's been matching him more and more so it seems like something to watch for that he's been building on.
Still, a few people here said the PK's improvement wasn't sustainable and it hasn't been because it's back off the rails and I've noticed 27 has been supplanted with 85 so I'm not sure what a difference that's made.
I still see enough bonehead defensive plays and a low enough FO PCT to have my doubts on 13 fitting in anywhere past maybe a 4th line pivot and second pairing PK guy.
The whole thing with Khabby is something I can understand for this year just in terms of the org seeing what he has left. But if he doesn't finish exceedingly strong then it's time to waive him and hope someone picks up the 1.75 mill on recall.
It's amazing to me that NHL GMs throw around draft picks on trade deadline day, but refuse to give them up on draft day. I would think that a smart GM could collect a few extra picks on deadline day and then sell high on draft day.
ReplyDeleteI don't like the idea of trading Hemsky, but if he continues to get hurt....
Agree with Dennis
ReplyDeletepoint by point
I'm a little late to this love-in for management, but there are a couple of positives that should be pointed out.
ReplyDeleteWe did address what could have been considered a weakness of the team in recent years, in skill. Someone had mentioned that we should be improving our professional scouting and well, we did in the offseason. Signing the likes of Giroux and to a lesser extent Moran and Belle shows that commitment to finding guys that could be worthwhile investments. Sure the first two haven't played a game, but that's because Hall Paajarvi and Eberle made the team straight outta junior. The three AHLers are high-end skill, I don't think that can be questioned. We re-built the depth on defence also, Top-pair guys don't just show up on silver platters waiting to be wined and dined. They have to be drafted (or swindled out of St. Louis).
Secondly, Renney is finding good ways to utilize his troops this year. As has been mentioned Cogliano seems to be finding a role, and an important one at that. He's also searched for options to the other problem that has plagued this team for years, the offensive center. Taylor Hall may not have been anyone's first answer to that question, but did he look entirely out of place? Credit where due here, at least the coaching staff is trying. Maybe Hall turns out to be the answer down the middle, along with Horc and Gagner that makes a damn good 1-2-3, a hallmark of any good team. It might take away from the winger depth but we're stacked there right now, both at the professional level and in the pipeline.
This may not be the popular opinion, but let's just see what happens in June. We've still got our draft savant, right? Things can't be all bad.
Oh and by the way, if I'm looking for a defenseman to trade Hemsky/Penner for, you go after John Carlson and not Karl Alzner, and don't take "fuck off" for an answer.
Washington Capitals ($5.5 million to $6 million):
ReplyDeleteWhatever the Capitals feel is the missing piece of their playoff puzzle, they have enough financial wiggle room to get the job done. With the ability to add upward of $5.5 million in cap hits, that's more than enough for one star talent or two players capable of heavy lifting.
Khabby for Neuvirth?
Khabby isn't capable of anything. Nobody would want him. Plus Washington's problem isn't goaltending.
ReplyDeleteHere's how much cap room we have and how good the team could be if we surrounded our kids and core guys with some one year overpays. This assumes a cap of about 61M and that we could dump a couple of guys like Brule.
ReplyDelete(Please note, some of these players may be bad signings. Others might not be signable at the dollars listed for 1 year. So be it. I'm just trying to get across an idea of how much cap room we have and how much it could buy.)
Hall-Horcoff-Hemsky
Penner-Gagner-Eberle
MPS-Arnott (5MM)-Omark
Cogliano (1.25)-Reasoner(2MM)-Fraser
Goon (500k)
Whitney-Chris Phillips (5MM)
Gilbert-Hejda (3.5M)
Foster-Smid
Petry-Peckham(.625M)
Dubnyk
Backup Goalie 2MM
Khabi*
*I list Khabi as the 24th roster player, because we'll likely be eating his cap hit. If he can go LTIR, the cap room we have is insane.
Obviously, we would need to move one of the 8 D-men, presumably Smid or Foster, for a 4th line forward. No big deal.
One positive of dealing Pensky is that it opens up first line minutes to sink or swim with. The kids could start racking up first-line numbers and really boost their long-term confidence. People look at Kane and Toews rookie years and wonder how they did so good. They were given every single opp to do so. Of course, they could have flopped, but they didn't. If we think Hall/Ebs or even MPS (or our new lottery pal) have that kind of potential, would it really hurt to start giving them that chance? Not to mention the assets would hopefully rebalance the team a bit with some nice pieces to support them in doing so.
ReplyDeleteSmarmy: I think commonfan was making jest (Khabby for Neuvirth).
ReplyDeleteOnly way that happens is if we are also trading GM's. I can't believe anyone else would be stupid enough to take Khabby off our hands.
Would like to see them move him off the roster this summer though. If you could find someone to take Souray on the last year of his contract you could afford to bury Khabby as well.
I just don't see Katz agreeing to bury two big contracts ($8.25 million) in the minor's next year.
Which is why unless DD is ready to play 50+ games next year we could be in for another long year in 11-12. The Khabby contract is the gift that keeps giving. Has to be one of the 10 worst contracts in sports right now.
you could afford to bury Khabby as well.
ReplyDeleteKhabby can't be buried in the minors, given his 35+ contract. It's LTIR, trade, or we eat his cap hit.
Michael - Hall and Eberle already have been getting some tough minutes and doing quite well so while I get your point its not really necessary to move Penner and Hemsky to open up spots for Hall and Eberle. The result is still that we are now short two more good to very good NHL players.
ReplyDeleteI don't blame them for testing the waters and if either or both says they don't want to sign then they have to get something for them
But is we assume that Omark or Cogliano can become a bonafide top nine forward then we have eight of those once the kids get traction - Hall, Eberle, Horcoff, Penner, Hemsky, Paajarvi, Gagner, Omark (for sake of argument)
Move Penner and instead of one hole you need to fill two. Move both guys and now you have to fill three.
Why would you do that unless you get proven quality in a centre or a Dman back? If you do then consider it but if nto then you had better try and keep both guys.
jmo
If we trade Penner and/or Hemsky for youth, we'll likely be a non-playoff team in 2011-2012, and presumably the year after too.
ReplyDeleteIf we're really going to tank those years, we might as well trade Whitney and Gilbert too, because we'll be burning all the value on their deals.
I mean, that path is one you could take and come out at the end a great team, but it's a long path, and you could come out of it as the Islanders. I'm not sure Oiler fans will put up with it. (They have stopped coming in the past.)
We already have: Hall, Eberle, MPS, Omark, Petry, Gagner, Marinicin, Pitlick, Lander, and the to-be-drafted lottery pick, e.g. Landeskog!
That's youth enough. It's time to start building a winner. The "re" in "rebuild" is over. Lowe and Tambellini can hide no longer.
at some point you have to dig in your heels and try and win and if you don't then basically the target keeps moving farther and farther away and some GM's will behind that.
ReplyDeleteLowe did that right up until '06 when everything magically happened and Nichols and Co had been so cheap up that point that we could afford to take on Pronger And Peca; the latter with one year left on a bad pact and the former signed to a great deal by Lowe.
Then he beat everyone to the punch early on Spacek, lifted Roli out of Minny and picked up Samsanov for a depth player and a 2nd round pick.
It was like seeing an bald fat guy picking up the best piece of trim at the bar: you will talk about it forever but you know it could only happen once.
Right now it isn't so obvious that the time is to strike - the '06 club had everything but one more D and netminding - but a couple of tweaks and maturation from the kids and we'd make the playoffs in 2012.
If you trade either of them for someone who is slightly less talented, but who fills a real need on this team (particularly at center) and who is signed for 2.5 or 3.5 years at reasonable $$, then its a fine trade
ReplyDeleteIf it's a Nieuwendyk for Iginla type trade sure. Otherwise just so no. They do that and I think I'll have to follow cricket for a few years.
ReplyDeleteThey do that and I think I'll have to follow cricket for a few years.
ReplyDeleteThat would give you time to watch up to three complete games.
Steve with the winner. SOLD AMERICAN!
ReplyDeleteHall - Horcoff - Eberle
ReplyDeletePaajarvi - Gagner - Omark
Jones - RNH? - TRADE
Reddox - Cogs - Stortini
Whitney - TRADE
Gilbert - Petry
Peckham - Smid
Dubs
Khabi
Something like that for next year wouldn't actually be that bad. Depending on the trade return, it could compete for a playoff spot next year. The key would be to get a prime top pairing Dman in any Pensky deal. If not, then pass. Also, depending on who they're targeting in the draft, if they want Landeskog, maybe target a prime 1C candidate for Pensky.
I'm just saying, yes, we will likely miss the playoffs again. I do not actually think Stevie knows what he's doing. But that rookie cluster, plus all the tasty stuff on the way, will all eventually become NHL players. Why sign a Pyatt or Fiddler when you have them marinating from within? It'll take a few years to get there, but you can at least fathom them being competitive at some point.
It would be interesting to see any recent interviews with Tambellini (or the next episode of Oil Change) to see if he really is still committed to the scorched earth policy or if he is starting to think about competing by next year. It is hard to think that anyone can't see how good the team is potentially. And is equally hard to believe that there is not an awareness of the prospect depth the team possesses.
ReplyDeleteI would think a team like the Flames (or another equally future depleted club) would not like to poach either draft picks or prospects for their current roster players. I mentionned Regehr before, who is better than all but a couple of Edm's D, and I am sure that there is a serviceable centre out there to acquire from someone else who is either cash-strapped or prospect poor (or both).
Tencer's lines...
ReplyDeleteHall - Horcoff - Penner
Paajarvi - Gagner - Omark
Reddox - Cogliano - Jones
Jacques - Fraser - Stortini
Peckham - Gilbert
Smid- Petry
Vandermeer - Foster
Dubnyk
Brule still out with an ankle injury. I was really hoping he'd have a new supposed injury every week but I guess they're sticking with the ankle thing.
I still have no idea what's wrong with Khabibulin.
Dreger says the word on the street has Skinner going to the All Star Game as a replacement. Hall next on the list?
Micheal
ReplyDelete5 of your 12 forwards are tall smurfs. Skilled smurfs but smurfs nonetheless. I do not count reddoxin that group.
We will not compete with anyone so long as our forwards average 185 lbs. Not advocating coke machines but you cannot win that small
I feel like I've been reading, but holding my tongue on these boards for ages. Anyway, I have a couple points. First is that the oilers need to start winning as soon possible. Even if we are in a development year, nothing will stagnate the development of young players more than getting used to losing and accepting it. Even now, when the playoffs are out of the picture, the goal should still be the Stanley cup. I know it's completely out of the question, but for a professional athlete, why would you set your goal any lower? My feeling in terms of development is aim high. Fail... Sure... But aim high.
ReplyDeleteIn terms of hemsky and Penner, I feel like shopping hemsky for a solid veteran d or forward would be worthwhile. I don't think hemsky is bringing enough in terms of leadership. He brings tones of skill, but I think we've got loads of that in the prospect pool. So let's get someone in here who can help make the transition a bit smoother for these kids.
Leadership is a funny thing. Pat Kane goes Ozzy on a Buffalo cab driver but wins the Stanley and now he's set for life as a leader.
ReplyDeleteHemsky helps the Oilers to G7 Stanley and hangs around for the bloodletting and is shows a lack of character?
I think it does, but not in regard to Hemsky.
The Canadian attitude about "winning right now, dammit" sure has worked wonders. Canada hasn't won a cup since the Denver Boot.
ReplyDeleteSomebody clue me in here. Are we modeling ourselves after Chicago because they deserved what they accomplished, or because Sharp showed up under the xmas tree in fancy gift wrap? I'm not thinking their plan is easily duplicated if it amounted to "trade for guy with long-shot high upside, then rub hands feverishly while cackling about world domination". Was Kevin Lowe one game away from being the Midas man? Does winning change that much?
Is Detroit really the best managed team in hockey, or merely the best managed team with Nick Lidstrom? It's a 30 team league now, and only five or six franchises could be improved as much by better management as the average fan thinks.
Sometimes I think the only way a big trade happens is when two glory seeking GMs decide to roll the eight ball. OK, one of us will be the goat, and the other one the hero.
I think with the new CBA, it's pretty much impossible to stick handle a stacked cluster by competence alone.
I don't think hemsky is bringing enough in terms of leadership.
ReplyDeleteBecause he's Czech?
Any team with serious pretentions of winning must keep it's assets and add to them, instead of playing the perpetual blushing virgin.
ReplyDeleteAs a long time Oiler fan, the idea of fucking up this rebuild and dragging it out ala the Leafs is beyond my comprehension. No doubt many of you will be able to take it(a few more years of lottery picks), but insofar as I can tell, Tambellini/Lowe either ice a competitive team next October, or else everyone might as well go home and wait for the owner to "get it", however long that takes.
How hard can it be to add depth players?
Anyone who's paying attention knows Toews is the leader.
ReplyDeleteHow good is Chicago's model if the Flyers had a goaltender?
Teams that win cups have at least one elite player. Lidstrom, Crosby, Toews, Pronger, E. Staal.
Currently we are waiting on Hall.
Anonymous - Kevin Lowe
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said... "Was Kevin Lowe one game away from being the Midas man? Does winning change that much?"
ReplyDeleteIt's not whether he won or lost in 06 that tarnished his legacy it is what he has done since then!
Prior to the run Edmonton always had hard working teams that were over achievers and more competitive then they should have been (in most cases).
Since 06 Lowe seems to have handled almost everything improperly. Every year since seemed to be filled with whale hunting and adding soft players with no chemistry or work ethic!
The reason I see no future in Tambo is the guy could not take the Canucks from contender to winner in his years there so what makes people think it will be different here?
The only thing that makes me shake my head more than people thank Tamby will ice a cup winning team, are Flames fans thinking Feaster will ice a winning team! That guy never did anything after the cup win (then again he has a cup and is thus better than Tamby..sigh)
ReplyDeleteKris,
ReplyDeleteI actually quite like the idea of signing Hejda to play along side Gilbert on the 2nd pair. If they want to roll 77 against the best the other team has to offer, it would be nice to give him a partner who has proven he can do it as well.
I don't have a problem with a Peckham/Gilbert pairing (I don't like these "all rookie" teams we're icing, but I'm not against them developing the young players), but if the goal is making the playoffs (it isn't), they'd be better off giving Gilbert a little help.
Hemsky is good for 66 games at best. He is close to FA year. Why wouldn't you shop him? Its like Havlat or Gaborik without their numbers - they haven't made that much a difference in the long run despite all the talent, and they are always hurt.
ReplyDeleteand i agree with earlier comment. don't just suspect picks in return, and don't expect a rebuild to mean one year. let them do their job, don't just criticize the possibilities.
Four more years! Four more years!
ReplyDeleteLet's face it. Tambo needs to attend a 12 step program for lottery draft addicts anonymous. He's a lotto draft junkie. :p
ReplyDeleteDrafting Hall jolted his brain with dopamine and now he's hooked.
Next year, I sadly wouldn't be surprised to be tortured again with more 'exciting last place hockey.'
The obvious tell will be when no current need is addressed externally and he does some minor roster pruning over the summer.
Hemsky and Penner have maximum trade value at this years deadline (if they are healthy).
ReplyDeleteSince you have to sign them to new contracts, it would be poor judgment not to find out what they might return in trade, to give an indication of how much you should offer to re-sign them.
I doubt both get traded. I expect one might get traded at the deadline or next summer, if you get a real player (center or defensman) in return. I doubt either goes for prospects and picks.
Mike Fisher has a limited no move beginning next summer (and Edmonton probably won't be on his list), but a deal like Penner and Cogliano for Fisher would be a good deal.
I hate Spezza (and his contract is toxic and Campbell-like) but I'm sure Ottawa would likely trade him for Penner and Cogliano and a pick to get rid of that contract.
If the Rangers decide to trade Gaborik to LA (LA is desperate for a 1st line left wing to play with Kopitar), they might have some interest in Hemsky.
Maybe a three way gets worked. LA has a lot of good young players they might trade.
Penner and Cogliano for Weiss?
Penner for Beauchemin?
I have very high hopes for Lander and Hamilton on the team by next Christmas, both are intelligent players and very good defensively. That is an immediate upgrade from our soft third line.
ReplyDeleteThere is some offense and size there as well. Too soon to predict Pitlick's development. It's a huge adjustment from College to Junior,just from the travel and amount of games. There are times when he dominates games. So the future is not all doom and gloom
Fun Facts:
ReplyDeleteES Goal Scoring in OKC:
Colin McDonald - 13
Alexandre Giroux - 11
Milan Kytnar - 6
Brad Moran - 6
Teemu Hartikainen - 6
Best +/- in OKC, played at least 10 games:
Ryan O'Marra 13
Richard Petiot 10
Jake Taylor 6
Alex Plante 4
Brad Moran 2
Chris Vandevelde at -15 has the worst.
Belle is the worst d-man at -11.
It will be nice to see DD and see how he does with his latest shot at BTB games.
ReplyDeleteHe didn't have a chance on either goal on Sunday night and he looked pretty good outside of a couple of big rebounds.
But I'd really like to see him run with the ball and force the Oilers hand into giving him more starts.
Yeah, it would be nice to no more about Dubnyk before offseason and free agency.
ReplyDeleteIf he can play well, maybe Khabi can be a back-up while not in jail, and you have a serviceable duo. (While he's injured and behind bars, you'll need as good a "tweener" goalie in OKC as you can get to call up.)
If Dubnyk really sucks, they'll have to eat Khabi's cap hit and contract and sign someone decent-ish to do a reasonably good job with a bunch of games. That shouldn't be hard to do.
Of course, I mean "know," not "no." I is gud righter.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I like the kid's numbers but we need to see what he'll do once he has to play a bit more and the book starts to get written on him.
ReplyDeleteAs someone who didn't overly like Reddox when he was first attempting to crack the team (and much of that was just how much MacT loved him, and less due to Reddox), I really hope he can stick this time.
ReplyDeleteHe reminds me, in a way, of Marchant. Smaller guy, some speed and tons of heart and try. He's exactly the kind of fourth liner you want; works his ass off, can be effective on the PK (which has improved a fair bit from its lowpoint earlier this year), and relatively cheap on the salary roll.
As for shopping Penner and Hemsky.. I agree they should be seeing what they could possibly get for them, but I remember two years ago when someone on TSN (Dreger?) noted that if the Oilers put Hemsky up for trade, they'd have 29 teams calling, and that's true, and for a good reason.
Hemsky is unlikely to ever play a full season (sad, but true), but for those games he gives you.. he usually on of your best players who can saw off against the toughs. Moreover, with the established injury history he's likely to be a relative bargain. Yes, he's going to miss games, but you can use those games to see if a younger guy can make an impact without having to throw them to the wolves for a full season or two (Cogs, Gagner).
Penner is an even safer bet to try and retain, in terms of what he brings to the team; relatively clean injury sheet, makes an impact and merely often looks bad rather than actually being bad.
Both of them provide massively important aspects that this team needs, now more than ever; shelter for the young guns. One of Hemsky's problems in his younger days was often being the single guy opposing teams had to key on.
And, I'll admit, I'm a huge Hemsky fan-boy. The guy makes me want to watch games just to see what he -might- do.
Hey, it's Elliotte Friedman.
ReplyDeleteA friend of mine from Edmonton sent me a link to this. Let me just say that I don't think the Oilers are shopping those two per se. It sounds like they are listening.
Sort of: "Make us an offer. If it intrigues us, we'll talk further. It's far from a certainty they are dealt."
EF
Hey there, its Kevin Lowe.
ReplyDeleteYou guys are mean.
KL
That wasn't Kevin, that was me. Couldn't resist being a dink.
ReplyDeletePlus I've been drinking.
Godot - they had better get more than Beauchemin for Penner, he's looking kind of done. Too bad because Beauchemin at his best is what this team needs exactly.
If Hemsky and Penner are traded they need actual NHLers in return. They also need quality in return.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure who Tambo would deal with but without looking at capgeek I assume there aren't many fits out there given both players still have another year on their contracts.
LA comes to mind but I don't see anyone up front they would be willing to deal or that suit what Edmonton wants or needs to do. On the backend there are some nice pieces but aside from Johnson and Doughty (likely untouchables at this point) then you're looking at prospects and that's a non starter right now.
Boston still looks like it could be a fit but the Oilers would have to take back some salary for any deal to work. Krejci and Bergeron could be targets. Krejci isn't very big though. I love Bergeron but his concussion history is a little scary. He's got better size and is a good 2 way guy not unlike Horcoff. I don't see Boston trading either centre at the deadline because of Savard's injury and Seguin not yet established.
I would absolutely prefer both players being re-signed if the price is right.
A quick informal poll here, but what is the general consensus on Hemsky vs Havlat?
ReplyDeleteWhich one is better?
Just curious, as Havlat has a long term deal now, and wondering how Hemsky slots alongside his ?
Anyone find a stream? Atdhe isn't working for me.
ReplyDelete@grant
ReplyDeleteHere ya go.
http://sto-sports.net/channel-1
http://sto-sports.net/channel-1
ReplyDeleteMuch obliged gents!
ReplyDeleteAs Dubnyk's GP and shots faced creep upwards, he seems to be maintaining his slightly above average play. Honestly, he has to be considered a positive story on the year, no? A .918 is pretty solid and after decades of failed attempts to produce goalies through the draft, Edmonton seems to have a guy that can play.
ReplyDeleteShowerhead: Yeah, I'd say DD has had a good season thus far and hope the Oilers play him more. This is a good season to find out about him since he's inexpensive and signed for another year.
ReplyDeleteElliotte, if that's really you then it's nice to see you drop in.
ReplyDeleteAs for the game I had the chances at 3-12 - 3-10 EV - and the Oilers are lucky the Yotes are missing the net a lot because they are getting the puck in some prime scoring chances. The Oilers had have all their chances from the 10 line and the only other time anyone came close to a chance was when 23 threw the puck from behind the net only to have neither 89 or 91 unable to cash.
The Oilers PK has gone all Dennis Green on us again - they are who we thought they were - and I'm wondering why they don't shove in 10-27 as a third PK pair just to be able to get more energy on that unit.
49's really having a tough go with the puck right now as there was a play with a little over a min left in the frame when he went back and got the puck and had lots of time but then just threw it up to where the Yotes right dman could easily pick it off. I know it's growing pains but as we talk about what's needed next year we must remember we need a Damn Good dman to compliment 6-49-77.
I'm wondering why they don't shove in 10-27 as a third PK pair just to be able to get more energy on that unit.
ReplyDeleteI laughed really hard at this one.
Dennis: You're absolutely right re: the PK and chances against. Despite a goal and some pretty good saves, Phoenix has also flat out missed from a couple of prime spots so far. It's painful.
ReplyDeleteOne thing that the 06 Oilers seemed to be able to do on the penalty kill as well as I've ever seen was pressure a puck carrier who'd received a bad pass or lost control. This year's version is usually lightyears behind being in the right spot to even give pressure a thought, but guys like Peca, Pronger, Horcoff, Smith, etc seemed to know exactly when to collapse on the puck carrier. One bad bounce and he had guys all over him.
Funny to say, but we were spoiled once.
Get the puck deep BEFORE you change. Will they ever learn?
ReplyDeleteBrutal change - not sure what Smid was thinking when he jumped on the ice.
ReplyDelete****the dog for Landeskog.
I love the apathy here when the Oilers actually score...
ReplyDeleteWe love to bitch about the ones that go in against us but we don't like to cheer the ones that go in for us...
The 4th line as constructed has had some decent shifts the last few games.
F Me that's more free looks from the Oilers slot in 1/2 a game than some teams let up in 10 games.
ReplyDeleteOpposing coaches must fall off their chairs when pre-scouting the Oilers. Boys, just go 15ft in front of the goaltender and swing away!
Wolfie: A goal by JF Jacques increases the danger of another contract. Mixed blessing.
ReplyDeleteNice hit there by Petry.
Wolfie, that goal sucked.
ReplyDeleteBetter?
Ok Wolfie. Here's some enthusiasm.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers are on the Power Play!
Oh, wait...
put the 4th line on the pp!!!
ReplyDeleteWolfie: For me it's that the season is so lost. I've started cheering for process as opposed to results, which is an odd thing. 91 without the puck, Hall's shots missing less, Dubnyk maintaining a decent save percentage as time goes by.
ReplyDeleteAs for as a goal bouncing in off Jacques, I almost can't even see how that's good for the Oilers long term.
Mr. Debakey: ROM has a ridiculous number of assists on points.
ReplyDeletePaajarvi seems to be finding his stride, love his speed. If he can bury more and more of those rushes, a nice weapon he will be.
ReplyDeleteGagner, Gagner, Gagner. Shoot for the goalie's head, don't pass to Smid three feet away with the open net. Oh, the shame of it.
ReplyDeleteWhy the hell not put the fourth line on the powerplay. They could hardly do any worse than the dudes who Are on the powerplay.
ReplyDeleteLast game the fourth line (Stortini, actually) drew a penalty in an 8-second shift and immediately got nailed back onto the bench so the other guys could come out, lose the faceoff and spend two minutes chasing their tails.
I'm not an expert coach or anything, but if I was running a 1 for 53 PP I'd have an ironclad rule that the line that draws the powerplay gets either the first 30 seconds or the last, depending on where they were in their shift. Often times that will be the top two lines anyway, but a little democracy when the regulars are fucking the dog would be a good thing.
In a similar vein I would have used Andrew Cogliano in the shootout the other night, the day after he won the team shootout competition FFS. Instead it's back to Sam "O for the 21st Century" Gagner with the usual outcome.
/rant
I had the Oilers outchancing 10-6 in that period and overall the difference is that we're -1 on the ST and that we made a bigger mistake than the Yotes did, ie the bad change.
ReplyDeleteThere's no way we'd get an official count on this but I wonder how many chances we give up due to a dumb line change as opposed to how many we garner? It has to be something like four or five to one.
A good game thus far by DD as he's staring down some great chances and I guess the book on him is he's good enough that Phx feels like they've gotta go high every chance they get.
Oilers can't score on the PP to save their fucking lives so the best chance for tonight is they take it to OT...before they lose in the SO.
One last thought and that's how Renney's gonna have to lose it on the refs pretty soon. That goddman Lepisto could have at least three holding minors all by himself and there was one play where the defender had 10's stick wrapped up for about five seconds and to the point where Phx started their breakout because of it and Horcoff just threw up his hands in resignation.
Also, I want him gone ASAP but that was a good goal by 22. First off he was robbed by the goalie on a nice greasy play from the left crease and then he stood around and put his stick on the ice right outside a prime scoring area,
ReplyDeleteDennis: That's how it rolls with Team NHL.
ReplyDeleteBruce, that's loser talk. So yeah, run out the fourth line on the PP.
ReplyDelete4 out of 4 Oiler centres below 50% on the dot. Team is 11/32=34%.
ReplyDeleteI am so fucking sick of this.
RiversQ: This just in ... we're losers.
ReplyDeleteFuck, man, you gotta change things up once in a while. 1 for 15 games! It ain't working!
Yeah, I'd always put Hall out there before Jacques. Even when things aren't going well.
ReplyDeleteYay. Hall scored. Goal scorer's goal.
ReplyDeleteOh wait...the Oilers scored on a Power Play?
ReplyDeleteWhat next, frogs and locusts?
Oilers 50% on the PP tonight?
ReplyDeleteSo lazy -
ReplyDeleteDidn't even let the puck touch his stick!
Nice pass Gags!!!!
ReplyDeletehahahhahah! The PP! XD
ReplyDeleteWho chooses these camera angles? Seriously, am I getting jaded about everything Oiler or did they just show us 4 replays without a frame of Gagner's pass or the play as a whole?
ReplyDeleteUh oh, start drawing up the parade route.
ReplyDeleteQuick question: how many Staples errors did Gagner pick up on the Omark goal?
ReplyDeleteI think the Staples error, should be called "Staples's error"
ReplyDeleteRiversQ: Don't you worry - that route is fixed and includes MBS, Tambellini, the #1 pick, and a few steps from the podium to Edmonton's table.
ReplyDeleteCancel the parade.
ReplyDeleteI don't think you could assign any errors on that one. Just a fantastic play by Doan and I'm not sure how Upshall handled that hard of a slap pass.
ReplyDeleteI sort of doubt that Upshall could do that again.
ReplyDeleteYou gotta give Staples credit for being stubborn. It makes zero sense and yet on it goes... Anyone notice the parallels?
Any errors on that one go to the forwards who got trapped on the 3-on-2. At first glance it looked like Reddox got rooted on the spot out in the neutral zone.
ReplyDeleteIt was a pretty nice goal, though. Not much the D or G could do about it.
Omark is continuing to prove that he needs to go down to preserve the chance at the lottery pick. Kid is a junkyard dog. Never gives up. I so enjoy watching him play (even if he does give up a bit the other way).
ReplyDeleteI wanna punch Rickards in the mouth (idiot commercials for a good beer)
I am assigning a Staples's error to SK. Clearly Gilbery is responsible for that goal against.
ReplyDeleteI don't think Staples has been snarky like most of the MSM towards the blogosphere, so i find it hard to get behind taking jabs at his work. Personally I think errors to scoring chances, can be a useful bit of information to have when used in context with desjardins stats etc
ReplyDeleteWay to go Cannonball
ReplyDeleteBrakes, Taylor. Brakes.
ReplyDeleteWow.
ReplyDeleteOil showing some nice tenacity this period.
ReplyDeleteSmid woulda got four holding penalties for that.
ReplyDeleteI agree with danny. It isnt the most scientific calculation, but it adds context to the game sheet, albeit a subjective one.
ReplyDeleteGilbery could have maybe tied Upshall's stick up before the slap pass came accross, but there's no effin way he could react fast enough to deflect the slap pass away.
ReplyDeleteSK: It was a great play, let's leave it at that.
ReplyDeleteI absolutely love how the Coyotes announcers don'T sound like moronic douchebags.
Wow. Reddox must be a Red Wing, that was a penalty.
ReplyDeletesorry SK, I was being fecetious. I'm barely watching the game.
ReplyDeleteWhen I do watch, the Oil seem to be doing okay. Add Whitney, Eberle, Hemsky, and 10MM in free agents and it's a good team.
This is a pretty poorly reffed game both ways.
ReplyDeletehaha, that actually was a pretty lazy shot
ReplyDeleteGreat. Lazy scores. He could have done it better. Hall's great though.
ReplyDeleteMore excitement. Penner scores.
ReplyDeleteCheeseburgers!
Ha ha ha
ReplyDeleteWay to go Fridge!
That had to be going 2 mph.
That's a pretty dynamic game from the top line. If I were Hemsky I might start feeling an inkling of nervousness.
ReplyDeleteHa ha The parade is back on.
ReplyDeleteLuggage giveaway too.
ReplyDeletePenner was too lazy to even take a real shot.
ReplyDeleteNOW. How do they screw THIS up?
ReplyDeleteWhy did Horcoff think he scored that?
ReplyDeleteBecause that wasn't a penalty when it happened to 10?
ReplyDeleteKris: I'm pretty sure it's not uncommon for players to celebrate their teammates' goals.
ReplyDeleteDamn that Penner. Never scores when it matters.
ReplyDeleteLooked to me like he thought he scored it. That may be because the Pho feed was following him around as if he was the goal scorer while he knuckled-bumped his teammates, with "Dustin Penner" on the screen.
ReplyDeleteI forget, are we happy or sad when the Oilers win?
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed the last two periods (missed the first). Oilers definitely played like a young team; a lot of dumb mistakes, but a lot of try to get the win, and a win they probably needed to get just to feel good.
ReplyDeleteThe points by the kids makes it a win-win.
Penner was hungry. Didn't want to wait for OT to finish.
ReplyDeleteI think when a player scores his teammates should look jealous and disappointed.
ReplyDeleteLOL! Penner must be having fun with people there, saying how he only needed to give 10% to get the goal.
ReplyDeleteIs anyone else watching these postgame interviews? They're gold. Omark just sneaks up on Gene Principe. He's like an elf.
ReplyDeleteBad 1st period and better 2nd & 3rd. Thought 4/10/27 clearly outchanced tonight and 89/23/91 had some good sustained pressure - interested to see how the chances bear out. Happy to see them win one and always fun to watch 4 - makes the odd rookie gaffe, but the kid doesn't have an "off" button. The difference in compete level between him and the likes of Nilsson and O'Sullivan is unreal.
ReplyDeleteI'll echo a previous comment though: we give up way too many chances on line changes.
Great game by DD
ReplyDeleteIf Hall drives the net like that on a Jan game in Phoenix, I can't wait to see him when the games start to have some meaning in the standings.
They'll matter eventually right??
I think Hall should spend the year in Junior, I don't like how the Oilers are rushing his development.
ReplyDeleteI just don't understand why, when they finally win one again, it had to be against the Jets. Can't they beat one of the asshole teams? I mean... it's not like there's any shortage of them in the West. Sigh.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=3566
ReplyDeleteI had the chances at 23-25 and 20-13 for the Oilers in the last 40 min so you're damn right I'm gonna enjoy this one.
Plus, I've got a 20 dollar parlay on
- the Celts by -16.5 and they won by 17;
- the Oilers in reg at +260, and they get a goal with 22 seconds left
- and now I've got the Lakers by -8 and they're up by 28 at home.
that will be a tidy $245 dollar profit so it's a good night all around.
@Dennis: Enjoy. You deserve a break for all the grunt work you do.
ReplyDeleteThose are pretty razor thin margins on your first two, though. Likelihood of a team getting a late winner in regulation in the Bettman point era are way down there.
bruce: oh yeah, I understand how lucky I was - that's why they call it gambling;) - and that's why I am gonna enjoy it.
ReplyDeleteand I hedged on some totals to make sure I win no matter what.
celts had the ball with 23.5 left which meant no point for the cavs to foul. i had the oilers written off as soon as they didn't tie it before the end of the second and then once they got up 3-2 I switched on the Lakers and they were up by 17 points super early. then upshall scored and more heartbreak.
and I had the Oilers given up on, to say the least.
I think Hall should spend the year in Junior, I don't like how the Oilers are rushing his development.
ReplyDeleteYea. I'm so glad he's here to lead us to a great playoffs run. Can we buy tickets yet?
The Oilers will always sell you tickets in advance for something.
ReplyDeleteHow many do you want?
Deano: They only reinburse in credits tough.
ReplyDeleteTwo tickets to game 4 of the finals please! I'm predicting a sweep!
ReplyDeleteYea. I'm so glad he's here to lead us to a great playoffs run. Can we buy tickets yet?
ReplyDeleteYou're right, because the Oilers are not making the playoffs, Hall would be better off in Juniors. I think the positives he brings outweigh the impact of the extra year on his contract in a few years time. We might see Hemsky or Penner resign at a reasonable rate as opposed to jumping as soon as possible. There are a lot of reasons to have him here. Some people were arguing that the Oilers were rushing him by bringing him to the NHL. I don't think they were and I think he has proven that.
was just at the hitmen game...hamilton was okay, but tough to really get a read on him because his team is so much better than the hitmen...different league. we sat right inbetween two different pods of scouts. MBS was sitting around with all of them -- i would have pegged it as about 5 different represented teams, from the scouting dept.
ReplyDeleteMBS wrote a lot after plays by Trask and Siemens, for what it's worth. Schenn was a bit of a puck hog, which won't translate to the show, but he knows how to get the puck to the crease. hamilton played on a line with trask and schenn, and it was boys vs men out there.
is sportsnet replaying the oil game tonight?
Thanks Jfry. I'm planning to catch the Blades at Rexall tomorrow. Not too surprised to see Hamilton and Schenn reunited. :)
ReplyDeleteI think the positives he brings outweigh the impact of the extra year on his contract in a few years time.
ReplyDeleteWell, I hope you're right!
Fun game tonight. It's sure nice to see some actual chemistry from some of the lines. That pass in front of the net from Horcoff to Hall was great.
I now see why Hall wears those big ass shoulder pads. They're for taking out goal posts.
Foster actually hit the net! I think he had his eyes closed.
Gagner 2-10 on the dots.. Yuck.
@bruce
ReplyDeletethe hitmen scored 2 goals in the last coupla minutes and the final score really didn't reflect the game -- 8-2 would be a more accurate description of the game. hopefully the oilkings give you a more even playing field
i saw stanford really bad in net for the Blades -- the two rapid fire goals at the end of the game, didn't really come as much of a surprise. He's big(ish), but that's about it. No confidence at all -- always looking back to see if he stopped it. I suspect it was an off night?
on the other hand, captain Teijan Zahn was slick in a -1 effort. I didn't expect to like him, but he was really patient with the puck; a nice calmness out there.
Would love to hear what you see.
Thanks again, Jfry. I'm sure in due course I'll be doing a game report - or should I say, a scouting report on Hamilton - over at Cult of Hockey, where I've been tracking all the Oilers drafts as they come through town. If I'm lucky I'll snare an interview with him as well.
ReplyDeleteYou're right, because the Oilers are not making the playoffs, Hall would be better off in Juniors.
ReplyDeleteIt's a moot point because it would have been all kinds of suicide to the edmonton management group to send him back to juniors.
paajarvi on the other hand, staying in Sweden would have made the most sense, if we are talking about one of the three uber rookies staying out of the NHL.
His cap hit is less then half of Hall's and it probably wouldn't have bothered him as much to stay in Sweden, plus the media and fans wouldn't implode like they would have if Hall had been sent down.
Yes, but there were no contract benefits to leaving Paajarvi there (I believe)
ReplyDeletePaajarvi is 19 so it would have preserved one of his entry level seasons at $1.5 million.
ReplyDeletePaajarvi was playing in a Euro league so I believe (and i am working from memory here) that it would not have preserved a year of his entry level seasons.
ReplyDeleteThe rules are different when you come out of a pro league in Europe.
Correct?
His cap hit is less then half of Hall's and it probably wouldn't have bothered him as much to stay in Sweden, plus the media and fans wouldn't implode like they would have if Hall had been sent down.
ReplyDeleteYeah, we could have had another year of Ethanthecaptainmoreau or P.O'Sullivan instead of giving Magnus some Renney-time.
Wouldn't it be great if decisions were made in a vacuum with no other factors influencing them?
My understanding is that a rookie's ELC does not start to run until he is 20 years old at the start of the season or he plays 10 games in the NHL before the age of 20. This would be regardless of whether he plays in the SEL, AHL, or CHL.
ReplyDeletePaajarvi's contract would have been delayed a year if he stayed in the SEL.
MPS seems to be intimidated by our more physical play. Another year in the SEL would not have helped with that. Some time in the AHL against smaller, slower, weaker opponents but with the same style of play could have brought him along faster, but we'll never know now.
ReplyDeletethe ahl for magnum would have been interesting, just to see if the kid has any offense. no one really knows what to expect from this kid.
ReplyDeleteYeah, we could have had another year of Ethanthecaptainmoreau or P.O'Sullivan instead of giving Magnus some Renney-time.
ReplyDeleteThat is indeed an exhaustive list of NHL players with whom the Oilers could have filled that spot. Also, Tom Renney is an exhaustive list of head coaches that can help a hockey player's development.
You're right, Steve. That O'Sullivan & Moreau trade for one of the many Staals was a lost opportunity.
ReplyDeleteThe possibilities boggle the mind.