There are going to be a lot of these over the next few weeks, but I wanted to get out in front of this one. From Bleacher Report (I have no idea how reputable they are) comes this gem: Oilers and Bruins talking a major deal.
- TO BOS: 1st overall pick, Sheldon Souray
- TO EDM: 2nd overall, 15th overall, Blake Wheeler
That's basically Taylor Hall and Sheldon Souray for Tyler Seguin, Dylan McIlrath and Blake Wheeler. I'd do that deal.
Interesting. The 15th is the centerpiece of the deal then. I'd still be pushing for Toronto's 2011 first but this would be adequate.
ReplyDeleteUmmm...
ReplyDeleteYes.
Please let that be a reality.
Let's break it down further:
1. Trade away a player that does not want to be here. Lose $5.4M cap space in the process.
2. Get a sizeable, skilled forward who has scored over 20 goals before and is still young.
3. Give up the 1 OV, which seems loony, but maybe choose the player you really wanted anyway. Is there even a consolation prize between 1 and 2? Who cares! They're both better than any prospect we have atm.
4. Get another top 20 pick in a deep draft. Since 3-17 are dubiously ranked anyway, we could end up with another serious gem in the old tickletrunk, hopefully a D or a G. Hell, that #15 could be packaged with the #31 and another prospect or player to get in the top 10 perhaps.
Did I miss anything?
#1 should read "gain $5.4 cap space"
ReplyDeleteBTW, nice balls on the LP cover
wow...seems like we win that trade.
ReplyDeletedo we take a flyer on kabanov with the 31st if we know we have 2 solids in the bank?
I'd do this in a heartbeat.
ReplyDeleteJust hope Boston doesn't deal that pick to somebody else... or draft the guy the Oilers want.
Bleacherreport isn't very reliable.
ReplyDeleteAnd it doesn't even make sense from a Boston perspective, they get zapped with Souray's contract, lose the 15th overall and Wheeler. All for the gap between Seguin and Hall.
Dare to dream, dare to dream.
ReplyDeleteSince we are dreaming, is there any way to get them to throw in Lucic?
I still like Hall better than Seguin, but word is he would rather play in Boston. Maybe they will start avoiding players who don't want to play in Edmonton.
I don't see why Boston would do that but okay.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't do it just because I'm pro-Hall, but its probably the best deal I've seen so far involving the 1st and 2nd pick, but it has to involve McIlrath being picked at 15, otherwise I'm not sure I'd bother.
ReplyDeleteBleacherreport isn't very reliable.
ReplyDeleteCut him some slack-he's been blooging now for almost a year.
Yeah He's an alright kid, he's in high school but still he reported something he heard on the radio so what can you do.
ReplyDelete...I forgot the bookie thing there...%$#...or some such.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I'd always be warry of just about any rumor that's a slight variation of something some random columnist throws out there as a "I wonder if..." type of scenario in his blog (or was it the Globe?).
ReplyDeleteI might make that deal if it's offered to me, but if I'm a betting man, I'd say this rumor is bunk.
I'd do that deal in a heartbeat but I view Seguin and Hall as pretty much a coin toss.
ReplyDeleteWhile it might seem crazy from Boston's perspective; is there any confirmation on the past Souray interest? I don't think it is far fetched that Boston is willing to pay a surprisingly steep price to get the guy they want and that is likely Hall.
-strong C corps and overall prospect pipeline
-likely feel they are one or two players and some luck away from an Eastern Conference Champion... and probably are.
-Kid who grew up worshiping the best Bruin to lace up skates and that same guy is his agent.
- 4 first round draft picks in the next 2 years.
The Bruins are a team that can afford to make a bold move and take perceived quality over quantity.
I'm thinking about heading to L.A. for the draft as it should be a real interesting affair.
Bleacher Report isn't very reliable or very good usually. One of the hockey writers got busted for plagiarizing Puck Daddy.
ReplyDeleteNot that I'm saying this kid is like that or doing more than reporting a rumor he overheard, but I'm not holding my breath for this trade. A pipe dream for the Oilers and a hugely steep price for the Bruins to pay just to ensure they get Hall.
Has to involve McIlrath? I dunno. I would be okay with this deal, but it would be silly to earmark #15 for a fridge-sized man with 2nd round skills. Remember, there is a lot of play at 3-20 in this draft. I think there are going to be a lot of surprises in the order that players are picked from #3 and on. The Oilers will have their own list, and because of the relative perceived equity after 1-2, they are likely to find a gem undrafted at pick #15...maybe even someone they had sitting on their own top 10. If we get the 15th pick, we should take the BPA as determined by the efforts of the scouting team.
ReplyDeleteLove rumours and tusk
ReplyDeleteI can't see Boston being able to stomach the increased cap-hit. Keep in mind that Hall's entry level contract (as first overall to Boston) is going to cost about 3.75M (Tavares and Stamkos' salary, Kane's is .025 cheaper) whereas Seguin's 2nd overall contract would be 3.4M (averaging Doughty and Hedman)
ReplyDeleteThat's 5.4M for Souray and 3.75 for Hall traded for Wheeler's 2.825 and Seguin's 3.4.
Stronger money should be on Ryder, not Wheeler coming to Edmonton.
I still don't do this deal.
ReplyDeleteThe guy drafted at number 1 is going to have the impact in this league for the next 15-20 years.
Sure, getting rid of Souray's cap hit would be nice, but we could get rid of it anyways in a separate deal. Wheeler isn't anything special, and hardly a long run piece. The 15th overall looked like a nice piece in the Smyth deal - how did that turn out? Mid round picks are gambles.
Colborne + 1st - now at least that would warrant some consideration.
Punjabi:
ReplyDeleteYeah. The first overall pick will be a difference maker but you know something? The second overall pick will be a hell of a player too.
Hall + Horcoff
ReplyDeletefor
Seguin + Bergeron
The Bruins taking on Souray at $5.4 million?
ReplyDeleteThe Bruins already have Wideman coughing up the puck in his own zone for nearly $4M. They don't need Souray.
With $12M to spend, the Bruins can fit in Wheeler coming off an RFA. If some NHL cowboy wants to sign him away, I doubt the Bruins will make sad faces about having yet more draft picks.
Reading dumb-@zz Bruins bloggers whine about Wheeler doesn't mean the front office is anxious to give him away.
I know who posted the article. He lives near Boston and would have heard the rumors from the radio. Good kid ;) Not one to tell tall tales, but really the source of the rumor is the radio stations, as he pointed out in the article (not Bleacher Reports).
ReplyDelete1 for 2, not going to happen plain and simple. 15th, Wheeler and choosing Seguin for Souray, Hall and 'future considerations' much more likely. For the psyche of Edmonton we need to retain number one. The Oilers are the Packers of the NHL and the fanbase is the only reason why there are two teams in Alberta (at least before Katz bought the team) and the first pick is the 'key' to our salvation.
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers take that deal in a heartbeat, imo. Although I'm wondering if it means a lot to them psychologically to actually have the first pick. Could they make a trade that was just Souray for 15th and Wheeler with a guarantee that they take Seguin?
ReplyDeleteWhat if Boston makes this deal and feel Seguin is the player with the most upside and pick him, would we still be looking to draft a defenseman at 15?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteWheeler was drafted by Phoenix, didn't want to play there and even refused to sign and ended up unrestricted and signed by the Bruins. Does he want to come here?
ReplyDeleteI'm all for this deal, (although I've got 2 words for you as far as the 15th pick : JACK CAMPBELL...(McIlrath with 31)), as LT frames it, just don't see Wheeler being here long term...what's his contract status?
Bleacher Report is somewhat reputable but most of the writers are recycled bloggers.
ReplyDeleteBleacher Report is more of a fanzine than a news source. I don't think they have the kinds of contacts in the industry that guys on TSN do. I know because I write for them.
I wouldn't put much heed into it not because of the lack of sources, though.
It's because the guy spelled it "Bleecher Report."
Oilers trade away their right to take the first pick, and they join the California Golden Seals and LA Kings as teams that traded away their right to take the top players possible, for various combinations of magic beans.
ReplyDeleteI hate to say it, but I have a felling thet Souray will traded for Kaberle.
ReplyDeleteIf Souray was traded for Kaberle, I'd be thrilled. But why on earth would such a deal even take place?
ReplyDeleteJust my feeling, but I think you can discount any rumour at this point - I would imagine it's too early in the "process" for them to be talking that seriously about a trade down. If something shows up in the EDM Journal, or BOS papers, maybe it could be interpreted as coming from a source with knowledge of EDM or BOS's position, but a solid rumour at this point?
ReplyDeleteTambellini has mentioned over and over that he wants the scouts to go through the process of creating their list, discussing and deciding between Hall and Seguin. My understanding is that process is still ongoing, and not yet finished. That doesn't mean Tambellini isn't taking and/or making calls, but how specific are any of the calls likely to be at this point?
There's no time pressure yet to get a deal done, or for either side to even come close to their best offer now, if they are even seriously talking trade at this point.
I'd take this trade rumour deal or what Trak proposed in a heartbeat.
ReplyDeleteThere's no way in hades that Boston will make those trades though. Just pure wet dreams on the Oiler's part.
It's a fun fantasy though. If Connolly managed to prove adequately that his hip problems are behind him at the combine and the Oilers decided to swing for the fences, how would everyone feel about Seguin, Connolly, Kabanov. Since we're in fantasy land here imagine all 3 panning out.
Traktor's deal would just be hilarious. A younger, more effective version of Horcoff, at a lower cap hit, I don't see Boston doing that either.
Also Hunter, 2nd, 15th, and Wheeler aren't exactly magic beans. If Connolly is around at 15th, which I don't think he will be, and your staff is satisfied that he's healthy, I'd grab him over McIlrath hands down.
The guy drafted at number 1 is going to have the impact in this league for the next 15-20 years.
ReplyDelete"I'm glad I got drafted first, because no one remembers number two."
--Alexandre Daigle
I wonder who went #2 is his year, anyway?
The 15th overall looked like a nice piece in the Smyth deal - how did that turn out?
Defencemen take a while to develop? The hell you say! Plante's doing just fine, actually: certainly better than Motin, who was supposed to be the superior prospect this time last year.
Yeah, speeds nailed it. The Oil supposedly are to meet in the mountains to discuss who they want at #1. Why would they be putting the finishing touches on a deal at this point?
ReplyDeleteIts a good good deal. But I wouldn't grab McIrath at 15. If you really want him, you could likely trade down to around 20 and still get him.
I don't think Boston would make this deal anyway - unless PJO or Hunter are in charge of their decision making.
I believe McIlrath will be the guy that gets drafted way higher than where he is projected to go. He has a unique skillset- large intimidator who looks like he play more than just a little - and all it takes is one team with multiple firsts (think Phoenix or Atlanta) who identifies that skillset as a major need. I, for one, would not be shocked if he was gone by 15.
ReplyDeleteThat’s not a blockbuster trade, sorry..
ReplyDeletePenner, Hemsky, Souray, and Deslaurier to Boston
for Ryder, Wideman, Tim Thomas and their #2 draft pick.
Doogie2k: I was honestly wondering about who went #2 that year.
ReplyDeleteCFP, of all peoples.
Jeebus.
Olivier: Bingo. I mean, I could've also mentioned Patrik Stefan and the Sedins, but really, when there's a landmark piece of hilarious hubris with that degree of irony attached, you can't pass that up.
ReplyDeletei know i've read somewhere in the past about the Bruins being criticised for NOT trading for immediate help and keeping their young players when they are so close to being a real cup contender.
ReplyDeletei would like to see them trade a few of their kids and picks to get to this goal, so i hope they trade #15....and i hope it's to us!! :)
uni- Connolly's agent was on Stauffer's show yesterday and pronounced him 100% healthy. Said he (the agent) spent 5 days at the combine due to everyone wanting to poke and prod his client.
ReplyDeleteThere is a reasonable chance that Connolly has the best NHL career out of all the players drafted this year.
The Bruins speculation on Stauffer's show was Boston trading #2 and #15 to the Oilers for #1 and #31.
I'd do that deal if I got some type of guarantee that my guy is there at #2.
Woodguy:
ReplyDeleteWhy does BOS make a deal if there's a guarantee in place that they won't take a certain player?
Either the Oilers want the same guy as BOS, or they don't. If they do, then the trade probably doesn't happen as EDM kills the deal without being guaranteed their player. If they don't, then BOS doesn't need to trade up.
I put in the "probably" because it could be that both teams prefer a player, let's say Hall, but BOS rates him much better than Seguin while EDM favors Hall by a much slighter margin, having them nearly equal, and would trade down and take Seguin (or guarantee to take Seguin at #1) if you make it worth their while
That make sense, or am I looking at this incorrectly?
speeds,
ReplyDeleteYou're right.
I don't think Edmonton trades the #1 pick. They want to look and feel like winners. If the CBA will allow a trade along the lines of "we promise not to draft such-and-such a player in return for X," I could see that happening.
ReplyDeleteYeah this will never happen.
ReplyDeleteBasically the Bruins give the Oilers two assets of value in Wheeler and a first rounder and on top of that take on an injury prone veteran with two years left on his pretty large deal.
Not unless Chiarelli is on the crank.
Lowetide - first of all I want to tell you how much I enjoy your insight into hockey and the Oilers more specifically. This is a great blog and it is my first stop each day.
ReplyDeleteOn this topic - I really don't understand why everyone is really so hot and bothered with Wheeler. Personally I don't think he is the type of player that the Oilers need. He shunned the Yotes - what makes anyone think he will want to play in Edmonton? He could turn out to be a cancer in the dressing room. We need someone with heart - we need someone to step up and be a leader. If the Bruins were to offer up Lucic then that would be more appealling ... now realistically will they - not likely. And optically, I don't think the Oilers can trade the first overall pick. The deal really would have to be guaranteeing the Bruins that the Oilers would not pick Hall.
I waiver on which player the Oil should take - but watching the Memorial Cup ... how can they justify not taking Hall? The only way would be one heck of a sweetheart deal (i.e. the 15th and Lucic in exchange for Souray and agreeing to leave Hall on the table).
At least that is my opinion (for what it is worth).
What about offering hemmer and the promise not to take hall for the bruins remaining 3 picks in the first 2 rounds?
ReplyDeleteDone deal. But I'm hoping and praying that Tarasenko drops to 15. Isn't that way too high to draft a defenceman with very very limited offensive prospects?
ReplyDeleteBlack Dog....if i'm Chiarelli, the only way i'm trading #15 is for Tomas Kaberle. better rounded d-man than Souray, not as injury prone, can still score points as well.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteNot unless Chiarelli is on the crank
Based on the contracts he handed out to Thomas and Lucic you cannot discount that possibility.
The guy drafted at number 1 is going to have the impact in this league for the next 15-20 years.
ReplyDeleteEven if the guy drafted at #1 is Seguin?
Do not want Wheeler. Drafted top 5 and couldn't be bothered to sign with the team that went out on a limb to grab him. (17th NA in final rankings)So they pump him, make his head big and then he figures "Screw you guys, I will just sign where I feel like it."
ReplyDeleteHow do we feel about Riley Nash? Well, if he holds on until he can sign somewhere else, I wouldn't think that highly of the kid. And who is to say you aren't getting a high maintenance guy that doesn't want to play here.
If it was Colborne, I would probably be down with it.
@Gerta
Yes, but I think soon the blooger will take a trip up to Red Dear for some ejacashunal training.
@LT
ReplyDeleteThere was a Q&A in the EJ yesterday with Jim Mattheson and something discussed got me thinking.
The article indicated that next year's draft is looking a little bit center-heavy. What expectations could we have of next year's success and how could that affect this year's choice? If we expect to be bottom 5 again, could we bank on getting a good center next draft and pick Hall this year?
Woodguy,
ReplyDeleteI know for a fact that a few weeks before the combine that Connolly did not do well on his Wingate test and his camp was scrambling to get him ready.
I live here in Prince George and you'd never know that we had a homegrown product looking at the 1st round. No one here seems to care which is a real pity, because Brett Connolly is a great kid from a great family.
Dee Dee says..
ReplyDelete"that’s not a blockbuster trade, sorry..
Penner, Hemsky, Souray, and Deslaurier to Boston
for Ryder, Wideman, Tim Thomas and their #2 draft pick."
Now your talking. That's a deal that will position the Oilers for a stacked team 3-4 years from now. If you are going to rebuild get after it and turf every high price player over 27.
Gem indeed.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure the Bruins and the Oilers are discussing major deals; it usually takes weeks to put one together, so the tire-kickig has likely begun.
I can see Tambo "offering" this deal to Chiarelli, but if so, I'm sure Tambo doesn't expect Chiarelli to leap at this offer either. Chiarelli will come back with a low ball offer: maybe something like Hall + Souray + 31st for Seguin + Wideman.
CrazyCoach said...
ReplyDeleteWoodguy,
I know for a fact that a few weeks before the combine that Connolly did not do well on his Wingate test and his camp was scrambling to get him ready.
This is why we should never trust an agent's word with regards to health. This, and one Nikolai Khabibulin.
we should never trust agents period! they are looking after their own asses first despite the claim that their client comes first!
ReplyDeleteRe: old news
ReplyDeleteNot sure if this was in yeserday's thread but Brownlee mentioned in his article that the firing of Chris McCarthy was the decision of Stu "Magnificent Bastard" MacGregor.
I had no problem with Chris McCarthy being let go as some people implied. I just didn't like the way the Oilers went about doing it, i.e. over the phone.
ReplyDeleteLast year they also left two scouts twisting in the wind after their contracts expired, not intimating whether they would resign them or not. One moved on and the other, McCarthy eventually got another contract.
Now I'm sure scouting is a very low permanency job, but good organizations to not leave contract workers in the dark about whether they intend to renew or not. Let them know as soon as possible, so they can make plans for their own futures. I'm happy they at least let McCarthy know well in advance of July 1st this time that he wasn't in their plans moving forward.
uni said...
ReplyDeleteLet them know as soon as possible, so they can make plans for their own futures.
How do you know that this did not happen?
Spoiler, according to the pipeline show guys, last summer 2 scouts had their contracts expire without word from the Oilers. They apparently both were awaiting word on their futures with the Oilers for a few weeks, with one moving on to the USHL and the other waiting till the got a contract.
ReplyDeleteIf you read what I posted, I said at least this time they let McCarthy know well in advance.
Off topic but here's a link of the Top 50 UFA's this summer. I don't neccessarily agree with the rankings but there should be some decent bargains for a few of these guys.
ReplyDeletehttp://nhl.fanhouse.com/2010/06/02/nhl-free-agents-ranking-the-top-50/?ncid=txtlnkusspor00000002
Good day.
ReplyDeleteHmmm...
There's too much simple debunking logic in here for me to believe you thought this rumour had any teeth, Lain. Methinks you've been itching to use that image ever since you found it.
L8r
Louise
uni said...
ReplyDeleteSpoiler, according to the pipeline show guys, last summer 2 scouts had their contracts expire without word from the Oilers. They apparently both were awaiting word on their futures with the Oilers for a few weeks, with one moving on to the USHL and the other waiting till the got a contract.
I assure you, uni, that I completely understood what you wrote.
That however does not mean they weren't notified at the earliest possible time. It could be that at the expiration of the contracts that the team was unsure which direction they were going to go. The primary responsibility of management here is to the Oilers not their scouts.
We also have no idea of the relationship between the scouts and management and if there were any work-related issues there.
Sorry, there just isn't enough evidence for a kangaroo court.
IceDragoon,
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure you're right.
Whenever I've read "I wanted to get out in front of this one" from LT before, it usually means "head'em off at the pass".
Darren Dreger reports: "Bruins gm Peter Chiarelli says he talked to Oilers gm Steve Tambellini about flipping draft picks."
ReplyDeleteChiarelli also says he talked to Oilers general manager Steve Tambellini on Wednesday about the potential of flipping picks. Chiarelli adds they will talk again soon. -TSN
ReplyDelete"Darren Dreger reports: "Bruins gm Peter Chiarelli says he talked to Oilers gm Steve Tambellini about flipping draft picks."
ReplyDeleteWoo Hoo. I remember reading something Tambellini said the other day about how he and Chiarelli met up and were laughing about how everyone expects them to be talking a deal, with the strong inference that neither of them were all that worried about making one.
I suppose this was the big news Mister Dreger was "reporting" on - some publicly available anecdotal evidence that taken on face value strongly suggests there will be no deal, at least at this time, if ever.
What are we looking at in terms of Wheeler's '11 pact?
ReplyDeleteQualComp doesn't hate him and he brings some size.
awful for boston, a top 6 forward, and the 15th pick for an overrated, overpaid d, and the ability to move up ONE spot
ReplyDeleterumours.... ok why are we even engaged to solve the centre issue right now.. we have the #1 pick... ive seen alot of taylor hall, he has enjoyed so much success at such a young age it would be absurd to see the oilers stray away from picking him... so what he a left winger.. he is a good left winger.. next years draft has a kid named matt puempel who plays for peterborough and was the OHL rookie of the year this year.. he is centre.. this kid is ranked top 5 next year... so not sure why not draft the left winger who is seemingly destined for stardom... theres a centre in florida named NATHAN HORTON who wants out and is a proven 30 goal scorer, who plays such a great game of hockey... why trade for a pick who may not ever be? so seguin is compared to yzerman? what was bonnsignore compared to? steve kelly? the list goes on.. taylor hall has performed at the world juniors and has won 2 memorial cups, all by the age of 18! its absurd to think we wouldnt draft this kid cause we need a centre... nathan horton is wanting out of florida... what would us to get him in an oilers uniform? probably much less then to aquire spezza or bostons #2.. pick hall! its best fort he oilers!
ReplyDelete