When our first choice came, one player available was Laurie Boschman. He'd played with Brandon, centering a line with Brian Propp and Ray Allison on the wings. Even though Boschman was the center, I said "Propp got all the goals. I think we should go with the goal scorers." But the scouts said Boschman did all the work and was the smart one on the line. I'd been in that situation in Buffalo once, picking a kid named Claude Deziel who had scored a lot in junior on a line centered by Pierre Larouche. Later, Deziel never played in the NHL. Larouche did, and scored plenty. So when the Leafs scouts told me Boschman was the guy who made their line work, I had to think of Larouche.
"Can he skate?" I asked.
"Good skater," they said.
So that's how Boschman was taken and when you figure Propp got 34 goals for Philadelphia and Boschman got 16 for the the Leafs maybe we were wrong in the choice.
-Punch Imlach, Heaven and Hell in the NHL
Scouts don't get to write history, and those who do (the General Managers and coaches) make a horrible mess. A few things about the quote above:
- That item above is lifted directly, save for a small punctuation change to make more sense of the first two sentences.
- "Claude Deziel" didn't get drafted in 1974 by Buffalo, but Michel Deziel did get picked 47th overall. Pierre Larouche went 8th, three slots before Buffalo picked the first time. Imlach was just making stuff up, Larouche was never available to the Sabres.
- He did get one thing right: the Leafs blew it. Boschman was taken 9th overall, in front of Propp, Mark Messier, Glenn Anderson, Michel Goulet, Neal Broten, John Ogrodnick, Thomas Steen, Mats Naslund, Guy Carbonneau and a bunch of others who had better careers.
Is there a lesson here for scouts? Sure. Get it right, or become famous enough to write your own book. Chances are the Steve Tambellini version of the story will see the light of day before Stu (Magnificent Bastard) MacGregor is asked the question.
Boschman was a lot rougher player though, and did have a pretty good career, including time here. i always wished we'd have been able to keep him.
ReplyDeletewow! looking at the stats from the Wheat Kings from '78/'79, Propp's numbers blew Ray Allison and Laurie Boschman's numbers out of the water!! Propp had 94 goals and 100 assists compared to Boschman's 66 goals and 83 assists. Propp should have gone much sooner.
ReplyDeleteDug: I agree, tough it was standard at the time to let smaller guys fall (Propp was 5''9)
ReplyDeletethat's true, flamingpavelbure, it may be a reason why Jordan Weal may fall further in this years draft than he should given his talent.
ReplyDeleteDug, the reality of the NHL is that runts fall in the draft because they rarely make it.
ReplyDeleteDug: I'd take him with an after 25 pick for sure. Even 20.
ReplyDeleteBadseed: Same thing for PPG top 20 guys who tend to blow a lot.
That's just wrong. A lot of guys make it. And usually the guys who come out of nowhere are them, because theyr were ignored by size.
Minnesota drafts per size, and they suck ass.
Claude Deziel. Let's draft him. It just sounds so cool.
ReplyDeleteEspn released its mock draft 4.0 today.
ReplyDelete"#1 Edmonton Oilers
Taylor Hall, LW, Windsor (OHL)
This is where Hall was in my last mock draft, too. The Oilers let a couple of top members of the scouting staff go over the past few weeks. Let's presume that, if there were disagreements in what to do in the draft, it started with Edmonton's second pick."
Matheson floating the Spezza idea. Giving up Gagner seems like terrible idea though.
Jim Matheson: Would Spezza be a good fit for the Oilers?
Here's hoping John Wooden makes it through the weekend and on to 100.
ReplyDeleteLook! A whale!
ReplyDeleteWow, that Spezza trade suggestion is god-awful.
ReplyDeleteBut hey, if they want to take Horcoff off our hands, maybe something could be worked out.
So which member of the management team's autobiography begins with "Call me Ishmael"?
ReplyDeleteSo which member of the management team's autobiography begins with "Call me Ishmael"?
ReplyDeleteTambellini promised to do things right. No effing whales. Especially a softer-than-butter whale with a bad back who loves drop passes to the opposition.
ReplyDeleteSpezza is a horrible hockey player. He will never measure up to that contract.
The nightmare summers never end.
The Oilers finally have a chance to start over and do things right. Don't eff it up with an effing whale.
Oh yea, you've got two Mats Naslunds in there, LT.
ReplyDeleteTambellini promised to do things right. No effing whales. Especially a softer-than-butter whale with a bad back who loves drop passes to the opposition.
ReplyDeleteSpezza is a horrible hockey player. He will never measure up to that contract.
Both I, and math, vehemently disagree with those sentiments.
Jason Spezza is an elite centre that simply puts up strong results, and is just about to enter the prime of his career. You get a guy like him, along with Hall, and you have a pretty long window of opportunity to win that Stanley cup.
Dustin Penner. Love that guy, and he too puts up results. That being said, it was only 1 season he has outperformed his contract. His value may be at it's peak. With Hall and MPS likely to get at-bats, the trade market is where you address needs.
If I'm Tambellini, I'm definitely throwing out Penner + Cogliano + 48th overall out there. Maybe a bit more if necessary to land a quality guy like Spezza.
I forgot to add the #11 pick from mock draft 4.0 today:
ReplyDelete"Dylan McIlrath, D, Moose Jaw (WHL)
The last time Dallas spent a first pick on D was 2006, Ivan Vishnevskiy, and the Stars dealt him this year. Derek Forbort and Jonathon Merrill might look good here but Dallas doesn't draft out of the USDT and the Stars love McIlrath's toughness."
No one has run to the defense of Horcoff in the thread?
ReplyDelete"Rick said...
Wow, that Spezza trade suggestion is god-awful.
But hey, if they want to take Horcoff off our hands, maybe something could be worked out."
Shocking.
I actually like Spezza as a hockey player. But man Spezza and Horcoff is way too much money tied up down the middle and its not exactly Crosby Malkin either.
ReplyDeleteoh god...there's a whale on the market after words "total rebuild" have passed thru Tambo's lips at least once in every interview since April...
ReplyDeleteIf rumours of possible interest from the Oilers start coming out from credible sources to the point where you pretty much know they're interested and Spezza admits he wants out and then decides remains a Senator it might be enough to make we weep.
That being said, I think he's pretty talented and there's no reason to think he can't replicate past perfomance in a new situation.
"No one has run to the defense of Horcoff in the thread?"
ReplyDeleteWoodguy is out with a wonky finger.
With the salary cap you put Spezza and Horcoff together for an overpriced maddeningly underachieving second rate center ice core.
ReplyDeleteWoodguy is out with a wonky finger.
ReplyDeleteBroken due to hanging off of jocks right?
Spezza outscored the vaunt this year (3/14 QC scoring) with weakish teammates (10/14 QT scoring).
He brings about twice as much offense on the PP than Horcoff, but doesn't kill penalties.
Both their contracts run out in 2015, and Spezza costs 1.5M more than Horcoff.
If the Oilers can get a good penalty killing C, then I'd probably do Spezza for Horcoff + Cogliano + something that wasn't drafted in the 1st round.
If you want Spezza, then you take Hall 1 OV (obv).
I don't do Horcoff + Penner, that's just wrong. The Horpensky line was consistently one of the top 10 (often top 5) outscoring lines in hockey. If they could get a coach to play them together....
Spezpensky > Horpensky
I don't have Horcoff and Spezza on the same team.
ReplyDeleteThat's too much money tied up in centers who don't bring everything.
Horcoff doesn't bring the PP scoring, and his 5v5 scoring has dropped (history tells us he will rebound, but by how much is anyone's guess with a wonky shoulder and 1 year older)
Spezza doesn't bring PK, and was actually a negative RelCorsi, but given his RelCor QC was 3/14 and RelCor QT was 13/14 its somewhat forgivable.
i suspect if they can convince him to come here, the Oilers will indeed try to get Spezza, and i would have no problem giving them the players they wanted last year for Heatley.
ReplyDeleteOnly the Oilers could promise a full scale sensible rebuild, then bend over backwards to try to get a first class second class center like Spezza to basically destroy any hope of the team managing it's salary cap 1-2 years down the road.
ReplyDeleteAmazing.
Was 5'9" all that small back then?
ReplyDeleteI don't think Propp was that under-sized for that era.
Aside from Spezza being softer than me thinking about Rita McNeil eating a hotdog, why would anyone think that he would be a good fit here?
ReplyDeleteHe doesn't like being a scapegoat and how he was treated by fans in Ottawa. How will it be any better here?
When you're the $7 million man, part of your job is to carry that burden.
Plus, taking on a $7 million contract that lasts another four or five years is not exactly the right way to do in the middle of a rebuild. You develop your own $7 million player.
i would have no problem giving them the players they wanted last year for Heatley.
ReplyDeleteThere needs to be some sort of exchange of salary (Matheson's numbers notwithstanding) getting big unproductive off the Oilers and taking big unproductive off them. I like the idea of Horcoff in exchange for Spezza throwing in Penner or Cogliano as a sweetener to make it go down for OTT. But I can't lose another favored defenseman in Smid. Everytime I pull for a guy, he gets up and traded!
Spezza is just speculation peeps. You can't say "only the Oilers" unless a trade actually happens. There are some scenarios where acquiring Spezza makes sense but not from Ottawa's perspective. Lets hope there is nothing to this.
ReplyDeleteFrom a Jay Onrait tweet:
ReplyDeletePierre McGuire:"If Paajarvi doesn't play for Edmonton next year it's a crime. If I was a season ticket holder I would boycott."
Hunter: Spezza is over PPG for career and is +73. Not exactly that ''2nd class'' center.
ReplyDeleteI bet he beats a lot of guys you consider 1st class centers.
Jason Spezza is a good hockey player, if they offer something like:
Spezza+Regin for Horcoff+Penner+Cogliano I do it.
Ottawa Gets:
ReplyDeleteSouray + Cogliano + Nash
Edmonton Gets:
Spezza
Reasons Edmonton makes this deal:
Nash doesn't fit into the plans here long term.
Souray wants out and doesn't fit the new cluster.
Cogliano has some upside but is likely more valuable as a trading chip.
Reasons Ottawa makes this deal:
Volchenkov is gone, and they need a guy who can play some tough minutes
Nash could be a #1 centre if everyhting breaks right, and his value is low so is a good value pick up
They like Cogliano.
Spezza's contract will limit who could take him, and they would want him out west if possible.
The deals tie up a lot of money for the Oilers, but it makes our team a whole lot better now. It also doesn't cost the Oilers anything they want to keep, while getting the Spezza contract off the books
Discuss.
Jordan: I like it, i like anything that gets value out of Souray.
ReplyDeleteSpezza and Penner together! Think of the hijinks!
ReplyDeleteAccording to the Detroit Free Press, winger Tomas Holmstrom has agreed to a two-year, $3.75 million deal with the Red Wings
ReplyDeleteMan..That sounds crazy cheap. I guess he's kind of old?
He's extremely old, good for 60 games a season at best, and not a particularly strong player. He's basically Bertuzzi, but he cares more and doesn't occasionally break people's necks.
ReplyDeleteCan't see this trade happening for a lot of reasons:
ReplyDelete- Tambellini is not going to reprise the Heatley deal last summer and go "big whale" hunting after he's said we're not. He'd lose what's left of his credibility w/the paying public.
- It opens up another hole on a back end with big holes already. It then forces us to go deeper into free agency to fill the rest. That makes the re-build even more complicated.
- Substitute Souray for Smid and Ottawa says no - Souray can't play the toughs anymore - it shows in all the numbers.
Have to wonder if Matheson is floating this as a means to test market sentiment. Can certainly see the Ottawa media doing it too as a reprise. But I can't see us tying that much money up at center when we're a long way from being competitive. Even if Hall/Seguin, MPS/Eberle pan out this team is several years from competing. Why push the rebuild back further?
I would like to see the Oilers trade the 1st overall pick for Spezza - only because I want to see people's heads explode - so please keep your webcams recording just in case it happens. Please leave a note for your next of kin and/or roomates to post the video online with links on LTs blog..
ReplyDeleteThe #1 pick for Heatley is a far better deal.
ReplyDeleteThe #1 pick for Heatley is a far better deal.
ReplyDeleteYou forgot your sarcasm sign (I hope that was sarcasm)!
well, i really don't want to see Gagner go to Ottawa in a deal for Spezza if we can help it, unless the Oilers have deceided to pick Seguin, then you would have Seguin/Spezza as you top 2 centers. not bad! i suspect they might want Gagner and Penner, but the Oilers are probably offering Horcoff.
ReplyDeleteOilerdago said:
ReplyDeleteSubstitute Souray for Smid and Ottawa says no - Souray can't play the toughs anymore - it shows in all the numbers.
Souray lead Oilers dmen in QC (#1 Corsi QC, #1 relCorsi QC, #3 +/-QC) while playing with 2nd tier help and posted the best relCorsi on the team. His 950 PDO was the worst in the league for Dmen who played 30+ games.
Bottom line, when Souray is moved, his value will be at an all-time low on his boxcars, but his PDO and QC/QT/Corsi numbers suggest that if healthy, he's still got some good rubber on the tires.
I sure hope he's not traded just for the sake of trading him. He carries value, and if not now, then definitely at the deadline.
flamingpavelbure:
ReplyDeleteWayne Gretzky
Mark Messier
Joe Sakic
Steve Yzerman
Joe Modano
Igor Larianov
Alex Delvecchio
Jean Beliveau
Stan Mikita
Sidney Crosby...and many more if only there was a gun to my head.
These are examples of what I consider to be first class elite centres.
Compared to the likes of these, Spezza is more in the Shawn Horcoff division.
Too bad Gretzky isn't available.
ReplyDeleteI think Joe Modano is a UFA, heh.
ReplyDeletequain - I think I'm just comparing to the Oilers salaries too much. Oy.
ReplyDeleteHopefully it occurs to the Oil that it's generally not a great idea to trade for a guy who gets boo'd a lot by his home fans.
ReplyDeleteSometimes it's just fans being a little nutty like us with Poti years ago, but more often than not there's fire with that smoke.
Forget Spezza.
You shouldn't have to have any reservations about a guy on your team with a $7 million cap hit.
I agree that Spezz'a value is over-inflated.. I'd credit some, much of that to having played (albeit, not just coasting but) on a spectacular line w Alffie (Best o the bunch imo) and heatly...
ReplyDeleteIf hemsky can pump up horcs humbers, alfie and heatly definitely did not hurt spezza's.. what did?!.. breaking up that all-star line, leaving him to carry more of the load himself..
Penner has a better contract and almost equal (if not better) value than spezza.. I may be overvaluing penner, but I dont sig value spezza..
If management thinks spezza is the solution when we draft hall, then I want them to draft sequin...
Also, Gagner is no junky spare part to be thrown around to 'sweeten' the pot.. If anything like this happens then yes, another ridiculous summer of tamb..
ReplyDeleteSometimes it's just fans being a little nutty like us with Poti years ago, but more often than not there's fire with that smoke.
In my opinion, in Edmonoton, there is often no fire, just smoke - for an 'informed' hockey city, the fans tend to act like a bunch of morons....Shooooooooot!
In fairness Gretzky is available but I think he will be 51 this year
ReplyDeleteStaples has a great post up giving more insight into what Sean "The Wiz" Draper is up to.
ReplyDelete@ randforlife:
ReplyDeleteI hear you on Corsi and will grant you that on a team as bad as the Oilers, they're good. But their are a lot of other numbers that will make him very tough to move without taking a bad contract back:
- boxcars
- age
- contract (term/price)
- injury history
You have to look at all the numbers and put the statistics into context with Souray. Just looking at the # of seasons he's played a full schedule in the last 5 years does not help his cause.
I like him a lot and the fact that he was willing to come to Edmonton when few others would consider means something.
But a GM will more than likely try and rid himself of a problem contract in order to then take him on and big whale hunting is a huge mistake for this organization with where it is right now.
Some of the Boston deals make more sense and I would not be surprised if a deal is done there - but not until closer to the draft as right now it's all posturing.
The Boschman-Propp denate raged somewhat back in the day as the Leafs had clearly drafted the wrong guy. Propp fell in the draft sheerly on size--he didn't fall much but even back then size could nick you a few spots. If he hadn't been 190 lbs, he might've fallen a little farther. It might do the same to Granlund this year.
ReplyDeleteAs for the Spezza trade proposal, who would their 1st line centre be then. Matty never addresses that issue in his analysis. Only way they do this is if they're heading into rebuild mode, which they might do with Alfie aging away, or if they can get an unhappy 1st C back. Spezza's size means little when he plays like a goal scoring Joe Thornton.
Propp was rated as the #5 prospect in the Hockey News draft issue among 1959 born players. Boschman was rated #3 among underagers.
ReplyDeleteThey were both top flight prospects.
LT, I remembered Boschman being highly touted too, and back before Al Gore, we had little access to Jr A scoring totals, game reports and such. I imagine that's why THN was such a wonderful source to you back in the day.
ReplyDelete...So even the scouts "saw it wrong". But it became pretty clear, pretty fast that Boschman was not going to be the player Propp was. He was however a legit NHLer and I enjoyed his time here. I remember being excited by the trade and hoped he was a late bloomer. After all, he wore my number.
Last night in bed, attempting the impossibility that is sleep, and wondering how in the hell we were going to dump Souray for value, I also wondered if WAS will pull a Sutter and offer OTT a middling pick for the right to talk to Volchenkov.
ReplyDeleteWill Souray have more value on July 1, or later in the summer after teams have lost out on the UFA competition?
From the Draper article:
ReplyDeleteDraper thinks this tool could be even more valuable assisting with player development. Say a player such as Jordan Eberle was in Oklahoma City for a time next season. He could have access to his own page, where the Oilers could assemble a video of his every shift. Coaches in both Edmonton and Oklahoma City could type in their comments about aspects of Eberle's game they want him to work on. Eberle himself could add in his own comments and monitor his own improvement. “It helps players see where the coaches want them to be working,” Draper says.
The Oilers video coach Myles Fee already does this with players at the NHL level, but this would extend the practice to players in the Oilers system, Draper says.
“It would really ingrain that sense that you're a member of the Oilers family and these are the people responsible for helping you progress in that family.”
I like that, hope they move quickly and have it going this year.
Also from the article:
Oilers players will also be able to study other players on other teams more easily, both to learn their weaknesses and also to study their strengths.
“You could take, for example, all of Milan Lucic's shifts and give them J.F. Jacques and say, this is sort of what we envision for you. See how he attacks the net.”
HA! I'm sure that's all JFJ is missing. (bookie!)
Please don't re-sign JFJ.
whale hunting is bad.
ReplyDeleteHeatley was whale hunting. thank goodness that didn't materialize.
whale trading is not so bad.
picking up Spezza is fine, so long as a big contract is going back the other way. either Horcoff or Souray. preferably Souray.
moving Cogliano is fine too, as his skill set is redundant here.
i could get behind Souray + Cogliano for Spezza, or *possibly* Horcoff + Cogliano for Spezza. either deal sends a "whale" contract back the other way. and i don't consider that to be whale hunting but whale trading.
you certainly don't move Hemsky or Penner in that kind of trade. nor any prospects. certainly no contract under 5 million dollars.
another idea is a three way trade where Oilers move Souray and Cogliano to Ottawa for Spezza, then turn around and move Spezza for some defense.
"If they were to deal Smid, who is 225 pounds and aggressive and will be a solid NHLer for the next 10 years, then that opens up another hole.
ReplyDeleteA. Why do we want to open up another hole?
B. Why would you want to deal an aggressive 225 lb. defenceman who will be a solid NHLer for ten years?
Sometimes I can't believe how stupid I must be, asking questions like these.
Not seeing how trading for an unhappy Heatley and offloading Penner's contract was whale hunting, but trading for an unhappy Spezza and offloading Souray's contract is whale trading.
ReplyDeleteIsn't it exactly the same?
Ladislav Smid, the solid NHLer who couldn't defend a backdoor play if it happened to him eighteen games in a row (which we know, because it did.)
ReplyDeleteI think the difference between moving Souray for Spezza and Penner for Heatley is easy. Souray is old, dead money (regardless of his usefulness, he's not going to be a helpful piece in a Stanley run) and Penner is relatively young and cheap (and was at the absolute basement of his value last year.)
Heatley was old and there were legitimate concerns about the length of his contract; Spezza is young and we'd essentially be getting his entire prime with very few low productivity out-years.
I don't think Spezza is a legitimate $7MM center (he's essentially Vinny Lecavalier) and I would rather just play the kid hand we're dealt rather than acquire a possible anchor.
With that said, I don't think Spezza can be an anchor. People have seen him good enough to put value in what he can do. If you can make a fairly painless deal to acquire him you do it, feed him cherry minutes and, if he fits, you keep him otherwise you flip him. I'd happily grab him for peanuts and give him a wink, wink deal that we'll boost his value and move him to a team more to his liking, if he's hesitant to play here.
Actually, slight apologies to Spezza, he seems to be a much stronger PP player than Lecavalier so he's essentially the cheaper, less shitty version of everyone's favorite Montreal rumor bait.
ReplyDeleteAnother sort of side not but I haven't heard anyone mention Jeff Skinner. He reminds me of Eberle and screams MBS type pick. Ranked 9th to 34th in NA and I could see the Oilers liking him. Anyone seen him play? If he somehow hits 31, I'd snag him.
ReplyDeleteNo one really commented on what I was saying in the other thread about the B's and Oil doing a huge deal. I take it you think it is absurd basically. But the more I think about it the more it could honestly make sense.
ReplyDeleteWheeler (~3.25 mil per 3 years or subsequently dealt)
Ryder (4 mil UFA next year)
Wideman (3.9 mil UFA 12-13)
Pick swap we get Seguin
For
Souray (5.4 mil UFA 12-13)
Hemsky (4.1 mil UFA 12-13)
Penner (4.25 mil UFA 12-13)
B's top 3 picks this year and next year and toronto's first next year.
We may have to take on some additional salary as well but we could to make this work (as Hall's ELC would kill the bruins cap space). It's too bad we already have one overage goalie contract as if Thomas could be moved over to us this would likely work...Maybe we eat Lucic's contract and send something back like that expires sooner...not sure.
The bruins have Torontos 1st and 2nd this year anyways so really it would only be a one year hit on their drafting pool for a solid two years of contention for the cup. A worthwhile gamble no one would argue with. On our end it's not pretty but we'd have cash to work with and a ton of picks.
2 1st this year
3 2nds (I think)
3 3rds (I think)
11-12
3 1sts (supposedly weaker draft)
2 2nds
3 3rds (calgary's)
This year we could use a 1st 2nd and 3rd and offer an rfa 4.5 mil to 6 mil...or up to 4.5 mil for a 1st and 3rd.
Guys like Ladd and Pavelski would be who I was looking at here.
Next year the RFA pool is a lot sweeter so I may hold out and just draft up this summer with an eye to shedding bodies at the deadline and dropping some bombs come free agent time.
Weber, Doughty, Carter, Stamkos, Parise, Seabrook...etc are all RFA's.
Ryder comes off the books next year and is replaced by Seguin who I leave for another year. We suck this year and hopefully end up with a lotto pick again. Aside from Horcoff and Bulin we are more or less clear of tough contracts after next year as well and can really start with a fresh canvas. Loaded with cash and draft picks to do what we please with. It's a year of real pain but the potential turn around and longevity seems worth the risk here.
If you went to the B's with some type of proposal that really opens their window here to win it all I could see them jumping at it.
What do we really lose?
Two years of great cap friendly deals that I'd bet anything will not extend prior to UFA so we would likely be sending them off 11-12 anyway for way less return.
If we are truly around the corner come 12-13 which I think this deal could put us if proper subsequent moves are made we could likely have the cash to offer Penner or Hemsky a UFA deal and they might actually consider coming back. WIth Boston having all those Toronto picks this is a rare opportunity, imo.
chartleys
Whoever they start the 2010-11 season with, they will be guaranteed the best drugs that the Rexall Corporation can provide.
ReplyDeleteI for one can applaud this.
Sorry, but Spezza is only 2 years younger than Heatley and his contract is a year longer.
ReplyDeleteNot a big difference.
The Heatley thing looks crazy now because we continued to pursue it after he said no and because Penner lit it up for stretches this year.
The same things could easily happen with pursuing a Spezza deal (while he couldn't technically block the deal without a NTC, he could just as easily say he didn't want to come and demand a trade).
I'd sooner have Penner firing on all cylinders like Phil Esposito 2.0 than Spezza with his Horcoffian cap hit.
ReplyDeleteNo one really commented on what I was saying in the other thread about the B's and Oil doing a huge deal. I take it you think it is absurd basically. But the more I think about it the more it could honestly make sense.
ReplyDeleteIt's the internet man, if you want people to read something/pay attention, you have to keep it under 30 words in length.
Punch Imlach is far from a reliable historian and it's hard to attach much credibility to his story - but had the Leafs waited on Boschman rather than giving up after a couple of years (he was a year younger than Propp) they might have had a decent player on their hands. The Rangers must've been kicking themselves, though. They took Doug Sulliman with the #13 pick. Or, even worse, Winnipeg drafting Jimmy Mann and leaving Michel Goulet to Quebec.
ReplyDeleteAs for Spezza, I don't know why the Oilers would have any interest in him at all. All Spezza brings is a few more years of mediocrity and mid level draft picks.
Lowe thinks he's Slats 2.0, but what he fails to understand is Sather had a stacked team to add the never ending replacements that always seemed to make the team stronger.
ReplyDeleteWhen factoring for a winning hockey team from 30th place, only the fool imagines there's any other way but a lot of hard work and no more wasting talented prospects.
Next time the make the playoffs, I hope they hire MacTavish as an assistant specialist.
ReplyDeleteThe pasting they handed San Jose in 2006 after dropping the first two games was the best hockey since 1990.
re Spezza and any other forward - Who's the top defence prospect Lowe can grab for the Oilers, the dude Mister Lowe is actually very astute and Oilers should I expect to have a decent blueline come next October, November, December, January March.
ReplyDeleteI'll pick Brazil to win the World Cup 2010.
Tambellini knows it'll be a hard slog back. Lowe's days of chasing whales has likely come to pass. (At least for a couple of seasons)
ReplyDelete"Not seeing how trading for an unhappy Heatley and offloading Penner's contract was whale hunting, but trading for an unhappy Spezza and offloading Souray's contract is whale trading.
ReplyDeleteIsn't it exactly the same?"
no, the situation isn't nearly the same.
firstly, you don't offload Smid, who is important to a team as strapped for defense as the oilers.
secondly, Souray is *not* Penner. even in Penner's 'bad' years under MacT, his corsi was good and he was still just entering his prime. Souray is exactly the opposite.
lastly, Spezza is a center and fills a positional need for the oilers, especially if they draft Hall. he's 3 years younger than Heatley too, and fits into the rebuild better.
even if you swap Spezza for Horcoff instead of for Souray, i still think it is worth it. Spezza is a full five years younger than Horcoff and puts up more points.
with Horcoff, he protects the prospects for a couple years and then what? with Spezza at least he could still be a productive player even after the prospects have developed.
i don't understand how you can say trading for Spezza isn't "rebuilding", when he's still a relatively young guy and you could possibly offload contracts like Horcoff's and Souray's.
.. and there's something to be said for making a trade just for the sake of making a trade at this point.
ReplyDeletethe more turnover in the dressing room, the quicker the team's culture can change.
even if a trade is essentially "even" in terms of value/cap space, i think you make it. if only to clear the air before the prospects start arriving.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteFlyers ahead 1-0.
ReplyDeleteI'll pick Brazil to win the World Cup 2010.
ReplyDeleteNow HERE is a topic that's worth discussing.
I'm going with the Netherlands to bag the thing, but there's about a half-dozen other teams I could see winning it (Brazil, Argentina, England, Spain, Portugal, Germany - forget France and Italy, both squads are aging).
I'll pick Brazil to win the World Cup 2010.
ReplyDeleteDoes Brazil even have a hockey team? Why is there a world cup in the same year as the Winter Olympics?
England!?
ReplyDeletebwahahahahahahahaha
hunter: Like a blind squirrel finding a nut, one of these years England are going to figure it out.
ReplyDelete(Then again, I've said the same thing in the past, substituting the words "the Sharks" or "the Senators" for "England", and it still hasn't happened....)