The first in the series on Oilers players in 09-10 is below and I encourage you to read it and add your thoughts. However, there is a HUGE story breaking this morning about Sheldon Souray. He takes a big stick and beats management about the face and hands here.
Wow.
And forever and ever, there was a ban on the number 44 in Edmonton.
ReplyDeleteThank you Sheldon. At least now people can stop making mock lineups without his name in it.
ReplyDeleteWow. Just wow. If heads don't roll in management this summer, we're not done sinking yet. The optics of this organization must change and that can only happen if there is a housecleaning.
ReplyDeleteThis is good news.
ReplyDelete1. We get to move Souray.
2. Maybe more people will realize the problem is management, creating more demand to sack the GM and LoweM.
BOOM!
ReplyDeleteTruth to power!
ReplyDeleteWow some money comments on the sportsnet page where this story is... Like
ReplyDelete"I have always said that he is one of the players that has to be traded. I also believe that he is one of the players that caused problems for Craig MacTavish and was a major distraction in the dressing room for the rest of the team splitting them down the middle with a veterans versus young players attitude. "
And gems like
" I had hoped for a return of something like a 7th round pick but hey... I'll settle for 8th! LOL! Seriously, WOW!"
Oh and how about
"Maybe you (sheldon) should go sign in the KHL. They love to overpay washed up hacks such as yourself,"
There are also some good comments about the absurd state of the Oil managment. Rightly so. This is all on them.
Ha!
ReplyDeleteI believe most of what he says.
I particularly like this quote:
"But it’s not about me — it wouldn’t matter who it happened to. You’d think someone would want to check on the asset, wouldn’t you?
I'm sure that's Souray throwing it back at Vish and Milquetoast for their constant referral to players as "assets" in the media. It may be insulting to some.
I don't believe this quote though:
"People will question me, that they overpaid me … that it was a bad decision to sign me. But I can tell you this: I turned down more money in other places."
I call bullshit on that. I think Dennis has a quote from when he signed saying that the Oilers were offering the most $$$.
I think this whole situation will have minimal impact on the Oilers.
1) They already seemed to be trading Souray. With his pronouncements before the deadline that he's waving his no-trade to anywhere except Canadian teams, his desire to get traded was already "common knowlege"
2) The management and ownership is completely blind to their incompetence, and another player throwing them under the bus won't change anything. After all, Souray doesn't have 6 RINGS!, count em, 6!
3) Given the state of the Oiler's roster, they shouldn't be big game hunting, they said they aren't big game hunting, so... aside from Jagr, no big game hunting.
My only concern is if they are trying to sign someone like Seidenburg to a 2 year contract. Would he take a slightly lower offer to go to a different team due to something like this?
I don't know.
Will the Edmonton MSM now do an in depth piece about the competence of management? Not a chance.
It interesting that a blogger with access to the players was the one to break this story.
Yes I group Spector as a blogger. His blog is on a main stream sports site, but his words don't get printed in ink anymore.
Brownlee is a blogger too. If Brownlee has access to the team, so should Coachpb with his blog, which is infinitely better than the blog that Brownlee writes for.
Kristopher,
ReplyDeleteLowe and Tamb tend to troll on sportsnet.ca a lot.
"Lowe and Tamb tend to troll on sportsnet.ca a lot"
ReplyDeleteYeah, obviously.
Souray comes across as a prime-donna.
ReplyDeleteEven if he has legitimate points, there are ways to go about doing this. Exclusive interviews is not one of those ways.
Good riddance.
He specifically mentions the fans, the city and the trainers as being great. No issues. This is purely a shot at management. Good on him.
ReplyDeleteHe has been nothing but stand up and classy in his media dealings in Edmonton up to this point. He is the first to accept responsibility for poor play and seems to not air any dirty laundry in the press. I just hope this doesn't turn into a Souray bashing. He is speaking the truth about management.
Even the timing of it strikes me as being classy. He waits for the end of the season so the guys in the room don't have to deal with it.
I don't buy the "turned down more money" thing though. I believe he had a quote about money and term being far and above any other offer out there.
This is significant only because it is a major leader on the team saying the things publicly we have speculated for a while now (lack of communication, players playing through big injuries, inaction, etc).
ReplyDeleteWhat struck me was the tone of indifference towards the players that the GM gave off to Souray. If I was a media type, I would be looking for some 'unnamed sources' to back it up with their impressions of the management.
There should be some interesting rebuttals coming down from our betters today.
The response from management should be fantastic. Obviously he was going to be shopped again this summer but Souray wants to make sure he doesn't end up back here by default. I guess we can eliminate Souray's name from the "who's going to be the next Oiler's Captain" debate.....
ReplyDeleteI for one think this is terrible. Souray for all his faults, plays a game on the blue that we need: big shot from the point on the PP (specially now that the Slovak is gone), is physical in the corners and in front of the net, and has more defensive awareness then he is general given credit for.
ReplyDeleteI don't think we will get much for him, hopefully an expiring contract.
This sucks. Damn you Lowe. I might have to moth ball that number 4 jersey I have.
Souray comes across as a prime-donna.
ReplyDeleteEven if he has legitimate points, there are ways to go about doing this. Exclusive interviews is not one of those ways.
Why do you say this(I am curious not wanting to start an argument)? To me it makes less sense that he does it press-release style to a whole bunch of reporters in front of his team. Can you pick a better way for him to express his frustration, other than shutting up and taking it from the guys he's most frustrated with?
I like what he said about players and fans, and that he targeted his displeasure so there is no grey areas on why he wants out. The unfortunate part is that his trade value has sunk (if possible) even lower.
Dany Heatley and Chris Pronger aren't even fit to warm Sheldon Souray's watermelons. What a fucking saint! There's no comparison at all! You know, because we hate those other guys!
ReplyDeleteSOURAY!
Souray would have been traded at the deadline if not for his own selfishness in fighting Iginla.
ReplyDeleteHe is not completely blameless in his own plight.
Souray comes across as a prime-donna.
ReplyDeleteEven if he has legitimate points, there are ways to go about doing this. Exclusive interviews is not one of those ways.
Good riddance.
As a group, the "Oilogosphere" can be guilty of group think from time to time. Let's not get ganged up on Souray here.
His issue is with management. The same management that has lead this team to DFL.
His issue is with how the org. handles injuries. Don't just take his word, look at Hemsky, Stoll, Staios, Smid (played games after concussed and then left long term). He is telling the truth.
He has been nothing but stand up and classy in his media dealings in Edmonton up to this point [...] I don't buy the "turned down more money" thing though. I believe he had a quote about money and term being far and above any other offer out there.
ReplyDeleteUnless that original comment was part of that "being classy" that you talked about, as in, hey ... Edmonton's great they offered me some dough come sign here.
I'm not going to put words in the guy's mouth, but it's possible that part of why he's calling management out is because he likes his teammates and he doesn't want to see anyone else pushed to return when not ready.
ReplyDeleteHe's got one foot out the door anyways, so why not say the things that his teammates can't?
Like Souray or not, he raises some disturbing points here. And it says a lot about the nature of management. Even if you factor out the bitterness, it doesn't make management look good. I hope that Katz is paying attention and doesn't simply accept the rationale presented by KLowe and Tambi as the truth. It isn't the first time that issues with management have come to light. Where there is smoke, there is fire. And as the organization begins rebuilding, management is another area where they need to look and deal with the culture there as well.
ReplyDelete@Schitzo:
ReplyDeleteSeems like it to me, but I don't want to be biased by preconceptions. They speak with euphemisms in regular hockey interviews and you never really know what's up until something like this comes along.
Is Souray lying or is he telling the truth? It confirms what a lot of us were thinking but it is true that some of the problems he spoke of were caused by some of his own decisions too.
Two-way street perhaps? Maybe it's not management or Souray ... maybe it's both.
If the Oilers are going to tank next year, why not keep Souray around? If he's going to publicly bash the organization like that, maybe he deserves a little more time in purgatory. Make him earn his way out of the town through solid play that will net the oilers a half decent trade.
ReplyDeleteHow can you be mad at Souray for this, or call him selfish? This is the best thing he could have done for us. He's calling out the management publicly, something no one else was willing to do. I have no doubt that he's right about them, and it's about time that somebody said something.
ReplyDeleteNotice that he waited until after the last game of the season, so that his teammates wouldn't have to take the heat from the media.
All class. We owe Souray big time. Even if nothing changes, somebody finally spoke the truth.
I can understand Souray's frustration with Kevin Lowe not checking in with him, but Tambellini? Come on, everyone knows Tambelinni isn't allowed to make outgoing calls.
ReplyDeleteSo Souray had a "six month shoulder injury" when he got to town that still needed another month to heal? How is it that he played 81 games for the Canadiens, a well run organization that wouldn't force players to play injured, but shows up here obviously injured from the prior season and it's the Oilers who are the bad guys 'cause they expected the same from him?
ReplyDeleteActually, I applaud Souray for his move. People have always said he showed leadership. He did here again as well. Although you may argue with some comments, they appear to be fact based. I can't wait to hear Tambi try and refute that he didn't talk with Souray since January.
ReplyDeleteHe is standing up for his team mates. And, in fact, he is talking about things that will, hopefully, make this organization better in the future.
Good for him.
We owe Souray? For what? Waiting three years to bring it up? Sitting quietly at the deadline, hoping to get out of dodge then? Or bringing it up, immediately after essentially refusing to come back?
ReplyDeleteYeah, that's leadership. "It sucks in there guys, you go ahead without me."
I'm as happy as the next guy that management got shit on, but I'm just as happy that Sheldon Souray is going to take his overpriced contract and spend his IR time somewhere else.
//How can you be mad at Souray for this, or call him selfish?//
ReplyDeleteWhen you have had a trade request in for over a year (Spector article last year at this time?), and then go and fight Iginla before the deadline, when you have a history of wrist injuries in fights, that is selfishness.
Wow. I wonder if katz will review the management this off season? Does this mean OTC becomes OTGM sooner then we think? Does that scare anyone else?
ReplyDeleteRegardless of whether you think Souray should have done it this way, it speaks to problems inv the organization. Players do not go to places with problem management. Detroit may win a bunch, but the culture of team they created is the main reason people go. The Org cares (or seems to). Let's be honest, Souray came for the money. If he had been healthy he would have been gone at the deadline. I think a lot of this comes from the fact that the Oil wanted to move him, and he was pissed about it. He handled it like a professional when it happened, saying all the right things, but now he is pissed because he feels likle they don't want him. He will fetch us .50 cents on the dollar, but there is more cap room coming! Best news for the Oilers is that the Rangers missed the playoffs, meaning they may be more willing to get Souray then ever.
So Souray had a "six month shoulder injury" when he got to town that still needed another month to heal? How is it that he played 81 games for the Canadiens
ReplyDeleteMay, June, July, August, Spetember.....
So Souray had a "six month shoulder injury" when he got to town that still needed another month to heal?
ReplyDeleteHabs lost in Round 1 that year. If he got hurt in the playoffs, that would give him
May, June, July, August, September
to heal. Being forced into play in October lines up exactly with "one month too soon".
A pox on your house, Oilman.
ReplyDelete(Your house will be infested with Lowes and Tambellinis)
Quain,
ReplyDeleteFair enough, I suppose. But couldn't it be that he was willing to forgive management, to try to work things through month after month, but eventually things got bad enough he just had enough?
It seems you're setting an awfully high standard for guys who come out against their team. Suppose Horcoff comes out and blasts Moreau's leadership this summer. Would you say the same?
The only thing I'm disappointed about is that Souray didn't give it to Oilers management even harder. You don't need locker-room access to know that the franchise has been a laughingstock for close to two decades.
ReplyDeleteLosing Souray is nothing. No one fucked him around other than the fact the team stunk, he got paid for three seasons and played exactly one of them, and now that I'm back from a fast holiday who's won the Taylor Hall lottery?
ReplyDeleteHaving said that, Souray's a hella cool dude, and a great Oiler, even if everything went wrong.
Kris:
ReplyDeleteMy judgment of this would be 100% different if it wasn't prefaced with, "I want a trade." If Horcoff gave an interview where he grenaded Moreau and Quinn and demanded a trade, I'd be angry, because Horcoff is supposed to lead not get paid richly to finally do so when he has decided to cut bait and run.
Leadership to me doesn't involve saying, "It sucks here, I'll buy these guys a mint julip when they pass through my next team's town." It's saying, "It sucks here, but these are my guys and I'm going to be here until they run me out."
I don't blame Souray for wanting out and I don't blame him for hating management, but I'm not terribly impressed with him like some seem to be. He's not a saint, he's a guy who wants to play for a team that doesn't suck and decided to wrap it up in a rant against management.
Do you think that there is team-wide consensus about the management and that souray was chosen to speak up or if this is just souray acting on his own?
ReplyDeleteWe can debate the merits and accuracy of Sheldon Souray's comments all day. I for one am shocked and saddened to see him gone before the fall. Say what you will about the injuries and ineffectiveness, but off the ice he's one of the most recognizable and revered Oilers in the community. He's the perfect combination of brawn, humbleness and honesty.
ReplyDeleteWhat this story does, like a good forest fire after the first storms of spring, is allow us an opportunity to raze the organization from within and give us a chance to honestly reflect on where we go from here.
The person this most benefits is Daryl Katz; unable to see the forest for the trees, he's allowed a childhood idol to continue clinging on to the organization's teat far past his expiry date. Katz needs to step back and assess the situation with the business acumen we know he has: if a senior manager in his company had held positions of varying importance despite not turning a profit in a decade, would that employee still be there?
One could make the argument that Lowe, for all his managerial failings, was good enough to allow the team to act as a money-printing factory. But even that most basest of requirements is now failing- see the constant manipulation of ticket sales data before the team finally had to admit their home sell-out streak had been snapped. The Oilers have been bad before, sure, but this is a whole new level of bad to a new generation of fans; they have and will continue to retreat with their pocketbooks, and at that point perhaps Katz will understand this is a business, too, and not an Edmonton Oilers Time Machine.
Please, Katz, do the right thing. At the very least, if you don't, you won't be remembered in this town for being a billionaire, for owning the biggest house ever built in Edmonton, for being a philanthropist on a scale we've never seen: you'll be the only owner in Oilers history to buy the club at profitable stage only to drive them into the red.
The thing that bugs me is that he's not calling out the management for being bad management. He's being pissy about their dealings with him personally
ReplyDeleteFor the lack of communication - Moreau was saying about a week ago how candid and open management was with him. But another player who makes a public trade request, then goes and gets his hand injured in a petty fight before the trade deadline doesn't hear back from them since around that time... hmmmm, anyone care to venture a guess why? Even his tone reminds me of Jay Cutler forcing his way out of Denver last year - "I texted him and he wouldn't even text me back!" GASP!
And for the 'playing through injuries' - He didn't say they made him play through injuries, he said they pressured him to come back early. Lets make this a hypothetical situation. You sign a contract with a new company for 5+ million dollars a year for 5 years, but you tell them you can't start until you recover from something - anything. You find me ONE boss on the planet Earth who WON'T be breathing down your neck about when exactly that will be.
No, I don't buy it. If he said the management was mistreating it's players (plural), making bad trades, signing bad contracts, severing ties, thats cool, they've been doing all of that. I'd understand. But this is him pissing and moaning about how they treated him.
@Oilman
ReplyDeleteThe only mention of an injury to Souray in 2006 (season prior to his signing in Edmonton and when he played 81 games) is during pre-season...in late September.
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/sports/story.html?id=c765b866-dca1-4bc0-9bf1-63901bd7f2da&k=43108
Surprise, surprise, it's a shoulder injury that two different doctors said was only a "bruise":
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/columnists/story.html?id=fa65eaa0-1e5a-4413-8fa4-01135974df64
So, Souray played the entire '06-'07 season with a bum shoulder and yet calls out the Oilers for having him play on that same bum shoulder AFTER 5 months off?? Really??
I call BS on Souray because he had no problem playing through the pain in his contract year and then phoning it in once he got his money.
Later, Souray, you Douche!
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletebut but Steve didn't call me. :(
ReplyDeleteBest case scenario is Souray and the management both get turfed.
But Souray is a baby
Souray was one of the only UFA's to sign here and was supposed to be an example to attract more.
ReplyDeleteImagine having a job where you crapped the bed for 4 straight years and you can continue to live off the glory of 1 good year and a very successful past in an unrelated position.
Then you hire your own personal goat boy to take all of the blame.
I don't know who is at the reins of the team be it Lowe or Tambo but one of those guys, or both, have to take responsibility for the season.
A pox on your house, Oilman.
ReplyDelete(Your house will be infested with Lowes and Tambellinis)
I can see them now, repeatedly bouncing off my kitchen window trying to get outside.
In the name of Stan Weir, I am totally embarrassed to be a fan of this trainwreck of a team. Jeez.
ReplyDeleteSo all you coneheads want to shoot the messenger!! Well fire away. I'm just glad that somebody had the nads to call out this joke of a management (oxymoron) team. He knew he wasn't coming back anyway. He just dedicated 3 years of his life to this organization and they repaid him and the fans with worse finishes every year. I imagine Lowe filled him full of bullshit about how much they were going to turn this organization around... yada, yada, yada. The same kind of bullshit he used when he said the cap would create a level playing field. Get these jerkoffs out of here and get a major league management team. After 20 years don't you think it's about time??
ReplyDeleteTampa ties a can to Lawton and Tocchet. What are the odds Edmonton will invoke a similar concept of accountability?
ReplyDeletePlease limit your guesses to reality-based speculation!
If this was an isolated incident then we'd be way less certain that this is a major problem.
ReplyDeleteThe Edmonton Oilers aren't a model franchise. The Edmonton Oilers management group are not a group that heavily values their relationship with players.
This is what it was like in the 1950's, which is fine. Except players have options.
Where there's smoke there's fire.
From CBC:
ReplyDelete"Our hockey operations department needs a fresh start in order to help us fulfil our goal of being a world-class organization," Lightning chairman Jeff Vinik said in a statement Monday.
Alas, while Katz continues to suffer from Stockholm Syndrome, we are unlikely to hear anything of this sort from Edmonton.
He just dedicated 3 years of his life to this organization and they repaid him and the fans with worse finishes every year.
ReplyDeleteAnd the team only repaid him with $18MM for 144 games worth of work. I'm a little unwilling to lump his plight and the plight of Oiler fans together.
Man, and all Tocchet did was turn Stamkos into a Hart winner. I'm stunned that he got canned.
ReplyDeleteYou're right LT. It appears Lowe's management style seems to be one half 1980's Glen Sather and one half 1980's Peter Pocklington. Players have changed and he doesn't grasp the concept. And that sleazeball LaForge is popping his head up from under Lowe's desk every few minutes telling him he's still the man. Right now it seems we'd be better off with one of Katz phamacists running the show.
ReplyDeleteWow, Souray went public with his yearly hissy fit this time. I really expected more from him. Management didn't talk to me? Boo freaking hoo. Why would they? What's the point?
ReplyDeleteI hope Lowe and Tambellini can pour enough sugar on his corn flakes every morning this summer so that he sticks with the team next season. I like the defence lineup with him in it.
Wishful thinking, whatever. I blame Moreau...And MacT...and umm..Hemsky. Bah.
Souray doesn't come across very well in this article, and some of that is the blogger's hatred for the Oilers organization.
ReplyDeleteStill, calling out management won't bring too many other teams calling for his services. For a guy who claims he has nothing against the fans, he sure knows how to hurt them.
Some people get a little too wrapped up in their Lowe man-hate. Souray asked for a trade, then foolishly injured himself, then foolishly expected Tambo to babysit him while he was in recovery (cripes, that's what his agent is for!), then was clearly shocked that no one wanted a one-dimensional, oft-injured, over-paid defenseman who was not expected to recover before the end of the season (thanks Spector for that one). But rather than sucking up his ego like Moreau did, Souray comes out swinging and points the finger everywhere but in the mirror.
I was suckered into thinking he was captain material. No way. Give it to Whitney, and ship Sheldon to Florida.
LT - Your point is the most valid. All this petty squabbling over Souray's character is useless. This crap within the locker room and org has been going on for 10 years now and it's about bloody time to clean that house.
ReplyDeleteAnd for the record, if I were in ANY management or coaching position, I'd be talking to all my players constantly. It's a pre-req for me. To ignore your players, hurt or not, miniscule or not, independent or not, is lunacy.
And for the record, if I were in ANY management or coaching position, I'd be talking to all my players constantly. It's a pre-req for me. To ignore your players, hurt or not, miniscule or not, independent or not, is lunacy.
ReplyDeleteCoaching position, yes. Management...it strikes me that GMs may want to keep some distance from their players to better allow them to play the heavy when contract time comes around.
Management...it strikes me that GMs may want to keep some distance from their players to better allow them to play the heavy when contract time comes around.
ReplyDeleteExcept "Management" is more than one person. Shouldn't there be someone keeping the lines of communication open with players out of the lineup, so that the organization doesn't, you know, get blind-sided with newspaper reports that a player is being charged with impared driving, for example.
What I truly do not understand is that a lack of success has consequences everywhere except with Oiler management. In the last 10 years they have had mediocre teams (or worse) every year except 06 and even then they make the playoffs on the last weekend . So Lowe who cannot even spell the words "salary cap" signs a mediocre team to the Cap. He gives out some of the worse contracts ($ and term) in NHL history and gets promoted. He signs "Tambi" (patent pending) who, no doubt, will be done his assessment of the talent on the Oiler squad by 2014. Course in his own right he signs the worse free agent goalie contract of the last 5 years. "Tambi" should be ready to make some trades in 2014/15.
ReplyDeleteWorse team in the NHL. Worse team in the AHL. A plethora of undersized forwards with duplicative skill sets and few people developing in the organization.
That, above, would get you FIRED in any world save the Oiler world.
Oh yeah can the taxpayers of the Edmonton area also give me a $500 million arena for FREE!!!!!
Honestly, I think Pronger did it more professionally.
ReplyDeletewelcome to rock bottom.
ReplyDeleteeven allowing for a bit of Souray prima donna-ness, it doesn't get much lower than this.
But, what can you expect when the owner is more preoccupied with building his own personal Disneyland, the GM is more preoccupied with OTHER rosters (Olympics, etc.) and the team President's relevance and connection to reality is receding faster than his hairline?
Dear Oilers Management: success is something you can conjure with a vintage jersey and few sticks of incense. Get over past glories and wake up!
Dan Tencer must be working overtime. It will be interesting to see what kind of spin the org throws on this.
ReplyDeleteWorse team in the NHL. Worse team in the AHL.
ReplyDeleteIts WORST with a 'T'
Oh yeah can the taxpayers of the Edmonton area also give me a $500 million arena for FREE!!!!!
I don't remember such a request being made.
I have a hard time reading the situation beyond what LT said - "Where's theres smoke there's fire".
ReplyDeleteMy best guess is that the team management has a 'do or die' type exptectation from their players and that some (Moreau, Horcoff, others) buy into it, while others (Souray, Cogs?, Penner?) do not. Is this the 'rift'?
This is a very difficult team to read. I kind of hope that the whole thing blows up publically just so we get a better understanding of it all. Whatever it is, it has been a big part of the problem for a while.
Before injuries hit the Oilers, both the big team were doing just fine and so were the Falcons. Call up half of your minor league team and of course both teams are going to suck.
ReplyDeleteI'm not laying the blame for another failed season on injuries alone, but extreme bad luck has to play a part in all of this.
That said, Tambo's leash has to be awfully short, if he's not already being held by the scruff of his neck. If that isn't the case then Katz obviously has more patience (or money to burn) than most human beings.
The other John:
ReplyDeleteKahbbi is the worst ufa goalie contract of the last 5 years?
Cristobal Huet resents that.
johnnyshaka: Souray's shoulder was known (and acknowledged after the fact) to be hanging by a thread during his last season with the Habs. Their docs advised that he not play, but it was his contract year so he rolled the dice. The shoulder made it through the year, his numbers were great and he knew some chump of an org would pony up. Maybe he just expected that that his new team, whoever it was, would rather have him miss a month than immediately risk serious injury. Surprise.
ReplyDeleteJohnnyshaka:
ReplyDeleteYeah, 500+ mangames lost is going to affect both teams, indisputably. And some of that was just awful luck.
But ~1/5th of those mangames lost were between two players, both signed to UFA contracts that were definite overpays, in terms of $ and length. Especially bad is the fact that both those players had significant injury histories prior to signing with the Oilers. Neither of them should have been signed to those contracts in the first place, and now the less-awful one wants out.
It makes me sad that some of you guys are actually mad at Souray. It's freaking obvious this management group is a massive quagmire, and finally someone in the know expresses it, and HE is the problem?
ReplyDeleteTalk about Stockholm Syndrome...
...What Bugg said...
ReplyDeleteIt's dark here at rock bottom. Time to burn the forest and let the blueberries come back.
Woe Leaf Uck.
It makes me sad that some of you guys are actually mad at Souray. It's freaking obvious this management group is a massive quagmire, and finally someone in the know expresses it, and HE is the problem?
ReplyDeleteHe's not the problem, but he is a problem. Taking pot shots at your boss in public, especially when you're looking for what amounts to a favour from that boss (in this case, a trade), is extremely unprofessional.
As it happens, if this is the catalyst for some housecleaning then it might actually be a net good thing that he did it, from a fan perspective. But it's still extremely unprofessional.
(Oh, and jesse r: fair point.)
Bookie
ReplyDeleteYou are correct. The Oiler' and Falcon's are the worst team in each of their respective leagues.
Katz is asking for the COE to build him an arena and hand over control to Rexall Sports. The number bandied about was $400 m but with normal construction overruns it will be $500 million
Hey .......I meant to ask how is that 6000 seat arena at the U of A coming along that Katz was going to build :-))
Lastly do not use the phrase "do or die" and Ethan Moreau in the same sentence..... he "does" so very little
Regarding his shoulder injury, a few people have pointed out that he re-injured it in a fight, so I'm not too sympathetic regarding that. He also screwed himself and the team with the fight against Iginla this season where he broke his hand. If management was down on him after that, I can't really blame them.
ReplyDeleteThat said, as others have noted, if this was only one guy, I'd just say "sour grapes" and write him off. But he's not the only one to say stuff like this, publicly or privately. Even if he is acting in his own self-interest, it coincides with a lot that's been said over the past few years and it doesn't reflect well on the management group. If they want to give Souray the boot, that's fine by me, but there are a lot of other people who should be following him right out the door, including a guy with 6 Stanley Cup rings and a former player for the Colorado Rockies.
The lack of communication from management sort of echoes what others have said.
ReplyDeleteJan Hedja waiting for Edmonton to get back to him and eventually signing in Columbus. Glencross repeatedly trying to get in touch with management not just through his agents but personally and never hearing back before moving on to Calgary.
Management seems to focus on a few players and just ignore the rest. I'm not saying every Tom, Dick, and Harry need to be hand held every second of the day, but in a multi-million dollar organization you'd think they'd treat all their 'assets' a bit better. You never know when one will unexpectedly appreciate in value and some extra goodwill never hurt.
Yeah, I can't fathom complaining about Souray here. Even Quain is off the deep end - someone (with a vanishing hairline, six Stanley Cup rings, and a former Olympic skier as his spouse) gave Souray that contract in the first place. You should be happy we finally saw a return on the deal.
ReplyDeleteAt the end of the day, it'll look this:
Souray's $18MM UFA contract
vs.
A prospect/draft pick plus a scathing rebuke of inept Oiler management that was years overdue.
Now that doesn't sound so bad does it?
This is not huge news in my mind.
ReplyDeleteSouray has played one full season as an Oiler. This isn't going to effect the Oilers next year. Lets face it their was a line drawn in the dressing room. Vets and the young guys.
Souray was one of the guys Tambi wanted to move. Tambi is going to take beating for not sweet talking a guy he wants to move.
Maybe Tambi should be better with the players, but IMO he probably wants to move Souray so why keep up the PR with him.
Mark Spector is trying to make this out as huge story like the Pronger story. The only difference is the Oilers wanted to keep Pronger. It's not the same for Souray.
RQ:
ReplyDeleteIn fairness, I'll be glad to see him gone and I'm not upset he's lobbing bombs over the wall as he goes. I just think people are being a little quick to praise a guy who is throwing a hissy... so my complaint is more meta than anything.
I'm just not sure I'm comfortable with the idea that, essentially, Chris Pronger could've called Kevin Lowe a douchebag on the way out and we all would've been a lot happier. It seems like the bar should be higher here -- maybe you only get praised if you blast management and pistol whip Lowe.
Then again, Souray is basically a poison pill to me after all these years, so maybe I'm just projecting.
Yeah Souray cradling his broken body parts staring at the phone hoping Steve calls...
ReplyDeleteNothing to make fun of there.
I'm focussing mostly on the communication issues surrounding this organization. I'm truly shocked at some of the stuff I'm hearing about and this is the icing on the cake. Over at C&B they've interviewed some guys who almost apologize for management not reaching out to them. Was it David Rohlfs that said he hadn't heard from the organziation in a year?
ReplyDeleteI operate some pharmacies and manage 150 or so people but when you get to that kind of a number, managing isn't really what you do. You hire good people to manage the day-in-and-day-out stuff but I do spend a ton of time "taking the pulse" of my employees. Little things like having lunch in the employee lunch room, remembering birthdays and kids names allow to connect in some small way. They don't expect the world but they do expect you to acknowledge their hard work, and even just their existance. My employees are my business and Tambellini should realize his players are everything.
There's only 50 signed players and a few dozen prospects and I'd have a person on staff who was responsible for telling me when something great or not so great happened to each and every one of them. When Hartikainen dragged his team to the 2nd round there'd be a text saying "great series Teemu, keep it up!" When Shelly ended up in the hospital, at the very least a phone call should have been made seeing how things were going. Same with Khabi's DUI.
Forget evaluating the drafts and trades. I'm not qualified to say those have been fuck ups but I am qualified to say this management team does not get HR and that's a huge part of any organization.
This place is rotten.
He's not the problem, but he is a problem. Taking pot shots at your boss in public, especially when you're looking for what amounts to a favour from that boss (in this case, a trade), is extremely unprofessional.
ReplyDeleteI guess the question you have to start asking yourself at some point is 'why does Edmonton seem to attract so many problems?
If you can find a satisfactory answer that doesn't trace back to management then I applaud your imagination.
If you can find a satisfactory answer that doesn't trace back to management then I applaud your imagination.
ReplyDeleteObviously the problem's management: we've known that for months. That doesn't make Souray's behaviour appropriate or professional.
Hmmm...
ReplyDeleteNature sure does abhor a vacuum, don't She?
There's lots of speculation above about what's happening behind the scenes, based on our various worldviews and our individual biases toward the organaization, but at the end of the day, that's all we're pretty much left with--our speculations.
Hockey players come in all sorts of personalities and characters, surprisingly reflecting much of the diversity represented by the rest of humanity. Personally, I like Souray, and find his quotes refreshing and usually playing notes of humble accountability.
This is the first time with the Oilers that we've seen Souray point the finger at someone other than himself.
But it seems to me he did the same with the Habs org. when he wasn't offered a contract extension. Something along the lines of "I played hurt for them, got injured for them, gave my all and they decided not to come to the table and negotiate or even acknowledge my sacrifice for the team".
I wonder if the same thing is happening here. The poor fellow might have some abandonment issues. Or maybe he thinks of himself as a star and expects to be treated as such (--see how pernicious vacuums can be).
Whether this is blatant mis-management by the Oil is a different story. Again, IIRC, Souray had a similar complaint at the end of his Montreal tenure. There are plenty of stories out there about players gripes with management. And considering the Oil have been trying to trade him for much of this time, is this really anything different than SOP?
Sure where there's smoke, there's fire. But is the org burning in this particular circumstance, or the player?
Probably a little of both.
But I still like the guy for speaking his mind in this P.C. world of so-called "professionalism", pre-approved questioning, and celebrity media statements written by professional PR people.
And damn, looks like we're headed for another off-season with the Oil burning up the teletype wire. Never a boring day down at the Old Firehouse...
@GF and Pete
ReplyDeleteHas it not been a long standing rule that we, the Oilers, have to overpay to sign ANY free agent to play here?
Johnnyshaka:
ReplyDeleteYeah, that certainly seems so. Might that be because of a dysfunctional organization? Maybe, maybe not.
Regardless, why do it? It hasn't helped anything. And overpaying for damaged goods really, really hasn't helped anything, and I think speaks to my initial point: that the Oilers' injury woes this season can only partially be attributed to bad luck. If you're overpaying anyway, why add in an element of high risk?
@Pete
ReplyDeleteI guess gambling on high risk FAs is something you have to do when your options are limited to begin with.
We can all speculate and suggest who they should sign but the reality might be that they only get one return call for every ten they initiate. Whether that's because of the "situation" of the team, management, or the location, who really knows?
It's pretty easy to say Khabby's deal was awful after he goes down but he hasn't missed significant time due to injury in 10 years. What if he had played 55+ games this season and won 30 of them...would it have been worth it? And Souray, what if he doesn't get tangled up with Iggy and plays 75 games with 50 points...would it have been worth it?
It's all a crapshoot...this year we won with Penner and lost with just about everybody else...is that ALL on management?
@JohnnyShaka
ReplyDeleteDid you just say that he hasn't missed time in the last 10 years?
Read this
http://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=3163#more-3163
and this
http://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=3282#comments
then post again.
It's not all on management, no. Few things are that simple, and as much as I think the management's terrible I'm unwilling to place 100% of the blame on them, for anything.
ReplyDeleteBut the team's got progressively worse for four seasons, to the point that they're now worst in the league. Along the way, there's been a constant run of bad contracts, questionable signings, valuable players let walk, rumours of a divided room, lousy trades (and a few winners, i admit), chronic injuries, bizarrely poor seasons by individual players, and so on.
That's not all on management. But if not, it's getting to be a very large series of coincidences, no? A run of bad luck that's getting a bit statistically improbable?
Also, re: Khabibulin - a lot of people were saying his deal was awful before it went down, and he was injured quite a bit in Chicago (though not to this degree). It's not like nobody saw this coming, but apparently management didn't.
holy shit.
ReplyDelete("But you talk about Prongs (Chris Pronger) and guys like that, and it should raise an eyebrow when players who leave town are skipping out with a smile on their face.")
"You’d think someone would want to check on the asset, wouldn’t you?"
ReplyDeleteWell I guess the criticisms of asset management (nash) management were well founded...
Sail on Sheldon.
ReplyDeleteMaybe Tambellini would have called Souray if he thought he could get 5 assets for him.
ReplyDelete5!
Also,
Jason Strudwick is the Oiler's nomination for the Masterton trophy.
Thanks for coming out Fernando.
Maybe they don't want to nominate the same guy two years in row, even though he battled back in both years.
I'm not sure why Strudwick would qualify for the Masterton, maybe because he managed to play NHL hockey for yet another season even though he can't skate.
Where there's smoke there's fire.
ReplyDeleteI'd love to agree with you LT, but this isn't smoke. We've been seeing smoke for years. This is a man running up to you covered in soot in singged clothing and coughing like a 75 year old chain smoker saying, "Oh my god there is a fire in there you have to do something!"
The question is: Does Katz call the fire department, or does he listen to the morons who started it and let the whole thing burn?
Forget evaluating the drafts and trades. I'm not qualified to say those have been fuck ups but I am qualified to say this management team does not get HR and that's a huge part of any organization.
This place is rotten.
And to think that some people wonder why Edmonton doesn't smell so good sometimes...
Obviously the problem's management: we've known that for months. That doesn't make Souray's behaviour appropriate or professional.
Yeah, you know what, we have. But most Oiler fans don't. THey don't look for the little signs that we have been discussing here for several years now, and they are there to beleive whatever they are told.
I'm glad he said something. It needed to get out there beyond the realm of bloggers and dedicated fans into the realm of paying public and random Joes.
Souray was the best person to do so. He's got a lot of support from random fans, and all of the casuals I know like what he brings. I think they will receive this message better as a result, and that there will be likely be a bigger effect as a result.
As far as professional or appropriate... I have all the respect in the world for a whistleblower. The only thing innapropriate is that he did not say something sooner.
There's something to be said for playing as much as Strudwick did at his age and with his talent. The pick is certainly light years better than Henrik Sedin for Masterson.
ReplyDeleteI'd have picked Fernie as he's a far better choice, but Strudwick seems like a good #2 to me. It's not his fault that the team keeps employing him and then jamming him into a long-term top four role, and the trophy has nothing to do with on-ice accomplishment.
@Matt
ReplyDeleteI said he had not missed "significant" time in 10 seasons. He's been nicked up just like anybody else but still managed to appear in at least half of his team's games in every season.
Was his contract a good one...no, probably not...but what were the other options? And again, what if he doesn't get hurt this season and wins 30 games...then what does the deal look like?
As far as professional or appropriate... I have all the respect in the world for a whistleblower. The only thing innapropriate is that he did not say something sooner.
ReplyDeleteOilers management is not very good, but this does not rise to the level of something requiring whisteblowing. Whistleblowing (that is, airing your company's dirty laundry in public) generally deals with illegal or grossly unethical behaviour, or incompetence that's seriously detrimental to the public interest.
Souray's saying (accurately) that the Oilers aren't very well managed. That's not quite the same thing. And, of course, after that he expects the Oilers to do him what amounts to a favour by trying to trade him to somewhere he'd rather play.
I still like Souray more than I like Lowe or Tambellini, but this is not a story with a good guy and a bad guy.
And again, what if he doesn't get hurt this season and wins 30 games...then what does the deal look like?
ReplyDeleteAlmost as good as Craig Andersons (38 wins), who we could have signed for...you know..A LOT less.
Okay it's all guesswork because our crappy MSM guys don't give us the scoop.
ReplyDeleteBut...
I still don't get the backlash against Souray. If any of what he says is true about management asking him to play injured and not keeping in touch with him while injured, he's absolutely right to criticize the organization. Both behaviors are unprofessional.
He waited until after the season to make all of this known. That's professional.
There were rumors he was unhappy last offseason, presumably for all of the same reasons. (The MSM never followed up on this) It sounds like he decided to give management another chance. This again is very professional. It sounds like they kept doing the same thing and he decided to call them on it.
Now, it might be a bit selfish to ask for a trade after calling out management as being unprofessional dicks. Granted. But that's a pretty understandable self-ishness. If I decided my company was run by dicks, I'd tell them and give them a chance to change, if they didn't change, I'd go public with my criticisms. Obviously, at that point, they'd want me gone and I'd want to be gone. It's all mutual.
So, I guess I don't see how Souray's behavior should be criticized as selfish. I'm sure he knew -and everyone in the league knew- he was for sale. I certainly don't see any reason to think he withheld his criticism for selfish reasons and is now airing his criticism for selfish reasons. That's all possible, but even if it's true, it's pretty weak tea as far as critique of Souray. So what if he's doing this for selfish reasons. If he's not out and out lying, he was mistreated as a player. That's bad management.
At any rate, it seems to me that there's a "shoot the messenger" or "snitches get stitches" ethic motivating some of the backlash against Souray. I've never understood this anti-snitch ethic.
Almost as good as Craig Andersons (38 wins), who we could have signed for...you know..A LOT less
ReplyDeleteExactly my point...it's a crapshoot.
Was his contract a good one...no, probably not...but what were the other options?
ReplyDeleteThat contract was the worst UFA signing last summer.
There were 18 guys with .900+ Save PCT looking for contracts.
Going in,
the guy who looked the best was Anderson.
All his numbers were pointing the right direction.
I dont know if Souray is just frustrated with the way the season has gone and the last 3 years or the fact that he will not get to choose the team he is traded to. I choose the latter.
ReplyDeleteEither way - the Oilers are in some way like the place where most players want to play - all about the special effects (locker room and Edmonton promotional videos) but unfortunately there is not much to the script.
All I can say is that i'm glad this story didn't get published July 1
ReplyDeleteThe Oilers would now have Rob Blake on the books,
4 years $3.95 million per
Exactly my point...it's a crapshoot.
ReplyDeleteI'm hoping this is sarcasm.
I don't have any respect for what Souray has done insofar as it might be described as "whistle-blowing".
ReplyDeleteHe's not blowing the whistle on any illegal or unethical behaviour. He's complaining publicly about feeling that he was treated poorly or unfairly. While some might be sympathetic towards him as a result, I can't help but feel that it simply is what it is: complaining.
What would I characterize as a more fair way for him to go about his business?
1) Ask for a trade, quietly. Doing so publicly hurts the team, the organization, and ultimately the fans by reducing your trade value.
2) If you still feel the need to air your grievances, do so after your have been traded by answering the questions from members of the public or media that will certainly follow.
3) Answer questions truthfully and frankly, but don't sensationalize. Your message will be delivered either way, and you will likely have more support from the public as a result. You certainly will have fewer individuals such as myself criticizing your methods.
In the end the way Souray did things doesn't really help anyone. Not him, not the team, not the fans. We all just end up looking like dicks. Thanks for the memories, Sheldon.
Souray you trailer park queen.
ReplyDeleteYou can't stay healthy for shit, play a piss-poor game then complain? WTF! (And it's not like he didn't go after the injuries, he took them in fights...)
I guess Brownlee just put up an article at ON that says pretty much the same thing as I just posted. Just noting so that it's clear I didn't merely rip him off.
ReplyDeleteWe all just end up looking like dicks.
ReplyDeleteWe looked like dicks long before Souray said anything.
Besides JK, you told me the potential trade the Oil had lined up for Souray - can you honestly say this incident has 'lowered' his trade value? His trade value was basically nothing!! His cap space is worth more than his trade value.
No, Ribs, it wasn't sarcasm.
ReplyDeleteIf everybody was so sure that Anderson was going to win 38 games then why did he sign for so little for what was a last place team? Why didn't a contender looking for a top goalie throw the bank at him like Philly or Washington?
Souray needs to call Khabby and see how you're suppose to live when you're on longterm IR.
ReplyDeleteChillout dude. You're living the American dream.
If everybody was so sure that Anderson was going to win 38 games
ReplyDeleteWe weren't. But its not about Anderson.
Its about giving a 4-year contract to a 35+ goalie
One with spotty results [to be generous] since the lock-out.
One who had played 42 games the previous season, and you're going to want him to play 60+.
For certain, I think Souray is justified in his feelings IF what was reported was true. On a comical note, here's how Kenny Williams dealt with Frank Thomas in a similar situation. Take a note Tambo:
ReplyDeleteByline: Chicago TribuneChicago Tribune
CHICAGO -- Ken Williams general manager of the Chicago White Sox finally broke his silence Sunday and fired back after the latest shot from departed slugger Frank Thomas.
He's an idiot," Williams said of Thomas in a 6-1/2-minute interview laced with profanity. "He's selfish. That's why we don't miss him. And we've held it in for far too long. And if you go out there and look long and hard enough, you'll find particulars. But I've got something to say directly to him. And I'm holding back as much as I can because, unlike him, I'll say it man-to-man ... "
Williams was angered by a recent story in the suburban Daily Southtown in which Thomas reiterated his disappointment with the White Sox for the way his departure this winter was handled, suggested he should have been traded after the 2000 season and questioned long-term deals given recently to Paul Konerko and Jon Garland because they didn't have the longevity of other White Sox stars who were later dealt.
"More upsetting to me than his comments directed at me are the comments at the organization and at [chairman] Jerry Reinsdorf," Williams said. "Jerry doesn't deserve that, especially in regards to Frank. Jerry has done everything over the course of 16 years to protect that man, to make accommodations for him, concessions for him, loaned him money at times when he needed money. And for him to forget that, for him to turn his back on that, is a crying shame."
Williams wasn't done criticizing Thomas.
"Believe me, it's not easy to deal with an idiot," Williams said. "And this man, over the course of the years, has tried my patience and tried it and tried it, and if he were any kind of a man, would quit talking about things in the paper and return a phone call or come knock on somebody's door."
Williams admitted he has grown weary of Thomas' bitterness over his departure after the team acquired ex-Philadelphia slugger Jim Thome.
"We don't miss the attitude; we don't miss the whining," Williams said. "We don't miss it.
"Good riddance. See you later."
The often-injured Thomas, 37, joined the Oakland Athletics last month.
"He's an Oakland A's problem," Williams said. "He needs to be concerned about Oakland. I don't even know why I'm talking about [the] guy. Play two or three games in a row first before you start popping off."
Let the earth scroching truly begin.
Aas a fan I think I have been treated unfairly by the organization. I have been a fan of this team for almost 3 decades, I put in my time, but I can no longer stand the shoddy treatement I am getting. I have emailed Tambellini and asked that he trade me to some other team.
ReplyDeletePlease trade me to a contender!
//Was it David Rohlfs that said he hadn't heard from the organziation in a year?//
ReplyDeleteThere are some pretty strict rules for NCAA eligibility on scholarship.
Pro teams talking to college players without permission of their college organizations might get one into a lot of trouble.
I have emailed Tambellini and asked that he trade me to some other team. Please trade me to a contender!
ReplyDeleteBookie: Let the trades be your guide. The Erstwhile Oilers are a fun team to follow in the post-season. There's usually a full roster or so of them that make the playoffs somewhere around the league, with a couple of them in the Finals, so there's always a rooting interest. There's usually even a Cup winner or two, e.g.
2009 Bill Guerin, Miro Satan, Mathieu Garon
2008 Daniel Cleary, Kirk Maltby
2007 Todd Marchant, CFP (not!)
2006 Ray Whitney, Doug Weight (say what!)
...
//I still don't get the backlash against Souray. If any of what he says is true about management asking him to play injured and not keeping in touch with him while injured, he's absolutely right to criticize the organization. Both behaviors are unprofessional.//
ReplyDeleteNo. Souray is being schizophrenic. He blames Lowe and MacT for meddling in his medical treatment when he signed with the Oilers, and he is blaming Tambellini for not meddling in his medical treatment for his broken wrist.
If Tambellini would hav ehown interest, based on previous history, wouldn't that have been seen by Souray as putting pressure on him to return quicker. Tambellini just left Souray to the doctors, which is what Souray also claims he wanted from Lowe and MacT.
One possible reason why Souray went public is that his no movement clause has expired, which means he has to devalue himself now if he wants to end up at one of his preferred destinations. Souray wants to play in LA. LA and Anaheim might be willing to take his contract, but they might not be willing to trade anything for it.
ReplyDeleteAnother reason is that he may be angling for a buyout. Neither Anaheim or LA will trade for him, so he has to be a UFA to end up there.
I read this a couple things don't add up.
ReplyDeleteSouray was pissed because management pushed him to play early. Ok this may have happened.
So Mr Souray decides that late in losing game that it was good time to break his hand on Iggy's head. Ok then he goes on to say he heard from the the trainers etc on how it was going. But never heard from management.
Could it be that it was known after incident 1 the management said fuck this we are going to let the doctors and training staff handle this. So the asset does not feel pressure to play?
I liked Souray thought he was C material but maybe he was'nt. I know that my companies senior management does not call me to see how I feel when I am off sick. They allow the HR dept if it is LTD. But what do I know ...I hope we get expiring contracts and picks for Souray.
Now, it might be a bit selfish to ask for a trade after calling out management as being unprofessional dicks. Granted. But that's a pretty understandable self-ishness. If I decided my company was run by dicks, I'd tell them and give them a chance to change, if they didn't change, I'd go public with my criticisms. Obviously, at that point, they'd want me gone and I'd want to be gone. It's all mutual.
ReplyDeleteThe part that makes this a poor parallel is that you could quit your work and look for a new job with a different company any time. Souray, realistically, can't.
(I mean, he could file retirement papers with the NHL and then go get work in the construction industry or something, but that seems unlikely.)
There are some pretty strict rules for NCAA eligibility on scholarship.
ReplyDeletePro teams talking to college players without permission of their college organizations might get one into a lot of trouble.
The rules you are thinking about do not apply to hockey because drafted players can still play NCAA. In sports like basketball and Football they cannot play NCAA after being drafted.
Great! If Riley Nash signs, he can stay in Souray's basement.
ReplyDeleteWhat is blurry in those situations is that we will never know the entire truth.
ReplyDeleteUnless management leaks like a broken barrage.
I agree, FPB.
ReplyDeleteHowever we can surmise that Souray did this with some foreknowledge that it would lessen his trade value.
We can't be certain of his reasons, despite the article, but there is a trend there of players/agents/agent's buddies shooting the Oil in the back on the way out of Dodge City.
And Tambo ain't James Arness. He might not even be Ken Curtis.
The question is why.
If he does he should be sent away the most humiliating way possible.
ReplyDeleteOKC or like... against future considerations.
Or even against something like
''1 Dollar, a pile of hockey sticks'' (Already happened)
If he wanted to be in California so bad, then he should have acted like a reasonable man, and not a money whore.
''1 Dollar, a pile of hockey sticks'' (Already happened)
ReplyDeleteNot a legal trade under the new CBA.
Smoke?????. The forest burned down in a massive inferno while Lowe/Tambo/Pender waddled around with water buckets and baffled looks on their faces. "Gee things didn't go as well as we planned" they muttered - no f**king kidding.
ReplyDeleteThere is only one solution.......fire.....everyone. Gotta start fresh a make a stellar first hire for GM-President of Hockey Operations. If you choose the right guy - he will choose the right guys beneath him - who will choose the right guys beneath him etc etc. Virtuous cycle as opposed to the cycle of death/ineptitude we are now engaged in.
Edmonton has enough handicaps related to location and climate to deal with - adding in a total management clusterf**k makes it a black hole for players other than those looking for wild overpays above anything else. Example: Khabibulin, N. If the same clowns are running the show next fall I’m not going to waste my time on this franchise - it’s pointless. Christ even EIG would not put up with this
Steve: What would be the lowest legal thing?
ReplyDeleteIf i could i would trade him against the complete collection of the ''Smurfs'' comic books.
The Edmonton Oilers management group are not a group that heavily values their relationship with players.
ReplyDeleteLT; I think you hit it on that comment. The mgmt has to take into account what the players and the coaches think. Mind you it'll been they'll need a good BS filter because there will be a lot of it, but you have to make everyone on the team feel like they are apart of the team, not just a hired employee.
All this Lowe & Tambi man-hate misses some of the point. Souray has an odd history with teams. He was deemed expendable in New Jersey and shipped to Montreal, only to watch his former team go all the way. I wonder what they knew about him that they wanted him gone.
ReplyDeleteThen Souray didn't want to return to Montreal to play. Now he doesn't like Edmonton. Maybe the smoke we're all talking about is not coming from the Oilers head office at all.
All this Lowe & Tambi man-hate misses some of the point. Souray has an odd history with teams. He was deemed expendable in New Jersey and shipped to Montreal, only to watch his former team go all the way. I wonder what they knew about him that they wanted him gone.
ReplyDeleteThen Souray didn't want to return to Montreal to play. Now he doesn't like Edmonton. Maybe the smoke we're all talking about is not coming from the Oilers head office at all.
Three teams in 12 years isn't exactly the kind of thing that sets off the alarm bells to me. Four straight years out of the playoffs on the other hand....
Souray has a point about the way the org handles their business but shouldn't someone dig up his old comments around the time he signed because doesn't this latest quip seem a little bit like lying?
ReplyDeleteIt's a strange and interesting situation that began with a contract that wasn't universally panned only because some people don't watch hockey played by teams other than the Oilers or they'll defend albertans or anyone who'll sign here.
Here you go, Dennis.
ReplyDelete... I think...
:-)
habsinsideout.com
L8r
Louise
nothing like the annual kick in the face for oiler fans. management will stay. souray will still get paid. it may not have been about us but we're still stuck watching this crapfest.
ReplyDeletei love the oilers...because i hate my self.
Looking at those quotes again is interesting. Overally, he speaks quite positively about the Canadiens and their management. But the issues he does bring up have a familiar ring to it.
ReplyDeleteThe only contact the player says he had with the Canadiens between April 9 and the end of May was the club inquiring about his left shoulder, which was arthroscopically repaired on April 20.
“My injuries were becoming a problem with them,” Souray said. “They wanted me to be healed before they made any decisions. That was a funny thing, because I’ve played my whole career with injuries. I played a month with a broken wrist, I played in the playoffs with a dislocated shoulder. I don’t think my injuries were ever anything that hindered my performance. I dealt with them and we moved on.
“But the (contract) talk wasn’t so much, ‘We want this guy, how can we get him on our team?’ It was, ‘Well, he’s injured.’ So right away, the feeling was more negative than positive.”
...
“By that point, I think it was done (with Montreal),” Souray said. “There was no urgency to jump on it. So much and so little had happened with Montreal from April to the beginning of July, my attitude had changed.
“You’re getting offers from other teams and (on July 2) Montreal says, ‘Take it or leave it,’ after they had been turned down by other free agents. I had plenty of options at that point, and it seemed I was more Plan E or Plan F for the Canadiens at this point.”
8am media availability tomorrow. Should be interesting!
ReplyDeleteI imagine one of the first questions Tambellini will be asked is "Have you spoken to Sheldon?"
ReplyDeleteThe answer is going to very telling.
So 44 is a bit of a self centered prima donna, and the Oilers management is aloof, distant and Lowe is incompetent at anything other than playing defense.
ReplyDeleteSounds about right.
It's difficult to read what he said when he left Montreal (thanks for the link IceDragoon) and see the prima donna that some are alleging Souray is. What is portrayed is an athlete with a healthy ego and a sense of entitlement typical of today's players, who had hoped to stay in Montreal but believed they weren't as aggressive in their pursuit of him as they should have been. I didn't sense any bitterness or anger in his comments. He expressed disappointment in those interviews conducted in 2007, but he continued to say good things about the Montreal organization as a whole.
ReplyDeleteHaving reviewed the 2007 articles quite frankly left me believing that much of what he says is truthful, even if there is a self-serving tone to them (consistent, as I've said, with many pampered, overpaid athletes with a strong sense of entitlement and certainly not unique to Souray).
And his comments are pretty consistent with what we've read elsewhere (including at C&B). How often have we heard players, and prospects, comment on how little direction they get from staff - how they're unsure of their place or role in the organization.
Introductory management courses speak about how important communication is. A phone call or even an e-mail or two can go a long way towards preventing small problems from turning into something much larger, to ensuring that motivated employees don't turn into malcontents. A phone call from Tambellini or Lowe might have taken all of, what, ten minutes out of their day. I don't expect a phone call every time I'm sick, but if I'm off long term (i.e. a few months), I'd be upset if no supervisor or manager contacted me.
When the Oilers were shipping players like Weight out of town because we couldn't afford to keep them, I can't recall any of them saying a bad thing about management, the city or the fans. Edmonton wasn't viewed as a team of last resort for hockey players, we didn't attract many FA's because we couldn't afford them not because they didn't want to play here.
As long as this obviously incompetent management group stays in place, the Oilers will be going nowhere.
Any chance that the organization was already aware of his desire for a trade and was trying to grant it to him before he got hurt? That Spector made this into a bigger story than it needed to be? Or is the common perception of this story really as it is?
ReplyDeleteAnd what the hell, the Oilers nominated Jason Strudwick over Fernando Pisani for the Bill Masterton? Are they aware of the state of his ulcerative colitis?
ReplyDeleteAny chance that the organization was already aware of his desire for a trade and was trying to grant it to him before he got hurt?
ReplyDeleteI think that's a near certainty.
So, Souray played the entire '06-'07 season with a bum shoulder and yet calls out the Oilers for having him play on that same bum shoulder AFTER 5 months off?? Really??
ReplyDeleteI call BS on Souray because he had no problem playing through the pain in his contract year and then phoning it in once he got his money.
There's a big difference between playing through the pain and interrupting rehab early. Playing through the pain, most of the time, the damage has been done, and there's not necessarily much more that can be done to make it wore. The trainer tapes and braces, and you do what you can. The problem with playing through the pain is that it limits your range of motion and strength, and thus your overall effectiveness, plus the pain itself will result in some apprehension, no matter how tough you are. Whereas with rehab following surgery, you've had soft tissue torn up, cut up, and reattached. It needs time to knit together properly, and you need time after that in order to restore normal strength, range of motion, and proprioception (internal sense of position and speed in a joint or segment). This has to be done slowly and carefully, under the supervision of a trained professional, in order to prevent aggravation or recurrence of the injury, making the six-month period for shoulder surgery essentially non-negotiable.
As for the fight and the shoulder, yeah, he shouldn't have done that, but if management is already questioning your manhood enough for you to return, isn't it plausible that they also questioned it enough to make him feel compelled to fight? Remember "team toughness?" Really, though, Souray should've just told Lowe et al. to stuff it and see through his rehab. That would've actually been manning up and doing the right thing.
Finally, anyone who says Souray is being a prima donna is half right. Yes, he was very self-serving in how he went about this, but these people have sent guys back on the ice a game or two after a concussion. That's not just stupid, that's borderline criminal. Second impact syndrome may be rare, but it's a risk that need not be taken by a professional athlete.
No. Souray is being schizophrenic. He blames Lowe and MacT for meddling in his medical treatment when he signed with the Oilers, and he is blaming Tambellini for not meddling in his medical treatment for his broken wrist.
No, he's blaming Tambellini for not keeping in touch and finding out how he's progressing. Massive fucking difference.
Anyone see the MacKinnon piece in today's Journal saying that the Souray episode "has reinforced just how urgently the Oilers need to purge the locker-room of core players whose time as passes, younger players who have squandered their opportunities and a useful player like [Souray] who has so obviously lost the plot"?
ReplyDeleteYes, the Oilers need to purge some bad contracts, no doubt. But not a word about the urgency of purging the management who made so many horrid decisions? Episode #1045 in the incompetency of the Edmonton Journal.
Journalists aren't supposed to ask questions, silly.
ReplyDeleteAnd Tambi calls Souray a liar:
ReplyDeletehttp://oilers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=525327&cmpid=oilers-twt-nhl_oilers
My stance is that Tambellini wasn't here when Stoll came back from his "broken nose" after just one game and then missed the rest of the year with a concussion suffered on a routine play.
ReplyDelete